Should we alert other users when a classified price is too high?

[pablo_s]

I have a moral dilemma. When I see someone selling an item for way

over the market value (as defined by either photo.net or eBay

average pricing) I feel tempted to add a comment alerting potential

buyers. But on the other hand, it's a private transactions between

parties where I don't have any particular interest, so I'm not

really sure what to do. I think it's definitely correct to add a

comment when a post seems to be a scam, but if it's just overpriced

it's not so clear... what do you think?

 

This isn't photo.net feedback but I didn't find a more suitable

forum. Mod, feel free to move it or expire it.

 

Thanks in advance.

[lex_jenkins]

You're kidding, right? Please say you're kidding.

[edward_h]

I must apologize in advance not being capable of answering your question as informatively and interestingly as Lex, but I hope I can be of _some_ help at least, unlike Lex who answered your question and gave you tons of links to pages full of research in the subject.

 

I too have questioned myself several times about whether or not I should be helping others by informing them of the actual market value of a product. Generally I don't because I just don't have the time. Then there's fact that people buying shit online should have at least looked around (searched) for product reviews and links to OTHER pages that have the product for sale.

 

Here in Sweden prices are very much higher than in Germany, for example, and yet people insist on buying from online retailers here in Sweden rather than look outside of our countries borders. I'm not sure if it's due to ignorance or the belief that the Swedish product guarantees are better than ones internationally (Canon don't care if you bought a Canon camera in Sweden, Germany or Italy...).

 

In the end it's all about time: you can't help everyone, and those who are too stupid to help themselves deserve to be ripped off.

 

If a friend of mine is in need of purchasing help, I will gladly assist.

[ilkka_nissila]

The thing is that you may or may not be helping the person considering the purchase because you don't know the condition of the product (unless you're the seller) nor of the other products on sale which you use to determine what you consider the market value of a product. Also, you may be hurting the guy trying to sell the product.

 

People buy locally in Europe at inflated prices because they want to support the local companies selling the products. A part of that money comes back to them through the tax system. If only B&H existed, where would you go to actually see the product in person? Or do you just buy everything blind?

[__stu_evans]

How would you, as a grounded reputable seller of a clean guaranteed product like to be heckled by a nit selling flea market seconds from the trunk of his car. Unless it's unconscionable, let it go.

[john falkenstine]

Pablo, personnally I wouldn't worry about other people's prices. The basic rule with such postings is "caveat emptor" If I have a clunker camera and somebody wants to give me several thousand simoleans knowing well it is a clunker, I don't see the need for any interjection by anybody else in the process. (Sounds like you might want to explore a career with the ISO organization in Switzerland :))

[bobatkins]

I don't think there's anything wrong with posting a comment in cases where there's an obvious problem, such as someone selling an item for more than it can be purchased for brand new from B&H. In that case you may help a buyer to avoid a bad deal and you may help the seller in putting an appropriate price on something (and so having a chance of selling it).

 

I don't think it's appropriate to comment that an item is overpriced if it's $500 new, being sold for $450 and you only think it's worth $400. I don't think it's appropriate for anyone to set themselves up as the "price police" either and actually go looking for problems.

 

Photo.net is supposed to be a community where people help each other, not just a cut throat marketplace like ebay or the rip-off stores you find in New York City.

[WJT]

Hi Pablo! Your consideration for the well-being of another is a trait that is disappearing from society. I would say that if you absolutely know that the transaction is a scam, and have proof of dishonesty, then post a comment alerting potential victims. On the other hand, if it is an honest sale, I would let the market determine the price and stay out of the transaction. Regards.

[davecollopy]

I believe proper etiquette dictates that you politely notify the seller, not the potential buyer, via email. He may not be aware what the market will bear. If he then knowingly chooses to overprice his goods, that is well within his right to do so.

[pablo_s]

Thank you all for taking the time to reply. I generally agree with your opinions. However, I think that the market works best when both sellers and buyers are informed (though it should be their own responsibility to get informed). I was thinking of cases when the item was very clearly overpriced with respect to market conditions, not gray areas. If I want to do something I'll probably just e-mail the seller as Dave suggests.

[dan_long]

I, like others who have read this, have a problem with "informing" either the seller or the buyer of a price that is too high. I read your post a few times to make sure what to respond to. You do not indicate whether the item being offered for sale is "online". If it is not, then either photo.ent or ebay as market references are irrelevant from the sellers point of view, and maybe many buyers. Contrary to what most of us reading this believe, most of the rest of the world is not online, and the market price for various goods offered elsewhere carries no relationship to a similar item offered online. As an example, if all of my photo equipment shopping is done in a store front, then my market price exposure is different than yours may be online. This can either be of my own choosing, if I prefer to see items face to face, or by my own ignorance of the online world.

