Can someone help with slot-in filter systems?

[barnaby_harding1]

<p>I understand how the systems work, but really need advice on which system will be best for my kit.<br>

Here is the situation!<br>

Rebel XTi<br>

Canon 18-55 IS<br>

Canon 50 f1.8 Mark 1<br>

Tamron 70-300 Di Macro LD II? (I think that's what it's called from memory!)</p>

<p>I am looking for a slot-in filter system that offers quality but for a fairly reasonable price - quality and durability are more important to me than budget, but to a point!</p>

<p>I have heard that Lee holders and Hitech filters offer a good starting point but am open to ALL suggestions!</p>

 

[philip_tam]

<p>If your widest is a 18mm, really there's no reason not to use the Cokin P holder. It's plastic and the attachment rings are metal. I really can't see how there would be a durability problem with the holder. You will go a long, long time without breaking one. If you break one, they're cheap to replace. I think you can't break enough in a lifetime to surpass the cost of a Lee holder.</p>

<p>Filters are a bit more worrisome. Hitech filters are fine, but any resin filter you buy (even the expensive ones) will scratch if they're not handled carefully.</p>

<p>Cokin P should be fine though... the only reason I would go for a more expensive holder is if I was worried about vignetting at angles wider than 14mm. But since you have an 18-55 you'll be fine.</p>

[jean_yves_mead]

Something to bear in mind is that, while resin filters are prone to scratching if not treated with care, the

Cokin P filters - and especially their Kood counterparts - are pretty cheap to replace.

[david_henderson]

<p>All the affordable brands of rectangular filters are made from the same CR39 optical resin- like spectacles. They all scratch unless you are consistently very careful with them and put them away right after use. The scratches are generally pretty fine and don't affect your pictures visibly, but the time will come when you want to replace them. Most people use rectangular filter systems only for grads so that you can place the transition line where you need it. Polarisers and other stuff are generally bought as round screw-ins. This means you don't have to go through the hassle of attaching rings holders and filters each time you want to polarise, and a round filter will be made from glass and will be more durable.</p>

<p>The bigger brands, in ascending order of price are Cokin/Kood/Hitech/Lee/Singh Ray. A lot of people avoid cokin filters because the quite often seem to show colour casts . But be aware that the other brands are not immune from that. I use hitech from Formatt, based in Wales; but then I send back for replacement any filter that doesn't look acceptably neutral.</p>

<p> </p>

[jpo3136b]

<blockquote>

<p>All the affordable brands of rectangular filters are made from the same CR39 optical resin- like spectacles.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CR-39<br /> Compare:<br /> http://www.adorama.com/LEDSLRK.html , a hard plastic resin drop in filter kit for near $350.<br /> http://www.adorama.com/LEBWSET.html , a polyester gel kit near $60.<br /> Both from the same manufacturer. Different materials used in the filters themselves.</p>

<p>I have used that second one, for $60. It's a good kit, and offers an interesting advantage: the filter gels themselves are just a square of the same polyvinyl used in lighting gels. These are available for a couple square feet per roll; so, replacement is easy. You'd end up, in the long run, paying out about the same amount (maybe over a lifetime); but, if you were careful with your supplies, they would last just as long. A key point to keeping those cheaper ones in good shape would be to keep the box they come in, and use that to carry them around.</p>

<p>The Lee polyvinyl filters snap into the holder because there is a small, thin frame around the gels to hold them flat. These frames snap apart and together (not a manufacturer's recommended practice, but they do) just like a fragile plastic toy. This makes the gels re-load-able.</p>

<p>If that procedure doesn't work for someone, it only takes a brief moment to make another gel-holder to size out of some matboard. No biggie.</p>

<p>So, for those, $60 to get you started, about $5 (base price) per roll of color that you want. The polarizing filters, purchased in this form are more expensive, about three or four times as much. Typically, you would get 24"X24" to a roll (or similar). You only need 4" square at a time. This is convenient for when you're buying the same old colors to go over lamps or strobes anyway.</p>

<p>The CR-39 ones, like David was writing about above, really are like spectacle blanks. They'll be a hard plastic; probably more durable as far as outright breaking goes (note the material was invented for use in WWII bombers; to hold fuel, so it'll be chemically very stable and physically tough).</p>

<p>That $60 kit is what I'd recommend to someone who is interested in getting started with black and white films. It's under $100, can be maintained for years at a low cost, and does the job right. It has one vulnerability: the whole thing is held on by the friction of a rubber band used sideways. This may make the product seem like a joke to some people; who wouldn't expect a metal fitting; but aside from having the filter drop a couple of times, of really no concern otherwise.</p>

<p>Keep in mind, the "gel filter holders" and the drop-in systems will look similar on an internet web page ad; but, examined on hand, would quickly show their structural differences.</p>

