another 5d 40d thread

[bob stewart jacksonville]

Here's my dillema. I have to shoot a family wedding at the end of May. I want

to shoot digital. I currently have a 10D which will be the backup camera. (

I've shot weddings and don't need the don't do it speech, given that I'm

already unavoidably committed.)

 

I'm thinking about buying a 5D. I like the 5D because of the full frame, and

better image quality. I have an array of EF lenses from 18mm to 600mm.

 

However, after the wedding my primary use for the camera will be nature

photography (mostly birds). For that use, faster focus, and to a lesser degree

the 1.6x teleconverter effect, are attractive.

 

Is it true the 40D focuses faster?

[tdigi]

IMO the 40D is a better camera for the money. It is faster and image quality is so close that it

would be hard to tell the difference. However I do think FF is better suited for weddings.

 

The 1 advantage you get with a 40D if your shooting birds is the 1.6 factor which will give

you more reach. Either will do just fine for you.

 

For me I got a 40D but I plan to get a FF probably about a year or so after the 5D2 comes

out.

[alan_chan4]

I went through the same choice and bought the 40D due to the claimed better AF with 9 cross AF points. I don't know how much better it is over the 5D but from what I can tell, iso3200 is practically useless with 40D because of banding. iso1600 is useable but not terrific if exposed properly. The banding noise at the red and blue channel still exists at lower iso but practically invisible in most cases unless you try to do lots of PP. 40D/580EXII flash is consistent and reilable if not always accurate but never too far off. AF speed is still good without AF assist even when EV is too low for MF. So I guess it depends on your shooting habit. If you enjoy shooting iso1600 without flash, 5D might be a better choice. If you use flash with iso400/800 for indoor shots, 40D will do.

[zafar1]

I have a 5D which I use to photograph birds, among others. I sold my 40D after getting 5D.

 

40D has a theoretical 1.6x crop advantage but after running side-by-side tests I found that the contrast and clarity allowed my to crop and up-rez images from 5D and they would be equal and better looking than those from 40D. You can still see some of those crop images that I took for my own satisfaction here

http://www.flickr.com/photos/13209786@N04/sets/72157603827705006/

 

Overall the color rendering and contrast of 5D is better than 40D. The images are cleaner and sharper. The AF of 5D is fast during day and low light (even without AF assist). However I only used center focus point so can't comment on other focus points.

 

I shoot flying birds and in my opinion the center circle on 5D (with six invisible assist points) does a better job of keeping the focus lock then 40D (with which I just was not able to keep focus lock on flying birds).

 

In short I was so satisfied with 5D that I sold my 40D (and I never shoot weddings).

[eigtball]

I bought the 40D over the 5D for the speed, and excellent body for the price. The 5D is a very nice body but I believe its best to wait for the replacement before purchasing the older one. If you cannot afford the newer one the old 5D will be less expensive anyway.

[sattler123]

I have both - the 5D and the 40D. The 5D for landscape and the 40D for bird and wildlife photography. Yes, you do have a dilemma - because , no matter what is being said, there is a clear difference between the two cameras. The 5d produces the better Image Quality - I know mist folks say there is hardly any difference, but I can clearly see the 5d's superiority. In addition you get better noise capability and wides are wide - period. On the other hand, the 40D focuses much faster and more reliably than the 5D, plus you get higher fps and more reach. Those were the reasons I got the 40d for birding and I am glad I did it.

 

So what do you do? I would NOT buy a camera for a one-time event - in your case that means, get the 40d instead of the 5d, if the only reason is the wedding!

[PuppyDigs]

I have both a 5D and 40D. They're both great cameras and you can't go wrong with either one. I use the 5D for

landscapes/wide angle and the 40D for tele and snapshots. I can't say I miss most of the extra features of the 40D on

the 5D. While sensor cleaning looks good on paper, I haven't had any dust problems with my 5D in 2 years. There are

2 I do miss: 40D LCD is a notch better (brighter & slightly larger) and ISO is visible in VF without pressing a button.

Both cameras have an excellent Direct Print Button!

 

As for AF speed, I find them about the same. Yes, the 40D frame rate is twice as fast, but AF speed is in the same ball

park. Oddly, the 5D does a little better in ultra low light (balks less).

 

And I agree with Zafar as far as IQ. I mainly shoot landscapes but the 5D renders them smoother and more 3D like.

This is evident both on screen and print. I also find ISO 1600 better on the 5D (less apparent noise). Although the

Highlight Priority setting of the 40D sounds cool, it makes shadow noise painfully evident, so I leave it off most of the

time.

[tdigi]

I disagree about the banding at 3200. You do get grainy shots at 3200 but sometimes it

creates a cool effect for black and white. I can post some samples if you like.

[alan_chan4]

Well I don't know what to disagree about. I have owned a brand new 40D and tested 3 others at local stores. All 4 hv the same amount of banding noise.

[m_barbu1]

bob, how fast is your "array of EF lenses from 18mm to 600mm", and will you be using flash at the wedding?

[tdigi]

I disagree because mine does not have banding noise. at least not that I notice. However I

rarely use 3200. I do agree you will get less noise on a FF camera.

[michael.gregory]

Please do not fall for the "The 1 advantage you get with a 40D if your shooting birds is

the 1.6 factor which will give you more reach." story. It simply is not true. using a smaller

sensor does not increase the "reach" of any lens it only limits your angle of view. The

image projected on the sensor is exactly the same size in all cases. You can always crop

out, you can't put back what your sensor can't record because the sensor is too small,

and that part of the image fell off the edge.

