Zeiss Sonnar 50mm lens in LTM

[al_feitknecht]

i was bidding on the sonnar that you purchased . my thoughts

were that it was a prewar collapsible sonnar in contax rf mount

that had been adapted to leica treadmount . the non collapsible

collar appears to be an aluminum adapter . the lens mount

appears to be from a very early elmar or perhaps a nooky close

up devise . i think the optics are from a prewar carl zeiss

uncoated sonnar . it should perform very well . i had one of the

wartime sonnars in collapsible all aluminum mount T coated .

the mount some 60 years old was badly worn . the most

important part of sharpness is keeping the excellent optics

spaced properly to the film plane . your rigid mount should do

this .

[pensacolaphoto]

Al, I am sorry to have outbid you, but I thought I was getting a "rare item" :-) You are the only one here so far who suggests that this lens might be "a prewar collapsible sonnar in contax rf mount that had been adapted to leica treadmount.".

It is also quite interesting that you think that the lens mount appears to be from a very early elmar or perhaps a nooky close up devise. Could you share with us what made you think this way. Are you a collector of Zeiss lenses?

[furcafe]

Hate to disagree, Raid, but see my 1st & 3rd posts above:

 

"If it's a collapsible Sonnar, then most likely it was either 1 of the small # made by CZJ during WWII (@ the behest of the military), in which case it should be "T" coated, or it was custom modified before, during, or after WWII . . ."

 

"Still looks like a custom conversion of a collapsible pre-WWII CZJ 5cm/2 Sonnar to me, i.e., appears that someone grafted the Sonnar onto an existing (Leitz?) LTM focus mount."

 

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"You are the only one here so far who suggests that this lens might be 'a prewar collapsible sonnar in contax rf mount that had been adapted to leica treadmount.'"

[pensacolaphoto]

Christopher: You are right, of course, and you offered the same information on the lens in your postings. Sorry about my error.

[furcafe]

No need to apologize, Raid. Just stop worrying & enjoy your lens! It may not be super-rare, but it's certainly unusual & a great picture-taking tool.

[al_feitknecht]

the lensmount looks like an early 50mm elmar type . leitz had

several types of release pins before useing only the mushroom

type . the pin type on yours looks like a very early one in leica

lenses by rogliotti ( spelling butchered at best ) the 50 f 2

collapsible i had was wartime T coated all aluminum mount .

pacific rim camera has a rigid wartime sonnar in leica screw in

their ebay store . price is $475 . ouch . the depth of field scale on

that lens looks to be hand scribed after manufacture . i will look

for photos of the sonnar i had and post them if i can . you have a

very nice lens -- shoot some pictures with it before serviceing -

you can get a feel for its character , also if there are any minor

problems with the mount ( can be recollimated during service )

you will probably never know the complete story . i do think the

uncoated optics are real zeiss . all russian zeiss type lenses are

coated . remember coating was a zeiss innovation and the

russians inherited the process . there were probably many

custom conversions before the war . the leitz summar was not a

great lens compared to the zeiss sonnar for the time .

[al_feitknecht]

i took another look at davids 1.5 sonnar that is similiar to yours .

the depth of field scale is engraved with 3.5, 4.5 , 6.3 . 18 f

numbers used by leitz on their elmars . i can not make out the

scale on your f2 lens . zeiss used the modern system 2 , 2.8 , 4 ,

5.6 , 8 , 16 on the sonnars . so professional conversion is a

possibilty . maybe you have the brisson lens converted for him .

[pensacolaphoto]

Al,

What is the Brisson lens ... ? I am totally in the dark here.

I have the lens cleaned by my trusted camera repairman, so I cannot right now check the depth of field markings on the lens.

I'm sure glad that you find the lens nice and a good one too.

I will use it once I get it back the coming days and I will post some photos here.

[pensacolaphoto]

I got the lens back; the camera repairman told me that he was unable to open up the lens. Everything was stuck due to age?

 

Depth of Field marks: 3.5 6.3 9 12.5 18

Is this what you were looking for Al?

