bob_smith68 Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Hi, I'm an old Leica user now shooting with a D200, and I love to shoot in"available light" with the depth-of-field of fast lenses. I would love to get awide angle (something like my Leica 35mm, which would be about 24mm on thedigital) f/1.4 lens. I'm aware of the Nikon 28mm f/1.4 which everyone seems to love (aside from theprice). I've seen different stories about why it was discontinued. I'm alsoaware of the Sigma 30mm f/1.4 which doesn't sound too hot. My question is whether anyone knows if Nikon/Nikkor is planning to releasesomething close to this in the future. I would think they could make a DX lensfor the smaller image plane without too much trouble. Anyone? Thanks in advance,BobBoulder CO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juanjo_viagran Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 I have no idea if Nikon is planing on new 1.4 primes, but they should... is crazy how much people are paying for the 28mm 1.4D, the lens was $1700 BRAND NEW and I see used (MINT) going for over $3000 :o I have one and is a beautiful lens, but IMO is a big gamble to buy one now at that crazy high price when a new model may be on the way.. or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sorin Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 I like the sigma 30mm 1.4 It's the lens that is generally attached to my camera (despite having a 17-55 2.8) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicaglow Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 Canon is kicking Nikon's butt on fast lenses. I can't figure out why because Nikon used to be a leader. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Ingold Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 Why would you need an f/1.4 wide-angle lens with ISO 25,600? Sorry guys, I think the unreal aperture wars ended nearly 40 years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juanjo_viagran Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 DOF ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juanjo_viagran Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 plus not everybody have a D3.. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaymondC Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 I think it will come I mean the 28 and 85 and 200 are the classic trio. My bet is that those who are holding the 28 right now, if and when Nikon pops the 28 or 24 1.4 out with AFS (full frame) the 2nd hand 28mm will get a big drop. I think maybe anytime up to say 4 years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walterh Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 Bob the standard answer is nobody knows. Nikon never reveals plans ahead and we all just have to wait and see. The Nikkor 28mm f1.4 is cheaper than many Leica lenses so in a way it is a cheap deal ^^. The comment about using a D3 is not so far out. If you look at a bundle of a D3 with a number of cheap used older MF lenses like the cheap 28mm f2.0 the D3 may just not be more expensive than a D300 with a similar set of new lenses. If you need one body and one lens the story is different. As to the DOF comment I see no reason why one needs less DOF than f2.0 from a 28mm lens, especially since exact focusing is already difficult for an f2.0 lens with any body inferior to an than F3. I use a Katz eye screen on my D200 but even then MF at very wide apertures produces a high fraction of missed focus shots. There may be exceptions but Juanjo show me the example where at f2.0 there was too much DOF! This brings us back to the Sigma 30mm f1.4 lens. The large spread in comments about the IQ of this lens has two reasons: 1) the major problem to focus exactly with both AF and MF on most Nikon bodies. 2) possibly in addition sample variation. If you can get the lens at a decent store with return policy you can get an excellent lens. The images have a distinct look that I like very much and resolution is also very good. The lens does not seem to follow the trend of most Nikon lenses of very high contrast - so what. I personally prefer the 28mm f2.0 and wait for the D3 in a few month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vojislav_mileti__263_ Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 Fast lenses are always needed. ISO 25,600 doesnt change that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShunCheung Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 First of all, ISO 25600 on the D3 is not exactly generating great results. You are still better off using lower ISO's. However, having very good high ISO results certainly reduces the need for fast lenses, making a small market segment even smaller. That is why it will not be a very high priority for lens manufacturers. Nikon will probably introduce some new f1.4, f2 primes, but I wouldn't count on very many varieties and prices will be high for a somewhat niche product. Additionally, those focal lengths will likely be mainly designed for the FX sensor although obviously they can also be used on DX. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
russ_konrad Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 Another reason for Nikon NOT to introduce primes in that focal length range is the new FANTASTIC 14-24 f/2.8 zoom. Even though it is only an f/2.8 - when combined with the greatly improved high ISO performance of the latest camera bodies (as mentioned above) it will fill 99% of the need in that focal length range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob_smith68 Posted January 12, 2008 Author Share Posted January 12, 2008 Thanks a lot for the responses. I have only one lens on my D200 now, which is the 17-55 f/2.8 zoom. This is a terrific lens, but I do miss the look of my old Leica shots with the faster glass. As for high ISO's, I rarely go above 1600 due to the noise. Shooting with fast glass at low ISO is really not the same as shooting with slower glass compensating with higher ISO -- the depth of field and noise issues give photos with very different character. I'm looking for the former. After going back and forth I think I'm going to give the Sigma 30 a try. I'd feel like a stooge if dropped megabucks on a used Nikon 28/1.4 and then they came out with a suitable replacement the next year... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark_amos Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 I really don't see how anyone can suggest that even very high quality f2.8 zooms can replace faster primes. Not to mention the size difference of the lenses, as Bob is aware, the dof is totally different. Take a full frame 50 f2 as a standard of shallow but usable dof at f2. At 10 feet and f2 the dof is about 14". With the 2.8 zoom set at 33mm focal length (and f 2.8) as is necessary to get the same crop at 10 ft as for a candid portrait, the dof is about 45". The resulting images are going to be very different. Even if you back up to about 18' to get the same crop with the 55mm dx setting, at 2.8, you've still got about 4' of dof. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