The image quality on the 5 D is outstanding. Granted the physical dimensions of the

actual pixels is larger, but the trade off there is a better signal to noise ratio. In my

opinion, the 5 D is the better choice because it gives you more choice.

[William Michael]

Leaving the birds out of the picture, and also not commenting upon the pros and cons of digital post production cropping.

 

Having a 5D and a 10D (for the Wedding and for your general kit later) provides a duality of scope in regard to the range of FoV at the scene.

 

As a practical example 10D and 5D with 16 to 35 and 70 to 200 walking about gives FoV coverage [equiv 135 format] 16mm to 320mm with a small, IMO not important, gap of FL57mm to FL69mm.

 

I find this a compelling reason to consider the 5D, having already a working 10D.

 

[i write `leaving birds out of the picture` because I do not shoot them very often, and I consider I am not very good at it: but I was interested to note Zafar Kazmi`s experience and am now tempted to have a play with my 5D and some seagulls, which we have plenty: thanks for that information.]

 

WW

[colinsouthern]

Michael Gregory wrote:

 

"Please do not fall for the "The 1 advantage you get with a 40D if your shooting birds is the 1.6 factor which will give you more reach." story. It simply is not true. using a smaller sensor does not increase the "reach" of any lens it only limits your angle of view."

 

Michael, what you wrote WOULD be true if both sensors had the same pixel spacing; Unfortunately, they don't.

 

To simplify things, consider that the "long" dimension of a 5D sensor is 35.8mm, and it has 4368 pixels - giving 122 pixels per millimetre. A 40D Sensor is 22.7 millimetres, and it has 3888 pixels - giving 171 pixels per millimetre.

 

Although you're quite correct in saying that the 40D has a reduced field of view, it's incorrect to imply that you can simply crop a FF sensor to the same size as a crop sensor, and get the same result - a small print may well look the same, but as you enlarge the image you'll see that the crop-sensor on a 40D has captured significantly more information than the 5D (ie "increased resolving power") - when you enlarge this image to the same size as one shot on a FF camera you end up with an image that has roughly (keep in mind that the 40D sensor is 2MP less than a 5D anyway) the same pixel density, but at the reduced field of view - the net result is an effective increase in focal length.

[JDMvW]

That g*dd*m print button- I presume the mention above was ironic, or am I too cynical?

 

Please Canon, read this and make that button do something useful!

 

Sorry, reflex action, couldn't help myself.

[dogbert]

Mr Puppy is just trying to provoke us! Well its not going to work. I refuse to bite! I am not going to say anything about that damn stupid direct print button that could otherwise be a MLU button or a RAW button or about 25 other useful things. Arghhhh!

[m_barbu1]

<p><i>You can always crop out, you can't put back what your sensor can't record because the sensor is too small, and that part of the image fell off the edge.</i></p><p>Actually, if you crop a photo from a 5D, you end up with less resolution than the same image taken on a 40D at the equivalent focal length. <a href="http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=00JC8L">You might want to read this for your edification.</a></p>

[PuppyDigs]

The direct print button is great for parties. My wife uses it very dad burn time. I would have

never touched it if it wasn't for her. However I suspect a major percentage of the earth would

rather forgo PS and DPP and simply press the Direct Print Button and be done with it. I even

saw a pro photog at a Santa setup at the mall using the DPB. Personally I enjoy diddling in PS

and DPP but I once enjoyed hanging in the darkroom....

[jason_hall4]

Then we should at least be able to select the function of the button or put the direct print function in the meanus were it belongs. That is valuable real estate that little button is taking up!

[KenPapai]

colin reminded: <i>"To simplify things, consider that the 'long' dimension of a 5D sensor is 35.8mm, and it has 4368 pixels - giving 122 pixels per millimetre. A 40D Sensor is 22.7 millimetres, and it has 3888 pixels - giving 171 pixels per millimetre."</i>

<p>

I am continually amazed by those numbers. You know how SMALL those light buckets are on these sensros? And the fact you can easily enlarge a 40D image to a beautiful print, and very sharp at 19x13 inches (and some others have pulled it off much larger)... sometimes it's hard to fathom this technology or appreciate it and not continue to take it for granted.

<p>

Direct Print too, ehh? LOL!

[photo_dark]

Having bought the 40D over the 5D, i'd say forget the 5D... personal opinion. It is usable at all ISO numbers. Yes there is noise at 3200... but anyone who knows how to use a computer knows how to get rid of a good portion of the noise in Digital photo pro, or another third party plugin.

 

Focus speed on the 40D is fast, on all points. I typically use the center point as well, but with the ability to map the thumbstick to the focus points (I leave this feature on), it is a whole lot easier to quickly switch focusing than it ever was. That being said, i've never had a problem focusing on flying birds with my 70-200L and the center point on servo. If i do it's because i was too slow, not the camera.

 

All and all.... aside from the FF vs 1.6x argument (both have benefits), and better noise performance, the 5D is still $1000 more than the 40D. Personally, I think it boils down to budget. The 5D is probably better overall, but the 40D is also very capable and well worth the money in my opinion.

[m_barbu1]

Aggressive noise reduction inevitably softens photos due to the loss of details.

[mrivers]

Rent a body for the wedding....

[mark_davies1]

Which body - 5D or 40D?

Male or Female?