What digital compact in the pocket of a serious amateur?

[ripraprob]

<p>Hi all<br>

Sometimes I just can't be bothered taking my DSLR with me, but I don't want to be without a camera.<br>

The camera in my cell phone just doesn't give me the quality I want, and the control (exposure etc.) that I sometimes wants to have.<br>

So; what digital compact should I buy?</p>

<p>Here is my preferences:</p>

<ul>

<li>Small. No point buying something that can't fit in a pocket.</li>

<li>Optical quality, but not necessarily a lot of pixel. Anything from 5 Mpixel will do *) </li>

<li>Program, A, S and M settings. I don't care for a lot of 'Scene Programs'.</li>

<li>Some zoom would be nice. I prefer wide angle over tele (and I'm talking optical zoom, of course). My secret dream is 24 mm at the wide end but 28 mm will do. </li>

<li>The ability to make small video clips - YouTube style. </li>

<li>Batteries: I would prefer using standard AA or AAAs over LiIon (just buy new batteries if I'm out of juice), but this is not a must.</li>

</ul>

<p>I'm not religious about the brand, but I would prefer one of the bigger more known brands. My DSLR is a Nikon, but I like the fact that you can 'hack' the firmware on Canon's digital compact cameras and get access to features like RAW, interval shooting etc.<br>

*) It doesn't have to be a new camera or state of the art. I'm ready to buy 2nd hand.</p>

<p>Any input appreciated.<br>

Thanks :o)</p>

<p>/Rob, Denmark</p>

[luis_g]

<p>Fuji F30 (discontinued)</p>

<p>Fuji F31 (discontinued)</p>

<p>Fuji F100fd (Still available new from B&H/Adorama)</p>

<p>Fuji 200 EXR</p>

<p> Why the Fujis? Because they all have usable higher ISOs, up to 800.</p>

<p> </p>

[Spearhead]

<p>I have the F30 and would never recommend it to anyone. The card format is xD, a very problematic type of card that can be easily wiped out when trying to read by some readers. I believe the F31 uses the same card. Also, I don't think anyone is developing new xD cards so the densities are lower and the prices higher than the standard SD cards almost every other compact uses.</p>

<p>The Lumix LX3 does everything you want and does it well. It's a bit pricey, but it may be worth it to you for the image quality.</p>

<p> </p>

[robert lee]

<p>The Canon A series compacts are quite good. Find a model that will support the open source CHDK firmware additions. This vastly expands the camera's native capabilities, including RAW (or DNG) capture.</p>

[Brad_]

I use an LX3 and like it a lot.

[ripraprob]

<p>Thank you for your answers this far.<br>

@Jeff: I think I've head about the problems with xD cards before. I think I should look for something that uses some kind of SD card.<br>

@Louis: The F100fd doesn't have Aperture and shutter priority modes.<br>

@Robert: Yeah, it's the CHDK firmware I was thinking about, when I mentioned the possibility of 'hacking' the firmware :o)</p>

<p> </p>

[bill_tuthill]

No models meet your criteria. If you relax the AA battery requirement, 10 models do, <a href="http://www.dcresource.com/reviews/cameraList.php?search=1&manSearch=0&resSearch=0&lcdSearch=0&storageSearch=0&priceSearch=0&cameraTypeSearch=1&zoomSearch=0&lcdTypeSearch=0&batterySearch=0&HD_Movie_Search=Y&manCtrlSearch=Y&wideLensSearch=Y&popSearch=Y&submit.x=35&submit.y=3">assuming HD video and eliminating ones with electronic viewfinder</a> because they won't fit in your pocket.

[unca mikey]

<p>The Ricoh GX200 has 24mm at the wide end, great image quality, lots of manual controls, and will take AAAs besides proprietary batteries. It's not as small as the smallest, but has many great features, including wonderful interval shooting.</p>

[ripraprob]

<p>@Bill: Thanks for that link. Very usefull. Just for the record, I didn't specify HD video, but I'll modify your link/serch. Thanks again :o)</p>

[eric merrill]

<p>Robert:</p>

 

<blockquote>

<p>Small. No point buying something that can't fit in a pocket.</p>

 

</blockquote>

<p>How big is your pocket? Pants pocket or coat pocket?</p>

<p>The LX3 won't fit in a pants pocket, but might in a coat pocket. I'm happy enough with the quality I get that in decent light, I grab it to take quick photos even around the house rather than my DSLRS.</p>

