20D errors

[peter_nelson1]

Last week during a model shoot with my new 20D, the camera got stuck

with "busy" on the display while writing a frame to the card. I

don't know if it's relevant, but the frame in question was the LAST

frame, i.e., it was a shot I took when it said I had ONE shot

remaining. I had to remove and re-insert the battery to "reboot" it

and lost the shot, and the whole mood at that moment!<P>

 

A few weeks ago I had the dreaded ERR99 message during a shoot and

had to "reboot" it with the same method. In both cases I was using

SanDisk 512MB CF cards, but they were different cards. FWIW - I

usually reformat cards between uses, instead of just erasing them.

The camera is less than 2 months old and I believe it has the latest

firmware so two hangs in as many months is alarming.<P>

 

In over two <B>years</B> of shooting heavily with my Nikon D100 I've

never had a single hang or freeze with it. But people have told me

that Canon's firmware is flakier and occasional hangs like this are

normal. Is this true? How do I prevent them?

[steve_dunn2]

<p>Canon <em>does</em> seem to have a habit of leaving a little bit of flakiness in their firmware; there have been a number of such reports in this forum. My bit: I bought a new 20D a couple of months ago. I've had two odd problems with it. One time, the camera forgot that when I half-depress the shutter release button, I want it to focus and meter; it had been fine during other shooting that day and no, I hadn't changed any settings. The other time, the camera forgot that it was supposed to apply exposure compensation when I turn the quick control dial while in P mode; yes, the camera's power switch was in the position which activates the QCD. In both cases, turning the camera off and on again fixed it.</p>

 

<p>That was with firmware 1.1.0, which came with the camera. I haven't done much shooting since I upgraded to 2.0.0 so I don't know if the lack of problems is due to the new firmware or simply luck.</p>

 

<p>How do you prevent them? If they're random, as opposed to (say) being caused by using an el cheapo CF card or a lens with known problems, I don't believe you can.</p>

[beauh44]

Just curious, what lens were you using?

[jimstrutz]

I haven't had a 20D lock up yet (only 4 months though), but I know it happens. To reduce the likelyhood of this in the future; leave room on the card, use only lenses & flash units known to cooperate well with the 20D. Older Sigma lenses are the ones with the worst reputation, but some Tokina lenses have caused problems as well.

 

Also, any lens lens that has sat around for several weeks should have it's aperture actuated several times before use. Just set it at its smallest aperture & repeadedly press the camera's DOF button while looking into the lens to see that it is actuating quickly. I have have hade a couple of lock ups on other Canon bodies due to slow/sticky apertures.

 

Also, clean the lens to body electrical contacts, as this is a common source of lock up problems. Even a new lens/camera might have some contaminant covering the contacts. Not likely to be your problem, but it is easy to elliminate the possibility.

[KenPapai]

"1 Frame Remaining" means "SWAP in a new CF card NOW since the current card is FULL". It doesn't mean "Take another picture and cross your fingers hoping the data gets written." This is user error.

[peter_nelson1]

<I>Just curious, what lens were you using?</I><P>

Tamron 28-75 f/2.8

[peter_nelson1]

<I>"1 Frame Remaining" means "SWAP in a new CF card NOW since the current card is FULL". It doesn't mean "Take another picture and cross your fingers hoping the data gets written." This is user error.</I><P>

Why is it user error? I write software for a living, and image-processing software at that! So I think I can state with authority that there is no technical reason why they cannot provide accurate information about the remaining available space. The camera knows how much space is on the card and it knows, based on its algorithm, the worst-case file-size it would take to store an image. So if it says it can store an image on the card and it can't then it's a bug in the <B>PRODUCT</B>.<P>

 

Furthermore, if the problem is simply one of running out of space on the card while writing to it, it does not have to result in a hard crash of the camera that requires re-booting it. Any freshman computer-science student knows how to write software that can avoid overwriting some memory limit.

[KenPapai]

<i>Why is it user error? I write software for a living, and image-processing software at that! So I think I can state with authority that there is no technical reason why they cannot provide accurate information about the remaining available space. The camera knows how much space is on the card and it knows, based on its algorithm, the worst-case file-size it would take to store an image. So if it says it can store an image on the card and it can't then it's a bug in the PRODUCT.

<p>

Furthermore, if the problem is simply one of running out of space on the card while writing to it, it does not have to result in a hard crash of the camera that requires re-booting it. Any freshman computer-science student knows how to write software that can avoid overwriting some memory limit.</i><p>

I write software for a living too, more than 20 years in fact, and mostly in C language so I know low level programming. If my O.S. tells me I have just 3MB left on a 20GB device I damn well won't trust any write operation and will manually mitigate a likely disaster. I believe you should know this better than anyone else.<p> I totally agree that Canon's firmware should avoid this horrible FUBAR. You are preaching to the choir here but I still maintain that if I saw [1] frame left I'll go into a panic until I swap in a fresh CF.