 

I have discovered engraved numbers at the bottom of the mount;

one part lists the number 148 (the numbers are not equally spaced), and the other number looks like 262779, with crooked numbers also not alligned correctly.

 

Maybe this also helps here with figuring out the source(s) of this lens.

[mskovacs]

Raid: Have you considered sending it to Henry Scherer? www.zeisscamera.com

 

If anyone can fix it, its this man.

[pensacolaphoto]

Mike,

There is nothing really wrong with the lens except a little oil on the blades. I just like to have my lenses cleaned up well locally whenever possible to get the best results.

[al_feitknecht]

the f numbers you indicate are the f stops for a collapsible 5cm f

3.5 leitz elmar . it is probably the back part of the mount . the

scribed numbers are usually placed there by the person

assembling the lens . if leica the 262xxx might be the serial

number of the lens optics used for the mount . i think that

number is from the early 1930"s your sonnar is prewar also .

whom or how it was assembled you may not be able to

determine .

[furcafe]

I believe Al was referring to the converted Sonnar Cartier-Bresson used. My understanding is that HC-B used a 50/1.5 Sonnar.

 

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"Al, What is the Brisson lens ... ? I am totally in the dark here."

[pensacolaphoto]

The lens finally was cleaned by DAG, and it performs very well indeed.

 

Raid

[pensacolaphoto]

I have used this lens extensively by now, and the lens is a great performer. I am also in the process of obtaining from Brian a Sonnar 5cm 1.5 in a J-3 shell.

[Brian1664876441]

Hopefully Raid has his converted Sonnar today.

 

This Flickr Set has shots from 5 converted Sonnar lenses. The latest is a Carl Zeiss Jena "T" 5cm F1.5 from 1939, set in a J-3 mount and collimated for the Leica standard.

 

<a href=" http://www.flickr.com/photos/oldcamerapictures/sets/72157603706389629/ "> Converted Sonnar Flickr Set </a><div></div>

[pensacolaphoto]

Brian,

 

The "like-new" pre-war Sonnar has arrived. It is amazing that such an old lens can stay to new looking optically. The engraved letters on the lens rim are also like new looking.

[Brian1664876441]

Zeiss built them to last. The uncoated pre-war CZJ Sonnars have an incredible build quality. I've got an uncoated

CZJ 5cm F1.5 Sonnar that also looks like Waterford Crystal. Not a mark on it.

[pensacolaphoto]

<p>I am still amazed by the quality of CZJ 5cm lenses.<br>

I now have 1.5 and also 2.0 lenses.</p>

[salal]

Hi all,

 

I just got this Carl Zeiss Jena Sonnar 5cm f2 lens to use on my Leica M8. This is the leica screw mount version and the gentleman I bought this from was using it on his Leica IIIf. I was trying to get more information on this lens and there is only very little information about this lens that I could find on the internet. Much of the information on 5cm f2 sonnars that I came across was about Contax mount and some Jupiter ones which seemingly have the same design. The lens feels heavy and I think its made of brass and not alluminium, atleast not entirely. This thread even though an old one seems to have a lot of information on early sonnar lenses and experts participating; so I thought I will post these pictures here and would hear from you guys about this version.

 

Regards,

 

S

 

[Brian1664876441]

This is a post-war 5cm F2 lens that has been adapted to Leica Thread Mount using a pre-war Leica Elmar mount. The Sonnar has superior low-light performance compared with the Leica lenses of the day, and many people paid to have them converted. Converted Sonnars are still popular for Leica mount, I've done 50 or so conversions of Contax mount Sonnars to Leica mount.

[salal]

This is a post-war 5cm F2 lens that has been adapted to Leica Thread Mount using a pre-war Leica Elmar mount. The Sonnar has superior low-light performance compared with the Leica lenses of the day, and many people paid to have them converted. Converted Sonnars are still popular for Leica mount, I've done 50 or so conversions of Contax mount Sonnars to Leica mount.

Thanks for your input. I can see from these discussions that there are some actual Carl Zeiss Jena Sonnar 5cm f2 made for Leica screw mount by the company itself. I wonder how would those look like? Is it similar to the one am having? I couldn't find even a picture of the original one.