<p>Eric</p>

[luis_g]

<p>How interesting, Jeff. I guess I have been extraordinarily lucky, in that all the time I used my F30, not once did I have <em>any </em> problem with any of my 4 memory cards (three different brands) and the two card readers I used over that time. Nor did my wife, or the two other people I know that have them. Nothing but clean data transfers without exception. If the cards work so badly, one can only wonder why the cameras still go for $250-300 -- used. But they don't go below 35mm at the wide end. The battery is good for 400+ exposures.</p>

<p>[Robert] "Small. No point buying something that can't fit in a pocket."</p>

<p>The LX3, good as it is, is the answer to a question the OP did not ask. It simply does not fit his primary requirement. Not even close. It is not a pocket camera of any kind. Way too big, except maybe for cargo pants and winterwear. Nor does it use AAs or AAAs.</p>

<p>[Robert] "The F100fd doesn't have Aperture and shutter priority modes"</p>

<p>True. I know, I, or my wife, have owned/own every camera I recommended. It works perfectly well for a P&S. The proper answer to your question is, to give up on some parameters, because as Bill remarked, there's no camera that meets <em>all</em> your requirements.</p>

<p>Strangely, clean high ISOs are not on your list. For a true pocket camera, specially coming from a DSLR, that's the thing you will miss the most. If you want/need that, as I do, then your choices narrow considerably, into less models than the fingers of one hand. You can always rely on the built-in flash, of course.</p>

<p>Good luck with your search, Robert.</p>

<p> </p>

[joshroot]

<p>You might find this article useful to compare three of the most common suggestions G10, LX3, GX200:</p>

<p>http://www.photo.net/equipment/prosumer-digital/lx3-g10-gx200-review</p>

[Brad_]

>>> The LX3, good as it is, is the answer to a question the OP did not ask. It simply does not fit his primary requirement.

Not even close. It is not a pocket camera of any kind. Way too big, except maybe for cargo pants and winterwear. Nor

does it use AAs or AAAs.

 

Actually it's a fine answer. Mine fits OK - jacket and vest pocket very easy; a little tight in jeans. And as he said AAs or AAAs are not a must. For

me it was superior image quality, fast RAW capture, and a 24mm f/2.0 lens. Also, the LiIon battery offers superior energy

capacity at a lower weight.

[bill_tuthill]

<p>YouTube videos have been HD for at least several months now. The Fuji F200EXR is the best low-light P&S camera on the market, perhaps the best of all time. It can't touch a DSLR however. The reason it does not make the above list is that it has shutter and aperture priority, but not manual focus.</p>

[joshroot]

<blockquote>

<p>Actually it's a fine answer. Mine fits OK - jacket and vest pocket very easy; a little tight in jeans.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>I call BOOOO on that Brad. You are arguing silly points. Sure you CAN stick the LX3 in your pants pocket. Just like you CAN eat dinner sitting on a beehive. That doesn't mean it's particularly comfortable or a real good idea. In addition, usually when people say "pocket camera" they don't mean "can I stick it in a jacket pocket". Hell, I can stick a DSLR in some jacket pockets I have. They want to be able to carry it with them easily everywhere. Which typically means pants or shirt or something like that. If pocketability (particularly pants pocketability) is crucial, then the LX3 isn't really your best choice. No matter how much I may love that camera myself, it isn't my "stuff it in the pocket take it out for the night" camera. I use a Canon SD series p&s for that.</p>

<p>That having been said, anyone who wants an advanced compact camera needs to get away from the "pocket" requirement. The best cameras in this class are really not pocket cameras in the sense that most people think of them. So you've either got to drop back to a more p&s camera or loosen the pocket requirement. The Ricoh GX200 is really the only one that fits the "advanced" and "pocket" requirement.</p>

<p>As for AA's, get with the times and pony up for another battery. Unless you are planning on shooting far away from a wall outlet for days at a time (in which case you should be using a manual film camera that isn't battery dependant), you'll be fine.</p>

[waltflanagan]

<p>Hmm, I have the older LX2 and I put it in my shorts pockets all the time. No problem at all. It's tighter in blue jeans but I wear baggy clothes most of the time so I'm okay with it in my pocket.</p>

[cwphoto]

