OT: Western Union Scammers on PN

[ian_kennedy1]

this post is mostly educational for those of you who might be selling equipment here. i

have a couple of posts on the photo.net classifieds and i recently got this email:<br />

<blockquote> I have just seen your ads and i will like to purchase the product so i will like

to know?that my client will be needing the goods in Africa and as soon as payment is made

he will arrange a pickup of the goods from your place so all i will like you to do is to give

me the last selling price for the goods and also i will like you to know that my client will be

making payment with a cashier's check in U.S funds so also i will like you to give me the

name to write on the check with the address to send the check to also my client prefers a

voice transaction better than this internet transaction so he will like you to drop a phone

number where you can be reached for better and faster transaction.</blockquote>

<br />now i am slightly naive, but i'm aware that the majority of internet scams

come out of africa/nigeria (see 419 or 409), and while i want to believe all of this about

"my client", etc, i am wary. so after replying that i did not mind being paid by check, but

that paypal was much more convenient, i get this:<br />

<blockquote>Thanks for your mail,I have contacted my client and he said that since you

said the cost of your?Goods is $200 and my client says there is no? problem about the

price,but there is something i will like to tell you that you have to understand that my

client is owing me $3,000 and he has just issued you a check of $3,200 which you will be?

expecting while you deduct your $200 and wire me? back my $3,000 via Western union

money transfer.So You will be expecting a check of $3,200 while you wire me back $3,000

via? Western Union Money Transfer as soon as you receive the check i will like you make

the transfer of? $3,000 minus the comission for the transfer of the funds via Western

union money transfer which i will be using for paying up my client's shipper.After the

balance on the check has been wired to me i will then instruct my client's shippers to come

to your destination to pick up the Goods.So let me have your full contact information? to

where the check will be sent to like this. </blockquote>

<br />

<a href="http://www.joewein.de/sw/spam-fraud-paypal.htm">here is a page about the

western union scam</a>. the basic idea is that the scammers use a middleman to accept

payment for their fraudulent sales in order to make their whereabouts less likely to be

traced.<br/>

so be careful, folks.

[Jerry_]

A fairly basic concept, good to go if the 'guy' can use Western Union wire to transfer the box to you (along with the 'very, very good copy') of the incoming Cashier's Check, then you can make a good deal.

 

 

 

 

Ha!

[terry_rory]

Similar scams have been all over the wedding forum for months now. BJP had warnings about them 3 issues ago.

[SolaresLarrave]

Well, here's where Paypal really saves the day.

 

But then, they'll come up with some trick involving Paypal as well...

 

Good luck with your sales and thanks for the heads-up!

[nathaniel_pearson]

I think you should be highly suspicious any time you get a query from abroad

(anywhere abroad, including by local proxy), for a high-price item, which makes only

generic reference to the item itself (i.e. 'your goods', 'your item', &c.), or specifies

what it is but uses strange syntax or scope of quoting to do so (e.g. 'your My Old F5

In Remarkable Condition'). Along with such form-letter prose, outlandish offers of

pick-up (potentially a trust-building bluff), free shipping, &c. are also tipoffs to get

your guard way, way up.

[terry_rory]

I would never let goods go unless the cheque had cleared at my bank first. I have goods sent from individuals on the internet delivered to my works address. I never release my private address on the internet/e-mail/phone except to bona-fide dealers or amazon etc.

[terry_rory]

Some trick involving paypal would mean paypal's official website being hi-jacked by the scammers. Unlikely.

[kai_griffin]

This is harsh, but if you follow the formula: Western Union + Africa = Scam, you'll be safe. The fraudulent use of WU in African countries (primarily Nigeria) to extract money from the unwitting has been going on far too long for people to remain ignorant about it these days. Just search for any of the following in Google:

 

419 scam, Mugu, Guymen

 

These scams and their many variants are a major "industry".

[patricks]

it just never stops, does it?! i'm so sick and tired of scammers of all sort. like the people trying to take advantage of the recent tsunami event to scam people for money.

[michael s.]

Yes, Kai, it is harsh. Perhaps it's too harsh.

 

Most of the reported schemes of this sort that I've seen, both foreign and domestic (U.S. I should say), have telltale signs -- some flashing so brightly it surprises me they're missed.

 

Signs include: Wild overpayment for goods with the seller to "refund" the excess to another party; money transmitted circuitously to avoid something -- taxes, other creditors, vaguely described forfeitures, and the like; a lawyer 'brokering' a used camera purchase; "get rich quick" promises of $$$ thouands or $$$ millions in exchange for oddball cooperation, always involving you sending money to a stranger.

 

There are of course subtler schemes, involving credit card theft, identity theft, and so on.

 

Fraud of any sort is a serious problem. I don't mean to suggest otherwise.

 

But I'm stunned that in most of the brazen examples, the "smell detector" of the intended target appears not to be functioning.

[terry_rory]

Use the doorstep test. If any individual came to your door (or junk mail through the letterbox) proposing such a scheme what would you do? Any sensible person would decline (or throw away the junk mail) and even alert the authorities if it seemed 'phishy' and there was a good chance the conman could be apprehended.

 

But if its on the internet or in peoples e-mail.... "Oh yes, please come into my finances and feel free to rummage around at will"

 

If a person claiming to be from my bank came to my door and said... "Sorry Mr Hare but due to a computer malfunction we have lost all your personal data please can you fill out this form for me and my large sinister friends?".. I would ring for the police immediately. There is no utterly conceivable way that my bank would ever act that way. But people respond to these e-mails all the time. They must do, they would not appear otherwise.

 

Luckily we only get #### like that at work where my Global Corporate Employers have far less system security in place than I do at home! (Although to be fair the e-mail system at work has some hundreds of thousands of employees on it so some crap will get through.)

[stephen hazelton]

"I would never let goods go unless the cheque had cleared at my bank first."

 

This is exactly how the scam works and why it works. You call and ask your bank if the check is valid, they check and say yes. The check clears your bank. The money is put in your account. You wire-transfer the money. Then 3 weeks later, it turns out the check is a counterfeit, and your bank wants their money back in a hurry. Surprise!

[ronald_moravec1]

This is a take off on the worlds oldest scam called a "pidgeon drop".

[terry_rory]

Stephen, I mean a proper cheque for the real amount from a real account holder, not some hugely inflated cheque (which would get binned) from some middle man or agent.

 

The last time I received a cheque for goods (a Yashica 124G) from a USA customer I had to spend 15 GB pounds because my bank had to ring his bank to ensure it was a genuine account holder with funds good for the transaction. Then I still had to wait for 4 working days for it to clear properly (via BACS). Only then did I send the goods.

[abufletcher]

I've never understood how any intelligent person could possible fall for any of

the "Nigeria" scams. They all sounds so outlandishly ridiculous, e.g. "my

uncle/dear departed husband is a retired general with close ties to the

government and would like to send you 3 million dollars, if only you would..."

 

I can only imagine that if viewed through a very different cultural lens, such

propositions actually sound like "shrewd business." Makes you wonder what

doing actual business in Nigeria must be like.

[kelly_flanigan1]

"Nigeria" scams are older than the internet. We got them on our old thermal fax machine in the mid 1980's. The honorable Mr XXX just died; has some money; the heirs need a way to blah blah blah; you get 15 to 25 percent for handling the money..Contact Mr XYZ at 011 878XYYY ...>