jbs Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 This is an adult site. For adults. If Images for children are what you want got to a childrens site or filter these images for yourself......;)......J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WJT Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 Hi Anne. I know your question has already been answered, but I would just like to cast my vote (once again) for the addition of a filter to the TRP. Another previous, and long, thread on this subject can be found here: <a href="http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=006vlC " >FILTERED GALLERY</a> . As you can see you are not alone in your quandry. <p> This past week I attended a very informative mandatory staff meeting at my office concerning sexual harassement in the workplace. My company is a very large, progressively thinking leader in its industry. But viewing Photonet's TRP under certain circumstances at the office could be a risky business. So much so, that I will not view the TRP at work. And the reason is not that there are any "prudes" wandering about but, rather, that the TRP could be considered a form of harassement. A method to filter the TRP would be most welcome. <p> But this was all said before, hasn't it? Regards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobatkins Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 Walter - I've been in your position. However the company position is that you probably shouldn't be browsing photo.net at work, and even if that is allowed, you shouldn't be browsing sites likely to display potentially objectionable content. You know that's the situation with photo.net, so it's up to you. What if photo.net installed a "filter". Suppose photo.net said that images on the TRP would be controlled by that filter and anything posted under a "nudes" or "adult" category would be filtered out. That depends on everyone classifying their images correctly. Supose someone doesn't. Suppose they post porn in the "landscapes" category. Suppose you're "safely" browsing the "filtered" TRPs when your boss comes in and looks over your shoulder. Suppose he sees an image of someone having sex with a goat. Suppose you get fired. Who are you going to blame? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bens Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 suppose photo.net exercises some leadership, states where the line is (i would draw one at sex acts for example) and makes clear that when called to its attention it will remove those photos that its terms of posting make clear are unacceptable or inproperly posted? it doesn't have to catch all of them, or state it will catch all of them to establish a standard. personally, whether or not a child is viewing the site with me, i don't enjoy participating in a site that sits on its hands as photos of people engaged in sex acts are posted, however "artfully depicted." bob, i've got alot of respect for you and the other site managers, but on this one, your statements read as an effort to avoid the issue and a cop out of any responsibility at all for the management of the content of this site. sure its a hard call to make, but by being in your position, you are required to make it. make it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bens Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 and bob if you are suggesting photo.net would get sued by a disgruntled ex-employee because the employee voluntarily viewed the site at work, that is a very far-fetched and unlikely scenario and you can always deal with this hypothetical in your terms of viewership and any membership agreements. how does stating your standards, with the explicit disclaimer that you cannot actively "patrol" the site but will act within a reasonable period of time when items are called to your attention, increase your potential liability any more than it exists now for the same thing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike dixon Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 Ben, from reading the terms of use, and from the moderators regular deletion of content they deem inappropriate, it's quite clear that there is a "line" and that photo.net management exercises leadership in enforcing it. That line may not be drawn exactly where you want it to be, but that does not mean that photo.net management is not behaving in a responsible manner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bens Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 thanks mike. i am reacting to bob's comments in this post, given that the photo cited by steve depicts sex acts and i've seen at least one other posted in the past week as i said. where is the line? i read bob's comments (not bob) as dismissive and noncommital and so am asking them to state where the line is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobatkins Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 As I keep saying, I don't make policy here. I don't normally get asked for my advice and I don't normally give it. I'm simply repeating what Brian has said in the past for those who aren't aware of past discussions. My position is neutral. I can see both sides. It's also not my ass that's on the line if there is ever a real problem, nor, of course, it it yours. I don't object to nudes here, in fact I think they can be a perfectly valid artform. I would not like to see them banned and I don't really want to see them penned off in their own area, which would probably only encourage more of the images that are a problem. If I were the chief censor here I'd remove about 50% of the nudes on the grounds that they are unsuitable for this site for either reasons of pornographic content or total lack of photographic talent, but I'm not the chief censor, in fact short of finding anything that looks to be illegal, I'm not a censor in the gallery at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WJT Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 Mr Atkins, did I not just state that I would