<p>I use a Canon Powershot 650. 4-AA's. IS. decent zoom, SD cards. Prefer to use a DSLR when picture counts though.</p>

[MTC Photography]

<p>My LX3 is semi permenantly attached to a wide angle converter lens, hence no more pocketable. I use a Lumix DMC LS75 as pocket camera along with a Tessina 35</p>

[ripraprob]

<p>Once again, thank you for your answers. I'll be looking into them and looking at the links posted.<br>

AA is not a must. I stated that clearly in my OP.<br>

While YouTube has supported HD video for some time, a YouTube video is not nessecarily a HD video. I'm NOT looking for HD video. Something like 480*320 pixel will do just fine for my needs.<br>

As for my pocket size: Ideally I'm looking for something smaller than the LX3 I think.<br>

I didn't mention high ISO. Though it would be nice, I've always been somewhat disappointed with higher ISO-settings on even the DSLR's I've used (except the Nikon D3) so I don't expect a small camera to be better.<br>

Thanks again :o)</p>

<p>Rob, Denmark</p>

[joe_oconnor3]

<p>I would say either a Canon A series or a Nikon coolpix. One reason, the glass. Canon and Nikon make the best glass. I have a really tiny Brookstone that I take on marathons etc and it is great but you can very quickly tell the difference between pictures taken with that camera and pictures taken with my A95 (now obsolete) - the reason the glass on the Canon is just better.</p>

<p>JPO</p>

[frank_skomial]

Currently it is the Canon SD 990 IS in my pocket. Small enough for shirt pocket. This is perhaps my 8th pocket camera, and will certainly not stay in the pocket much longer, as soon as something better comes around, I will replace it.

[ripraprob]

<p>Here is my conclusion so far:<br>

The best camera for my needs might be the Canon Ixus 870 IS (aka Canon SD880 IS Digital ELPH in some countries for some reason):</p>

<ul>

<li>Small (enough) </li>

<li>28 mm at the wide end</li>

<li>Can be 'hacked' - using the CHKD firmware - so I get access to manual controls.</li>

<li>Video clips up to 640 times 480 pixel (with a newer codex than the older Canons = smaller files/longer clips).</li>

<li>Canon glass and quality (mentioned by a few - I've owned the Canon G3 before)</li>

<li>Reasonable fast</li>

<li>IS (the ability to use lower ISO-settings, which I like)</li>

<li>10 Mpixel (i would actually prefer lower pixel count, due to noise)</li>

<li>Nice reviews.</li>

<li>Not AA nor AAAs but Canon usually has a decent battery life.</li>

<li>Reasonable price: Available in both brand new and 2nd hand (two for sale on a Danish 2nd hand site).</li>

</ul>

<p>What do you think?<br>

Rob, Denmark</p>

[joshroot]

<p>The Canon SD series has always had nice p&s cameras in it. I've had 3-4 of them. However, don't think that you are getting the quality that you would out of a LX3 or a G10 or a GX200. P&S cameras simply aren't in the same class as the better prosumer cameras.</p>

<p>That having been said, for a P&S, you can't go wrong with the SD series in my book.</p>

[bstinshoff]

<p>Not sure if it's still being made, but I really like the Canon A720 I've had for the last couple years. It's got program, aperature priority, shutter priority, full manual plus a whole bunch of custom modes; it uses AA batteries, has seven or eight mexapixels, fits in a jacket (not shirt) pocket, shoots short video clips and most functions can be set in only one or two steps. I carry mine with me everywhere I go. Downside is there's a lot of noise once the ISO goes over 200 (especially at 800 and 1600), no RAW capability, and there's virtually no difference in depth of field whether shooting at F 2.8 or F 8 (although my understanding is most compacts with their small senors have this issue).</p>

[fld]

<p>I often have to choose which cameras to haull along. I'm a collector, as well as an avid amateur. So<br>

I usually have 2 or more film cams as well as a couple of digitals. My preferred digitals now include a Kodak V570, which has 5 Mpixel file size, and is very very compact. I just wish it had an optical viewfinder. But whaddaya want for the price? My next digicam is one I just got. it's almost as compact as the V570 but it is thicker and does change shape to zoom. It's also a Kodak, Z1485IS ands it does have a 14Mpixel file capacity.<br>

I have not used it a lot yet, but I plan to reshoot a number of my printed pix at the higher resolution.Here's hoping.</p>