 

If the item is online, then anyone viewing it probably has done a little research online, perhaps moreso than a new or inexperienced seller. By adding a comment to inform potential buyers, you risk making an otherwise innocent, but perhaps less than knowledgable seller appear unscrupulous. I assume you have no desire to do this. Informing the seller is the only "courteous" way of proceeding, as you really don't put him at odds with the future market by shading his intentions to the public.

 

In addition, ebay and other online services aside, market prices for various products can vary by incredible amounts from region to region, based upon how you define markets that are smaller than what are served by for instance, ebay, which we all assume to be worldwide.

Speaking as one who has faced your same moral dilemma, I opt to let the market make its own corrections. People come and go, and gain experience along the way. The market wouldn't be what it is at any given time if everyone were equally informed.

 

Finally, make sure before you act that the specific item at issue is not something special or has some rare feature that has missed your eye, thereby making it more valuable

 

No offense intended, as moral dilemmas are by nature a good thing, until one takes action.

[mottershead]

I think Bob had the right answer. photo.net allows people to comment on ads. That capability can be used for any purpose that a member of the community thinks is reasonable; for example, to give advice to potential buyers on what to look for, or to alert buyers to suspicious aspects of an offer, such as a price that is either too high or too low. Sellers have access to the comment button also, and can use it to justify their prices, etc, if challenged. If an environment is created here in which dishonest sellers don't want to sell, that is fine. If photo.net starts to look too much like a seller-unfriendly environment, then people won't sell their stuff here. So keep that in mind, too.

[Landrum Kelly]

Although it is not the same problem, I wish that there were some way that we could alert each other about the scams on the sites of many camera sellers. There are some true rip-off artists out there, some of whom deliberately obscure model variations (how much buffer memory in a digicam, for example), or who offer decent prices on cameras but really nail people on accessories.

 

I know that the prospective buyer is primarily responsible for comparing prices and specs. Caveat emptor is an established concept, but I see no reason why reasonable alerts cannot occasionally be posted. I share Brian's concern that this kind of practice could get out of control, but in the case of an obvious rip-off, I see no problem.

[nomade]

First of all, define what you call "market" and you'll have the answer. Wich market? Asia market? Europe market? E-market?

 

I bought my Nikon F65 in 2001 for arround $500 in Spain, but back in Argentina I noticed that the same kit was offered as high as $1200, due to retailers and importing taxes. Point and shoot cameras here in Venezuela are in average 50% higher priced than every on-line seller like B&H are offering them, I don't know way... Then you have different markets, i.e. different countries, same product, but different prices.

 

If you want to do the right thing, think twice first, cause if you do what you stated above, you might be hurting sellers legitimate interests, and probably you'd be doing the wrong, not the right, thing.

 

Anyway, as many stated above, everybody has the right to state their opinions, and of course the seller has also the right to replicate.

[kathywilson]

Short answer - no. There are too many other factors you have no knowledge of, and "caveat emptor" rules. If you're buying something online you should be doing some research as to price/availability/reputation, same as in the offline world. I can't tell you how many times I've seen someone pay more for a used product on eBay than they can get it brand new from elsewhere online, and all it would have taken was 5 minutes of research. If they can't be bothered to do that, why should I take time to do it for them? Heartless? Cruel? I don't think so -- they're happy with what they got after all, and I'm happy to have bought it for less elsewhere.

 

A true scam is something else -- but be sure of your facts. Just because it looks like a scam doesn't mean it is, and looking pure as the snow is no guarantee you won't be ripped off. Due diligence makes the difference. "Caveat emptor"

[mottershead]

Caveat emptor rules even here; but one of the things that distinguishes this site from others is that people can comment on practically anything that is posted, including an ad. If that works properly, then it means that sellers are vetted by the community to some degree and (one hopes) people may feel that buying something through a photo.net ad from a recognized member of the community is slightly safer than buying elsewhere. Of course eBay has its own reputation mechanism, too.

[john falkenstine]

Brian, all seems to be based on the assumption that folks who post items for sale ALL tend to be dishonest moneygrubbers and that others have elected themselves as being the know-alls of the "REAL" price of the item without any need to prove their credibility...to protect the gullible suckers. My viewpoint is that if such a party ruins an honest sale, just like the seller, they need to be held accountable.

[scott_fleming1]

You must be talking about the guy trying to sell his Rollei outfit for $13k.

 

I was tempted to post a big BWA HA HA HA!!!! but I thought it best to keep my yap shut

and mind my own business.

[o._i.]

"Caveat Emptor" springs to mind, as well as "a fool and his money are soon parted". Even if you tell them they might not listen. You can't save all the stray cats and dogs in the world.