M2 with RF patch anomaly

[john_robison3]

<p>I have just obtained my first Leica, an M2. It seems to be in generally good shape except for the RF patch. Although it is bright and in alignment and I have no difficulty focusing there appears to be some sort deterioration around the edges of the patch. I don't know if this is accumulated grime or more a serious deterioration of a front surface mirror or damage to a cemented prism assembly. I was wondering if anyone else has had experience with this sort of problem and it's resolution. I have seen references about M2 owners who have had M4 rangefinder assembles installed into their M2 bodies but I would think that would be a very costly item to replace as a unit. Any information would be very helpful.</p>

[robert_hooper1]

<p>Give <a href="http://www.sherrykrauter.com/contact.php">Sherry Krauter</a> a call. She can actually answer your question while we can only speculate. She can also correct that issue and any other problems your "new" M2 may have. </p>

[paul_wheatland]

<p>Youxin Ye in Canton, MA is my recommendation. He installed a brand new beam splitter in my Leica II. He found a source and is skillful in cutting and fitting the splitter. He's been mentioned in a positive vein on this and other forums. His specialty is all rangefinder Leica both screw and M mount, all phases of CLA and restoration of cosmetics. He does not normally involve himself in lens restoration, mainly bodies, shutters and rangefinders as well as vulcanite replacement. He's honest, reasonable, timely and capable. Talk to him, evenings.</p>

[Gus Lazzari]

<p>John, are the bright lines for the framing showing a lot of debris build-up in them? That frame mask has a clear center, and haze combined with dust debris can create that symptom.</p>

<p>Coupled with a complete & comprehensive service, this delicate bit of cleaning should take care of the issue.<br>

(<strong>See the picture</strong> of an M rangefinder unit just before a cleaning. The "bronze" bar in the middle, secured by two wide screws holds this layered mask assembly)</p>

<p>Most M bodies are pretty hearty at this stage of their age, unless your M2 has been subjected to poor storage, it should just be accumulation not deterioration. Leica II thread mount camera bodies have a lot more age on them.</p><div></div>

[john_robison3]

<p>Thanks, I see they are both back east so I'll give them a try Monday.</p>

<p>Re; Gus, The frame lines are bright and clear, only the actual RF patch shows the lines and what looks like darkening around the edges. The little black lines in the RF patch look almost like cracking of the first surface aluminizing.</p>

[vilk_inc]

<p>like this?<br /><br /><img src="http://www.vilk.net/upload/IMG_1603d.jpg" alt="" width="531" height="339" /></p>

[john_robison3]

<p>Re; Vilk Inc,<br>

Yes, somewhat. Not all vertical and shorter segments of lines with a light brownish staining around the edges of the patch, uneven but complete. How did you manage to get that picture? Did you just use a macro lens through the viewfinder eyepiece?</p>

[vilk_inc]

<p>i borrowed a ten-cent digicam for a minute. not sure about macro--the patch is probably designed for a comfortable apparent distance, a metre or so... let's hope someone can shed some light on this mystery!<br /><br />:)</p>

[john_robison3]

<p>Well folks, here is the follow up on this story and it's not good news. Called Sherry and the first thing she asked was for the first three digits of the serial #. When I gave her the information she said send it back if I could as there was no repair parts for this early M2 RF assembly. She suggested I look out for a later M2 with lever rewind. I sent an e-mail right away to the seller requesting return. His original listing said the rangefinder was bright and clear so he might not have looked carefully at it enough to notice the problem. He has a good e-bay reputation and says he accepts returns within 7 days so I hope there is no problem. Thing is, I would still like to get a Leica M but now think I'll have to be much more cautious.</p>

[paul_wheatland]

<p>As I mentioned earlier, speak with Youxin Ye just about any evening EDT as he sells Leicas that have been CLAed. I can personally recommend him as between my Leicas and a friend's, he has CLAed several for both of us with complete satisfaction with timeliness, skill and cost.</p>

[john_robison3]

<p>Final resolution was seller said he'll take back camera so I'll only be out shipping cost but that is unavoidable when dealing long distance. I was sorry for the seller too, he seems like a really nice person.</p>

[robert_hooper1]

<p>Hi John,</p>

<p>What is the serial number of the camera in question. I have an old M2 with the button rewind myself. No problems with the finder, thank goodness.</p>

[john_robison3]

<p>Robert, I already sent the camera back to the seller but I remember Sherry only asked for the first 3 digits, they are 948. According to the S# list at Stephen Gandy's Cameraquest site the camera was from a batch assembled at Midland, Canada in Dec, 1958. Sherry said that the RF in some of these early M2's was different than later M2 models and that the part it needed was no longer available. This was my very first attempt to purchase an M body and if it only needed a CLA I would keep it. I really love the very clean look of the M3 and M2. I wanted an M2 over an M3 because it has the frame for 35mm, my preferred walk around lens. I'll probably look for a newer M4-2 for practical reasons, parts still available and all that but it's sure is not as good looking as an M2. In fact, since I only intend to use it with normal to wide lenses I could get along fine with a CL, but I wonder if parts are a problem with those too.</p>

<p>It's really too bad some of these older cameras can't be brought back to life. Well, I suppose they can, but at breathtaking cost. I suppose i could have had the camera fixed if I was willing to spend a great deal of money.</p>

[john_robison3]

<p>After looking over my several post's about this matter I realized a very basic truth.</p>

<p>(What follows is an inner dialog with self)<br>

It has been rather stupid of me to decide I want a Leica and a couple of lenses and to then whine about the price! Yes! They are expensive, and for a reason. Get over it. If you want an interchangeable lens RF but are on the cheap side get a couple of Fed 2's, rebuild them yourself, and shut up with the 'oh so expensive talk'.</p>

<p>There, I feel better now.</p>

<p> </p>

[robert_hooper1]

<p>Hi John,</p>

<p>I just checked my Leica M2 (button rewind) and the serial number is 936464. Sherry Krauter CLA'd it last year and there was no problem with the viewfinder patch or viewfinder in general. I guess I was very lucky with this eBay find. I wondered why the bidding was so low on this camera. I was focusing on the no dings, brassing, or scratches part of the description. The seller did say the finder was a little hazy, but I had already decided to have it CLA'd anyway. Had I known about the potential unfixable viewfinder/patch issue, I never would have bid. However, now I have an almost new looking early M2 and didn't even know how fortunate I was until reading this thread.</p>

[john_boyle3]

<p>I bought my button-rewind M2, sn 938817, used around 1972 and have never had any problems with it. My new 1967 M4 developed some viewfinder separation after a few years and the finder was replaced with an M2 finder with M4 frame lines. Both cameras had recent CLAs by Gerry Smith at Kindermann Canada and are in excellent condition. Problems with Leicas seem to center around the individual camera rather than with the whole model line. Mine were both made in Wetzlar. If I could have only one it would be the M2. </p>