about photography workshops

[dumitru_dabija]

<p>hi,<br>

am just curious to see your opinion about photo workshops that involve a lot of photographers. There are some offers outthere for some incredible locations, my only concern is that they all involve a lot of photographers on site - around 60 people or more! Just want to hear your opinion on how feasible that ends up to be, especially if you've already participated in such a workshop would love to hear from you.<br>

Right now I'm hesitating registering for a workshop in Antarctica even though it's my dream to go there, simply because I'm a bit reluctant knowing that the place will be stacked with photographers, there are 77 places available, so probably there will be at least 50 photographers, plus the guides... quite a party.<br>

So does it tend to be a problem or not, I really don't know what to expect, I've never tried photographing a subject (or subjects) together with other 60+ people... It may well be that there are plenty of subjects for everyone to chose from, but I'd still like very much to hear the opinions of othrs who have participated before...<br>

thanks a lot</p>

<p>Dumitru</p>

[aplumpton]

<p>There are workshops and workshops. Unfortunately, my sole experience was unconvincing as the leader did not communicate all that much to the group and the structure of the workshop did not stretch the capabilities of the participants enough. I would be careful about subscribing to another, wanting to know how prior participants felt beforehand.</p>

<p>On the other hand I have benefitted from excellent lectures at major photographic meets (Ex: Camera Canada College's yearly meet) and at the better camera clubs in my region. Also, the place of the workshop is often of lesser importance than the value of the photographic approaches studied.</p>

[JDMvW]

<p>I feel that there are workshops and there are workshops, as Arthur says. This is not a bad thing.<br /> I went on one of the photo mentoring trips to Egypt sponsored by Nikon and <em>Popular Photography</em> and it was terrific from my point of view. The two photographers and the other staff were real professionals and were there for people who wanted more direction, but mostly the "trek" made all the arrangements, got you to the sites in comfort and safety, and let you shoot your heart out. It was wonderful. Most of the participants were amateur (and some not so amateur) photographers with long histories, top equipment (much of it Canon, by the way) and pretty impressive portfolios.</p>

<p>If, on the other hand, you want or need detailed handholding guidance, I'm not sure that it makes sense to try to be too ambitious on the destination. There are many good, small training programs all over the world, and a little investigation will reveal which of them provide the level of guidance and direction you desire.</p>

[dumitru_dabija]

<p>hi, am most worried about the number aspects... having more than 50 photographers in one location, doesn't pose a problem...?</p>

[brien_szabo]

<p>Workshops with big numbers of people aren't really workshops as photo tours with lectures and a possible fly by or two of the host asking you how you are doing (maybe a touch more than that but not much). If you are looking for some personal instruction, it will be tough getting something like that in a big group. If you are an experienced photographer who knows what he/she is doing and can pick things up from the group community, then that kind of workshop may be well suited for you. </p>

[harold_motte]

<p>You do not say specifically what you hope to get out of this workshop other than go to Antartica.<br>

You can expect a lot of other photographers to be getting in your way, all shooting the same thing in the same places at athe same time. You will have no control of where to go or when to go there.<br>

You can expect not to get much individual attention or instruction or tips unless you are very lucky.<br>

I have been on three such workshops with half as many people and spent hundreds of dollars to do each one and found that I should have gone on my own and I could have gone where I wanted, when I wanted at the times I wanted and gotten just as much out of the trip....and for a lot less money.<br>

I enjoyed one of them due to the others in the group being very polite and helpful but I never got what I thought I was supposed to get from the intstructors.<br>

I have since found local gudes in the areas I wanted to go to from the local chambers of commerce and from the local pro photographers in the areas who helped me as being guides or providing the resources I needed.<br>

IF this workshop is providing all you need for it to provide and you are satisfied with the price, then go.<br>

Best of luck,<br>

Harold</p>

<p> </p>

[john_demott]

<p>I recently watched a video by Michael Reichmann featuring a photography tour he led to Antarctica. In the video he commented about the problem of there being too many "yellow penguins" in the way of the photography...yellow penguins were all the tour participants wearing yellow parkas. You know it is too crowded when even the tour leader complains about overcrowding. OTOH, there aren't many options for ways to photograph Antarctica unless you're working for National Geographic or similar, so a photo tour may be the best option if that is a location you want to visit. Judging by the video I saw, you should be sure to take your seasickness pills along.</p>

[dumitru_dabija]

<p>hi, thanks all for your input, is greatly appreciated. I'm not looking for a lot of guidance, just the means to get there at the right times and in the right places for photography. Usually i would go on my own, I've been so far by myself in the himalayas, patagonia etc and didn't have any issues, but antarctica I think is a lot harder to get to. but it may well be is worth looking into the options<br>

Again, my concern is with the number of people that are trying to photograph basically the same things, ti can be very frustrating... I know about M Reichmann photo tour, this one is similar, led by Art Wolfe</p>