not be viewing the TRP at work? Therefore, I would not be "blaming" anyone other than myself. And you already have cautionary disclaimers concerning mature content, so Photonet would hardly be at any risk. But beyond that, my work is associated with the visual arts and surfing Photonet can be legitimately construed to be a relevant site to visit. Even if only in my free time at the office (for example, at lunch). To be fair, Mottershead made a big improvement in the TRP, as far as this thread is concerned, when he changed the default view. But a problem still exists when a casual viewer on this site can stumble upon images of prolapsed rectums, dead teenagers with their bleeding guts slit open, women fellating men, et cetra ad nauseum. Did I mention that this was all said before? Regards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbs Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 Oh BTW Anne, I don't get to watch that cool forensic show on tv while my children are awake because of the violence. But I don't think it resonable for me to expect them to change the amount of violence depicted on account of my family situation. I would love to share all that cool forensic stuff with my eldest daughter but mommy won't let that happen....;)....J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bens Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 oh, so bob does not make policy but responds for brian, who is silent, and we are to read old threads to find out the present position, and no one will say if the photo depicting a sex act called to your attention in this thread by steve is or is not acceptable content for this site, and of course, in the meantime, the photo remains posted . . . i'd like a statement of the site's position on that photograph please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spaghetti_western Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 ben, you could submit a complaint to abuse@photo.net on the off chance that no one had previously complained about the photo. however, have you considered that the site already has examined the photo and decided that it, like other 'sex act' photos you havent seen, 'passes' as artistic erotica (in this case, it is in non-closeup and scenic silhouette, so its very photographic) rather than cheap graphic shock porn, and so it stays, and therefore is under no obligation whatsoever to publicly justify such a decision simply because you and/or others insist that it do rather than intelligently contemplate why it hasnt? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spearhead Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 Children who are raised seeing everything but having things explained to them will self-censor. Children who are brought up knowing that things are being hidden from them will be much more interested in things that their parents may not deem appropriate. Music and Portraits Blog: Life in Portugal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bens Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 spaghetti, they are under no obligation to do anything, but i can ask and state my views. that after all is feedback. and yes, though i am surprised, if the photo stays up and no position is stated i will have no choice but to assume this site will do nothing about such photographs. i want to put my concern in context though so you understand where i am coming from. i take alot of photos in my community of events, often with regard to my kids' schools, youth sports and the like. people i don't know well, sometimes related to kid events, have started to become interested in my work and curious about whether i can handle certain situations, and i've started referring them to my portfolio here and to photo.net generally. i don't feel comfortable doing either if the site is going to display sex act photos. so i would like to understand the site's position on such photos. while i have my view about them, i'm less interested in debating the point than hearing the site's position clearly stated now, in light of the examples discussed in this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbs Posted October 30, 2004 Share Posted October 30, 2004 Um, Ben.....You have been around for two years, do you not know what this site is about? What I see is freedom of expression through photography. If those you would send here are not open minded enough to roam around here then use your own website to show off your work....;)....Jay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bens Posted October 31, 2004 Share Posted October 31, 2004 uh jay, its not until this week that i've seen photos of explicit blow jobs displayed on this site. that to me is pornography however artfully displayed and it alters my opinion of the site and its utility to the negative if the site's position is that it will do nothing about the display of photos like that in things like the general critique requests file. but jay, i'm not asking for a debate,i'm asking for a statement of the site's position. we can all do as we see fit once its stated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bens Posted October 31, 2004 Share Posted October 31, 2004 and for clarity's sake, i don't think the photo steve referred to offered for critique; it was the other photo i referred to in previous messages above that was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbs Posted October 31, 2004 Share Posted October 31, 2004 Ben my point is that even if this image is taken down on monday there is another around the corner that may take a day or so to remove so.... there will alwaysbe material like that floating around.... "You may well read or view any given posting or photo before anyone on the photo.net staff does. You may see material that is defamatory, abusive, obscene, offensive, threatening, illegal, or inappropriate for children, before we have seen it and have had the opportunity to remove it. For this reason, if you are a parent, you should carefully monitor your children's