How would you light this?

[toddlaffler]

Here's the deal, my cousin lives in England and I live in the US and he has asked me to photograph his

wedding. The problem is, the place he is getting married is COMPLETELY made of glass.

 

Here is the link to the venue: http://www.palmhouse.org.uk/index.php

 

How would you light something like this for a night wedding? Has anyone shot here by any chance, or shot

at a similar venue before?

 

Since I live across the pond too, I can't go there and test anything out either.

 

I'm a little hesitant to accept. Anyone have any suggestions?

 

Thanks

 

Todd

[bdp]

Bouncing off the ceiling might not work real effectively since most light will pass thru the glass. VERY COOL structure by the way.

 

You can set up some strobes in the corners, up high and shoot them into the middle or along a side wall. You can have a 2nd person for lighting, but you have to be careful of reflections, so obviously try not to shoot directly into the glass walls.

 

Not sure how this would work, but if the weather is good, and you can trust the area, try to put your lights OUTSIDE and try that (that's a complete off-the-wall guess, not sure it will work)

[jmichaelc]

If it's lit 1/4 as much as the photo shows, then fast glass should carry you through. I was in a very similar situation last year. I shot a wedding in an almost completely clear large tent. Light levels were exteremely low. After many panics and different approaches, i finally ended up going with direct flash set to just fill, large aperatures (1.4-2.0) and HI ISO's 3200 and 1600. It's been on one of my favorite weddings to date. However, if i did it all over today, i would erect 2-3 strobs high on stands bouncing my strobes into unbrellas back down to the general area for an alternate mixture option. Looks fun....be sure to get that twilight sky when you do a setter exterior shot. Looks like it would be fun.

[barry_davis___st._louis__m]

i shot a wedding in June 07 that had one side of mirrors and the other sides glass...I tested with my studio strobes for the dances...they were fine as long as you point down. My 580ex (on camera) was tilted at 45' and the catch light was extended...not the diffuser! I was pleasantly suprised at the results. No reflections of glass or mirrors. I'd go to something similiar in your city and test! But if not, tell him i'd gladly go! :-) what a venue!!

[picturesque]

I would do similar to Bob--use several off camera lights and watch my angle to the glass surfaces to minimize flashback--angle of incidence equals angle of reflection. I would not use umbrellas, though--umbrellas make what reflections do occur in the glass bigger. Small reflections in the glass just look like interior light reflections. Also, I would not push the ISO way up high unless you've determined you can basically go with flash only as fill. I've noticed that using really high ISO, flash reflections in windows, and even existing lights seem glaringly overbright. If you use off camera flashes to light the place, you can use lower ISO and avoid that look. One thing that helps is the fact that most of the action will probably happen toward the middle of the place, so any flash reflections in the windows will probably be very small. Hard to say but I might even put the off camera flashes closer in and not against the walls. The objective is to make the flashback, some of which is unavoidable, blend in as much as possible. For instances where you are right up against a window, watch your angle.

[picturesque]

Also, you could just go with a white card bouncer (Pocket Bouncer, Demb Diffuser, etc.) on the flash without any off camera lights, but the light will be harder since you have little to bounce off, and you may have separation problems.

[hugh_jaramillo]

If your cousin gets married during the day you may not need a flash since all the daylight will filter in.

 

For night shooting you need a 2nd person to assist you holding a flash on a pole and aimed down, and high enought our of the viewfinders frame of view.

[ellis_vener_photography]

Why don't you contact the facility and ask them how photographers generally handle lighting?

[mark_parker2]

The same way you would shoot outside maybe?

[neilambrose]

<p>A few things to think about...</p>

 

<p>The palm house is a protected building, which in the UK usually means you'll be quite

constrained in what you can do and how you can work. For instance, unless you have

public liability insurance you won't be allowed to use any power sources or construct any

temporary fixings. So (unless you already have or are prepared to take out UK insurance)

you won't be able to use monoblocs, light stands, tripods, strobe on a pole, step ladder or

anything similar. These types of venues are well organised (and usually supervised) and

will generally ask for proof of insurance in advance of the wedding.</p>

 

<p>I also noticed the wedding section of their website says they have a preferred

photographer policy because of COSHH (health & safety) regulations. So unless you are

duly certified you won't be permitted access to the balconies and gantry - which will be

disappointing as shooting from above obviously offers a lot of potential.</p>

 

<p>So, all in all, it's probably best to make plans that depend on ambient light, fast lenses

and whatever on camera/handheld flash you can manage.</p>

[katycollins]

Beautiful venue! I'm very far from Liverpool but I would suggest that you go to www.google.co.uk and do a search on 'wedding photographer palm house UK' hopefully this would bring up some photographers gallerys and I'm sure if you emailed them (explaining you are a cousin of the Groom who lives in the US they wouldn't mind sharing a few ideas re the venue).