albert_smith Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 I have a Nikon DSLR, but I find that I am needing to use my 35mm f/1.4 AIS Nikkor to get the f/1.4 that I need for a moderate focal length view with good selective focus. It is a pain to a degree, metering with my Sekonic incident, focusing via the electronic rangefinder, but I get a look that I can't get with even an f/2.8 zoom. If Nikon does not feel the need to inject at least one f/1.4 lens with a semi-normal focal length (shorter than a 50mm f/1.4 for DX), then my 35mm f/1.4 Nikkor will be going into its third decade as my "go to" lens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShunCheung Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 The point Russ makes is that since there are already an excellent 17-35mm/f2.8 and a 14-24mm/f2.8, and you can shoot at ISO 1600, how many people will still buy an expensive 24mm/f1.4? I am sure that some people will, but not that many. Nikon might reintroduce the 28mm/f1.4 as an AF-S, but IMO it is unlikely that they'll have a 24mm/f1.4, 28mm/f1.4 and 35mm/f1.4. Hopefully we'll some of those new lenses in 2008. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harvey_edelstein1 Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 Considering the improvements in high iso photography vs. what film would yield then we could actually several stops more sensitivity with slightly slower lenses. Most of the fast lenses were only average performer wide open. I would like to see some designs with an f1.8 max aperture. A nice nine blade design would give good bokeh and with a camera capable of decent iso 3200 and VR shutter speed two stops slower you have a pretty capable overall kit. All factors considered these days we can get way better low light photos than when we had slow media and fast lenses with no VR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vojislav_mileti__263_ Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 Again, I dont see what 14-24 has to do with the need for fast primes. One other thing I dont understand is why people who dont need fast primes, say Nikon shouldnt bother making them at all. I dont need a 400mm F/2.8 but you wont hear me talking about how that lens is useless and completely unnecessary cause we have a slow zooms like 200-400mm and ISO 25,600 now. If you dont want it, then why care? Believe it or not, there are some of us who do want fast lenses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicaglow Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 I'm not getting how this turned into a discussion about low light and film speed. What about control over background and foreground focus? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
russ_konrad Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 <b>"...Again, I dont see what 14-24 has to do with the need for fast primes...."</b> <p> The point is that many people do NOT need fast primes since a high quality zoom that covers the same ranges(s) can meet many of the needs that people want. <p> The few people that still want a faster prime (for reasons posted above) may or may not be a market that can return Nikon's investment in research and development. <p> That fact directly addresses the original question/topic of this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaymondC Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 Most will not need the fast lenses that much .. but there are some like artistic types, very low light like portraiture for a soft look or concerts without the use of flash or even handheld without flash say in a tourist attraction like military bunkers and stuff... Cos its a prime most people for most subjects would just use the 14-24. My guess is that the AFS prime may be around $1600 or $1800 .. which is like on par with the 14-24 zoom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DB_Gallery Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 Great new nano coated Nikon fast primes are on the way. There is a very good demand for them and now that FX is out of the bag, the primes that were on the drawing board, in the R&D shop and now about to be released will soon be paired with the D3 owners who want them. Just be patient, Nikon is about to eat Canon for breakfast in regards to faster than 2.8 primes... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juanjo_viagran Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 "Great new nano coated Nikon fast primes are on the way." Daniel, from where you got that.!?? how accurate is that!! should I sell my 28mm 1.4D now that is getting top $$..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vic_. Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 <i>"... Why would you need an f/1.4 wide-angle lens with ISO 25,600? ..."</i> <p>See these examples, you cannot get this look with f2.8 or slower lenses. <p>The child 80% down the page: <p>http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?p=721974#post721974 <p>Some pics in this compilation: <p>http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=49075 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juanjo_viagran Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 1.4 <img src="http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc112/Juanjo_Viagran/BS/_DSC0013-2.jpg"> 2.8 <img src="http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc112/Juanjo_Viagran/BS/_DSC0014-2.jpg"> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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