access to the Site. If you do encounter material that you believe falls into one of these categories, we urge you to report it to us so that we may remove it. But We may not be able to remove it as promptly as You think we should." The last line goes to my point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbs Posted October 31, 2004 Share Posted October 31, 2004 And I have only been here since feb. but I have always seen explicit material pop up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul e. wog Posted October 31, 2004 Share Posted October 31, 2004 Can't understand what you are going on about. That photo is hidden away in some port, not like its gonna jump out of your screen. And by your own definition "i've seen photos of explicit blow jobs displayed on this site. that to me is pornography however artfully displayed"...you do admit its "art" and i quite agree. It certainly not porn in my view. Its a silouette and has no DOF..like a shadow. Just like in clouds some see dogs, cats or bj's...its just your own perception. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cghubbell Posted October 31, 2004 Share Posted October 31, 2004 How about a solution that keeps things "as they are" unless the user opts-in to the change? For example, in the user's preferences allow the user to select what genres they want to ignore, and include an "adult" attribute. there would also be a street, landsacpe, etc. attribute to level the playing field. This would cut down considerably on the more shocking content if someone chose to do so. I respect nudes and erotic as art forms, but with the latter especially I personally don't enjoy viewing it. I think it would be a great enhancement if the site could help me to focus on the photographic styles which most inspire me, and ignore those which disupt my experience. Similarly, if you don't like nature shots, you would be able to ignore those categories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobatkins Posted October 31, 2004 Share Posted October 31, 2004 <em>"oh, so bob does not make policy but responds for brian, who is silent, and we are to read old threads to find out the present position, and no one will say if the photo depicting a sex act called to your attention in this thread by steve is or is not acceptable content for this site, and of course, in the meantime, the photo remains posted . . . i'd like a statement of the site's position on that photograph please." </em> <p> The site's policy is very clearly stated in the Terms of Use. If you bothered to read it you wouldn't be so confused. <p> <em>... You may see material that is defamatory, abusive, obscene, offensive, threatening, illegal, or inappropriate for children, before we have seen it and have had the opportunity to remove it. For this reason, if you are a parent, you should carefully monitor your children's access to the Site. If you do encounter material that you believe falls into one of these categories, we urge you to report it to us so that we may remove it. But We may not be able to remove it as promptly as You think we should...</em> <p> I'd add that just because You think it should be removed does not mean that The Site will agree with you. IF you report objectionable material AND The Site agrees it is objectionable THEN it will be removed WHEN The Site has a chance to do so. <p> There's a lot of stuff I'd remove, but I'm not the Site. I accept the Terms of Use. As is stated in the Terms of Use - "<em>If You do not agree to these Terms and Conditions, do not use the Site"</em>. <p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bens Posted October 31, 2004 Share Posted October 31, 2004 bob, i am not interested in reporting things that MIGHT be abusive. i am interested in understanding where this site OFFICIALLY draws the line in order to determine my association with it and am asking this site to state whether or not the depiction of sex acts such as in the photo referred to by Steve is or is not appropriate content for this site. this is because i have not found a statement, including in the thread you referred to in your message or in any posting by this site, which establish whether or not this is appropriate content. the site may or may not consider sex act photos inappropriate in their entirety; that they will evaluate them on a case by case basis; that they may be posted by not sought for critique; or whatever. i would simply like to know what the site's position is. NOTHING you have said or referred me to provides this information. i seek this clarification because it will guide my use of this site and whether or not i will refer people to this site. if you are not the person to make this clarification, i would appreciate your letting who ever is responsible for stating the site's position and let them know about this thread. thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bens Posted October 31, 2004 Share Posted October 31, 2004 by the way bob, i have read the terms of use and the thread you referred to above. let me try to be as clear as possible so you can understand what i am seeking. hopefully, that will save you from leaving another nonresponsive message. i am requesting that the site's responsible person state this site's view as to whether or not photos depicting sex acts, such as depicted in the photo referred to by steve, are or are not objectionable material to the site. perhaps the site's policy is not to state its policy. whatever! but the issue having been pointed out, i'd appreciate a statement in response. i hope i've now made this clear enough for you to understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spaghetti_western Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 ben it is clear that the site wont and should not decree arbitrarily about any 'class' of photos otherwise theyd have to respond and explain nit hairs ad infinitum 24/7 so two words of advice CAVEAT EMPTOR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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