<p>So, I think if you wonder why does the Lee filter holder get recommended for beginners when the more expensive drop-in systems suddenly leap up to a couple hundred dollars per; well, it's structure and materials. It's all good; but it'll be different.</p>

<p>However, keep in mind also, cost accrual over time. If you end up getting a filter kit, try to get one that is as good and wide as you could need, and then maybe use step-rings to secure the fitting better if you have to (for threaded fittings).</p>

<p>I say this because, if you do the math, you will see that it is easy to take several lens barrel diameters, times number of filter colors wanted, times the number of filter holders required (hopefully near "1" for drop in kits): to yield the sum of filter cost, net.</p>

<p>Now, how good does the $60 kit look? If you're a beginner, it can be a great choice. I assert, as a hypothetical exercise, that a lot of us could go window shopping at some of these Internet stores and quickly rack up a huge bill just by clicking on some ads for filters. Keep in mind, too, that lots of times one doesn't need everything; we just use whatever's no-fuss, and carry on with it.</p>

<p>So, when evaluating those systems, I would suggest keeping something like that in mind. If your heart's set on hard plastic, instead of gel filters, the bill is going to go up, fast. Meanwhile, nothing's foolproof.</p>

<p>All in, for a beginner, I would suggesting with the $60 gel kit if you like black and white. Some screw-on filters for protection and polarizers. A step-ring kit to make it all work together. With the filter sizes chosen near whatever's biggest: I have most of my filters in either 49mm or 77mm. I make little use of the in-between sizes.</p>

<p>Consider this, too: the hard plastic kits will offer graduated filter capability. The grad filter, in hard plastic, probably gets dyed by dipping, just like sunglasses. When you get polyester off of a roll, the roll will all be one consistent color. So, the hard plastic kits may offer the chance to play with grads.</p>

<p>Still, for beginners, I would say Lee polyester filter, and a couple of rolls of poly lighting film in the color you desire. If you do some black and white work, with the filters, even in digital, you will learn more about calculating up the exposure to allow for filters and so on.</p>

<p>Try the Lee $60 kit. That'd be what I'd recommend before the $350-plus kits. With a handful of filters (at $75 to $125 each), that $350 kit could easily go to $750 or $1000.</p>

<p>So, sustainment costs for the polyvinyl gel kit will be $5 to $10 per replacement part, maybe once a year. Sustaining the hard plastic drop-in kit will be in increments of $125 to $150 per (part, shipping, etc.). Since I try to avoid suggesting beginners spend over $100 per new phase, I would (and have myself) chosen the polyvinyl kit for $60. </p>

<p>Keep in mind, if you later get paid for what you are doing, and you can't muster those sustainment or maintenance or repair costs, and there may be sometimes no other way around it; then, you're done. So, maintenance costs count in the long run. </p>

<p>A thousand dollars is a lot of money to spend on filter glass if you can't calculate the exposure with filter factor from memory, based on no meter reading. A beginner probably should build up the skills to effectively employ filters first, and then maybe go for the many-hundreds of dollars in accessories.</p>

<p>So, $60 Lee Black and White Polyester Filter kit.</p>

[JDMvW]

<p>Regardless of whether Cokin filters are "good enough for you" or not, their website has examples of nearly everything you could want to know about what are, for good historical reasons, generally called "Cokin-style" filters. (<a href="http://www.cokin.com/ico15-A.html">http://www.cokin.com/ico15-A.html</a>, for starters and then http://www.cokin.com/ico3-p0.html for the variety of different kinds of filters.)</p>

<p>For digital, I personally don't worry over much about some color variation in neutral, and it's moot for any other color. I have accumulated a bunch of these things from the old original size up to P-size as parts of lots, and I have trouble seeing any significant optical differences among various brands, even including inexpensive Chinese knock offs.<br>

Admittedly, if I were like some commercial landscape artists and used graduated neutral density filters in every danged shot I took, I'd be more choosy.</p>

[dan_south]

<p>The Cokin P holder is small and popular, but I use the Lee holder because it's wide and because it's configurable. With a screwdriver (included) you can trim the holder down from three slots to one or two. This is useful to minimize vignetting when using wide-angle lenses. Also, with digital capture I never use more than two filters at a time. To cut a Cokin P holder down to fewer than three slots you would have to use a saw on it.</p>

<p>The Lee system also has the advantage of recessed, wide-angle adapter rings. These work on most lenses and again help with the vignetting problem.</p>

<p>I use Lee and Singh-Ray filters: Lee for color correction when shooting film and Singh-Ray for graduated neutral density filters. It's also possible to mount Lee's 105 mm circular polarizing filter on the Lee holder in order to combine polarization with other filtration effects. The polarizer is large and a bit pricey but of high quality.</p>

[jean_yves_mead]

Cokin does make a single-slot wide-angle holder for the P system.

[dan_south]

Good to know!