 

have fun,

 

Katy

[picturesque]

Yikes--if Neil is right, you'd have to go with high ISO and on-camera flash. If that is the case, I might try the LS pointing straight ahead with the dome on and the flash beam manually widened. But you'd have to have an external battery because you are going to stress the flash re recycling since the LS wastes a lot of light out the sides, but the light is still bouncing around on near surfaces so it isn't being totally wasted. The only thing is, if you use very wide angles, you will have fall off of light from the LS dome not being able to "cover" extreme wide.

[wedding-photography-denver]

Shot in daylight, this would be just about lovely to shoot in. Remember, you source will be a slightly diffuse version of what you would get outside. Given that its in Liverpool, the sky would likely be a touch cloudy if not overcast. So that deals with that scenario if you add just a bit of fill.

 

Shot at night, nothing much different from normal shooting other than to watch your backgrounds don't reflect directly back at you. Stay a little lower than the head of the subjects and you should be fine.

 

Best, D.

[simon p barlow]

Hi Todd

 

I live in Manchester, about 30 miles from the venue. I have done some work in a similar venue near where I live.

 

If you can let me know the date and time of the wedding (via email if you like) I will be able to tell you what the expected light conditions will be, i.e. how far of sun set for example.

 

For the shots I did, it was around 16:00 local with sunset at 21:00. I treated it as daylight, manual settings with fill in flash set at 1/128 or 1/64 power using a 580Ex on a 30D. The weather was bright but overcast, I added between 1/3 to 2/3 exp comp shooting RAW and only had to tweak around 5% of my images for exposure. Shooting later in the evening, there is nothing to bounce off, but watch out for flash reflections in the glass even a distance away or blowing out any white elements of the structure. If you keep this in mind when composing, so that a little dodge and burn in PS will fix if required.

 

I checked out the web site regarding photographer access but its not clear if it?s a public liability insurance issue or a safety issue. I will make some enquiries later today (its 8:15am here at the time of this posting).

 

If it?s a safety issue, I will try to find out what the requirements are to become accredited to use the steps/gallery

If it?s a public liability issue, I may be able to add you to my PL Insurance for the event to cover you, but I need to talk to my insurance company first so cant give a commitment to this at the moment.

 

Regards

 

Simon

[davebell]

Simon, out of interest and if you don't mind, could you let me know the name of your PL insurance company. I am looking for something similar myself.

 

Thanks!

[simon p barlow]

Hi David

 

I currently use Pavilion for my equipment and Public Liability insurance.

 

They can be found at

 

www.photoguard.co.uk

 

I shopped round for the best deal and found that they could cover my equipment, provide 1million GBP public liability and 10,000GBP accident insurance in one package.

 

When apply via the web, you are asked to have the details of all your equipment and serial numbers of body?s, lenses, lighting equipment etc. One big advantage is that they cover for theft from a car.

 

To reduce the risk form a car I do use a number of PACSAFE nets to put all my equipment in.

 

www.pacsafe.com/www/index.php?_room=3&_action=detail&id=11

 

and padlock them to the tie down loops in the back of the Landrover. It is not a requirement of the insurance, but it makes me feel better!

 

Its also useful when on a shoot as I can lock my bag to something. (I have used lamp posts, statues, big trees, road signs?) Using the cord, I have also locked my Bowens lights to things when I have set up early at a venue and not been able to stay with the equipment.

 

Regards

 

Simon

[toddlaffler]

A HUGE thank you to all who responsed. This forum is, I think, the best thing about

photo.net, the sharing of knowledge is an amazing thing.

 

I am double checking on the time of the wedding, and keeping my fingers crossed that it

will occure during usable daylight hours.

 

I have liability insurance here in the states but will have to see if it will cover me abroad.

 

Simon, are you a REAL person? WOW, thank you for taking such interest in my situation. I

truly do appreciate your time.

 

warm regards,

 

Todd

[davebell]

Thanks very much indeed Simon, much appreciated!

[simon p barlow]

Hi Todd

 

I have spoken today to the venue admin people, and with out the name and date of the wedding, they cannot tell me much. Initially, they said that it was a Public Liability Insurance issue regarding access to the gantry etc, but later in the conversation they were then insisting only their own photographers could have access.

 

I don't seem to be able to get anywhere with this.

 

Regards

 

Simon

[toddlaffler]

SImon, thank you for trying, that was really nice of you to do. I am double checking with

my cousin as to the time of the event. I know it's in late May of 2008, so if that helps as far

as how long I would have decent light etc.

 

DUH! Now that I think about it, I was in England in mid-may 2 months ago. I remember

that it doesn't get really dark until around 9-9:30 correct?

 

Anyway, thanks for your help, I appreciate it very much.

 

Todd

[simon p barlow]

Hi Tod

 

The only thing I can thing off is if your cousin hires one of their recommended photographers just for the main ceremony for the overhead shots, and you as a ?guest? cover the rest. They can?t stop a guest taking photo?s.

 

Regarding daylight, May usually has usable light up to about 8:30PM, but if you look at the Google Earth link ( I hope it attached OK) there are trees to the west which will create deep shadows on and inside the building with the setting sun.

 

Regards

 

Simon