[digitmstr]

even if there was no more room for the last picture the camera should NOT lock up - properly written software would allow for that much. The camera OS should have enough sense to properly write to media allowing enough room to spare for its own operations...IF that is the case here.

 

However, with my 10D i regularly fill up my 1gb cards until the camera says FULL without any lock ups whatsoever.

[andrew_carlson]

3 lockup/failures in 8 months using mostly 70-200 f/2.8L IS lens. one Err99 one Err01 one no msg at all. 2 during the same shoot and it didn't take 2 seconds to clear the camera and resume shooting.

 

If you don't like it or find it alarming write your own? Ok that was a cheap shot sorry. I use 512MB cards and usually transfer the images to an image tank when there's like 6-10 shots remaining. Why wait till 0 if there's time to do it now?

 

For the record I'm still on the original firmware that came with it, 1.0.5 or something like that. Why upgrade if I don't need to? I try not to take these so seriously and just work through them as quickly as possible and yes having 2 back to back was frustrating but quickly forgotten. Its just the way it is and I don't think you can prevent them from happening - stick with your nikon? Sorry another cheap shot.

[awindsor]

Th counter shows the <i>estimated</i> number of frames remaining since the Canon RAW files are compressed and the file size varies depending on the image. It is possible though not very likely that the card had one estimated shot left but insufficient space to write the actual file.<P>

 

My 20D has never given me a problem even though I use the dreaded grip. You just got unlucky.

[awindsor]

Peter,

 

You are of course right that Canon could easily check that the available space is sufficient to store a worst case image but it seems to use a form of average size. A reasonable approach when there is lots of space available but a problem when you are down to the last one (or is it 1.03 or 0.97).

 

I certainly don't put this down to user error. I have never entirely filled my cards to see what happens but would expect the camera to function correctly.

 

It is pretty easy to pop the battery in and out. At least we don't need to carry around little screwdrivers the way those Hasselblad owners do ;)

[speed]

I've had my 20D for almost a year. I had it lock up on me about 4-5 times. I'm a amateur photographer and this digital is all new to me. But I was shooting in full auto mode when this happened. In fact happened twice in one day 2 wks ago at an NHRA event. My CF card is a lexar 512mb, shooting in semi-medium mode for maxium quality images for prints, my card was not full when lock up occured. Lens: Canon 75-300 EF; 1:4-5.6 III.

I too had to pull batteries to resume shooting. I'm ready to send back and have looked at next week. Is this recommended I do this? If not, what are my options that I may do to resolve myself?

Lately I've been shooting in RAW and experimenting in manual modes and have'nt had a problem yet. But also I just got a Lexar 1GB CF card which is a little better I believe.

[scottelly]

I bought my EOS 20D about 7 months ago, and I've been shooting pretty regularly with it. I use 2GB, 1GB, and 512MB CF cards. I've had about a dozen lock-up problems - mostly the err99 problem. I have been able to fix them by simply turning off and back on. When I can't do it this easily I take the battery out of the camera. Keep in mind that I shoot with a Sigma 18-125 lens in 8 MP fine mode (sometimes in other modes) in M, Av, Tv, P, and other settings. Sometimes I shoot fast, and sometimes I shoot with external strobes connected via sync cord to my sync cord port. I'm afraid to upgrade my firm-ware, and since most of my shoots go without any problems with the camera, I have no inclination to take a risk with modifying my camera. I shoot about 4 GB worth of photos each shoot, and since this is basically a computer with a lens, I expect some typee of electrical problems. Fortunately they've been easy to fix thus far.

 

Today I was using a Canon 550EX that someone loaned to me for one day. I used it last night without any problems, but today I was experimenting with it, and my camera locked up over and over 3 or 4 times with the err99 message. Simple to fix, but I wonder if the flash had something to do with the problem. I had my Canon 28-200 lens on it today - maybe that was a contributing factor.

 

Does anyone know of any compatibility issue(s) between the EOS 20D and the 550 EX that might cause an err99 problem?

[scottelly]

By-the-way,

 

I constantly fill my Sandisk CF cards to the brim. I almost never realize the card is full until I try to shoot another photo, and the camera doesn't work. Then I see the CF CARD FULL message. It doesn't seem to cause an err99 or other problem. I also use a PNY SD to CF adapter with Lexar SD cards (1 GB). This set-up doesn't seem to cause any error problems either.