<p>thanks a lot</p>

[julieroggow]

<p>Our photo tours normally are restricted to a maximum of 8 participants. We like to work with the small groups and can give more attention to individual needs. Because we concentrate on wildlife viewing tours, having a large group would be counter-productive to keeping the animals comfortable and accessible. If you'd like to see a sample of our upcoming photo shoot tours (Alaska Bear & Wildlife Photo Shoot), I believe you can click on my name and be directed to our website. Just hit the "travel specials" tab to see the flyer. The tour info will also appear in the Fall issue of "Nature Photographer" magazine.<br>

Julie Roggow</p>

[david_burren2]

<p>Dumitru, did you end up going on that voyage? To answer your original question...</p>

<p>No I don't think you'd have a problem. Yes at times it can get a bit crowded at the rail when there's some stunning whale action in a particular direction, etc, but some vessels are better for this than others. When cruising past scenery and icebergs there should be enough room for everyone to spread out. When travelling to/from shore you're in a zodiac-style boat with up to 9-11 others, and if there are photo ops on the way (icebergs, animals) this is usually manageable (e.g. one side squats, the other stands - under the control of your driver of course!). When you're on shore you do get to spread out a bit, and it's such a "target-rich environment" that I'm not aware of anyone getting frustrated by being cramped.</p>

<p>60-70 photographers should be fine (depending on the ship's facilities I suppose). Just make sure you're not on a ship with >100 passengers as your landing options will be restricted. I was on Michael Reichmann's 2009 Antarctic trip (~75 photogs), have done quite a few nautical photo trips to other destinations, and am one of two leaders on a photography trip back to South Georgia and Antarctica this coming November ( http://antarctica2010.com ). On this voyage we're going on a smaller (54 passengers) vessel, but that's partly to make sure we (the instructors) can provide great service to everyone, not to deliberately limit the group size because of cramping.</p>

<p>I must say, when you've got lots of photographers together with whales breaching nearby, the machine-gun staccato of the shutters is quite impressive!<br>

__<br>

David</p>

[david_henderson]

<p>I wouldn't go on any photo tour where I felt that I couldn't get a prime spot,whenever I wanted it, or where I couldn't just decide to change position easily. The trips I went on in the 1990's were never more than a dozen and sometimes less. Even so, the more people in a group, the more time consuming it becomes to get them into and out of places, and the more time you will waste. With 50 people, the chances of a couple getting back late or sleeping in and holding up the entire group, are very high and it can be frustrating. iComments like </p>

 

<blockquote>

<p>it can get a bit crowded at the rail when there's some stunning whale action</p>

 

</blockquote>

<p>would be more than enough to scare me off. The way I feel now I wouldn't be prepared to go on any "tour" that relied on organised transport as I don't want to be hanging around a hotel at dawn because the bus doesn't come till 8; nor do I want to get back to a hotel at 6pm because we "have to be fair to the bus driver". Both these things have happened to me even on relatively small tours. </p>

<p>With a large tour you have to cope with a host of different motivations. Some might be serious photographers out to get great shots day long. Others see it as tourism with a camera. You might find it frustrating to be on a trip where half the group are actually quite happy to get back to the hotel around 6 for a nice cup of tea and a leisurely shower before dinner, which then happens to coincide with a glorious evening light.</p>

<p>Access to tuition is another issue. Whilst you may be happy to be deposited in the right place at the right time , there will be others on the tour who behave like "groupies" and rarely leave the side of the great man, absorbing every second of their time often with questions that could be as easily asked on the bus, at the hotel, or anywhere but at a location when several people typically need guidance now on issues connected with the current location. If you're in the latter category you can spend a deal of time hanging around and waiting for help .</p>

<p>Then there is "getting in the way". Even with a small number of participants there is often someone who (quite rightly in many respects) doesn't want to shoot from the line of photographers at the "vantage point". Some of these have no idea about the extent to which their actions affect others and some frankly don't care. "I'll only be a minute" they'll yell after already preventing ten people from shooting these last five minutes. </p>

<p>The final issue faced is that a surprising number of people turn up on a photo tour with new equipment they don't know how to use. Believe me, you do not want to be hanging around whilst some guy fiddles with a 10" x 8" he bought last week , or whilst someone fiddles with a shift lens that offers him fifteen different framings for the same photograph . Both of these things have happened to me.</p>

<p>In general I found it much harder to get good photographs on tours than by going it alone or with one or two others. I would only contemplate a tour if it were a location that I couldn't possibly risk doing alone, if it undertook to have you out and about from pre-dawn to dusk (with maybe a break in the middle) and if the group were small enough to be nimble, and if we were all there with compatible aims and motivations. </p>

[dumitru_dabija1]

<p>Hello,</p>

<p>Thanks to all of you for your valuable advice, I think going solo is the way to go :)</p>