always_wanderlust Posted November 8, 2004 Share Posted November 8, 2004 I've been shooting slides and digital mostly, but now I would like to try my hands on some B & W Films. I don't know much about it at all, but I would like to develop it myself - I have a Jobo ATL-1 that I develop E-6 on. I would like some fine grained film that I will mostly use on static objects (chairs, rocks, metalic objects, etc.,) so good texture is my wish. There used to be a guy here that did fine art photography of static simple things - Silver ..... something, but now I can't find any of his posts (he was using RB67). He had posted on his site the films he used on his photographs and I would like to use some of the films he's using.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manjo Posted November 8, 2004 Share Posted November 8, 2004 I am pretty new to BW myself, I develop and print my own now and I am getting LOTS of help from this forum. I was told to stick to one film during this learning process. I dont like grain and dont like fast film. So I am using Ilford delta Pro 100 and PanF 50. I have started making notes of exposure & filter arrangements. I have had pretty good results as far as processing and printing goes but the learning contuinues. My advice is what ever film you chose stick with it till you get it down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nathan_dandar Posted November 8, 2004 Share Posted November 8, 2004 I'll give you advice from my (relatively) limited experience. I process in a little cheap Jobo plastic tank you can get for a few bucks anywhere. Nothing automated. Hand inversion. I'm not familiar with your processing setup. Sorry. B&W developing is so easy, it's a joke. You shouldn't have any problems. If you can control the lighting, the "new" tabular grain films (Kodak's Tmax line and Ilford's Delta line) can offer fine grain in their 100-speed offerings. I dislike the tonality of 100TMX for everyday shots though.. it's really designed for studio use where lighting is controlled. Kodak has Technical Pan (get it right now before all remaining stock is gone since it has been discontinued) which is usually shot at 25 and has ridiculously small grain and can offer fine tonality with some work. I adore Ilford Pan F, myself. Normally ISO 50, very fine grain, great look for portraits in my opinion, etc. This will be discontinued soon as well so snatch some up if you wish to test. For a little more speed and not a lot more grain, I prefer Ilford FP4+ (125) over Kodak Plus-X (also 125). I'd probably say pick up a few rolls of Pan F and FP4+ and have at it. Overall, I've found Kodak Xtol developer to be the best all-around, jack of all trades developer as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronald_moravec1 Posted November 8, 2004 Share Posted November 8, 2004 I recommend Delta 100 or T Max 100. Use EI 80 for either. Develope 6.5 min in D76 full strength. Agitate 5 sec/30 for the Kodak or 10 sec/60 for ILFORD. Mix the D76 stiring in as little air as possible. Allow to cool and store in small one time use bottles filled to the top. Do not allow to sit in half full bottles or it will deteriorate fast, but first will become very active. Good for six months in full bottles in the dark. GLASS bottles. Check Specialty Bottles as a source. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim_appleyard Posted November 8, 2004 Share Posted November 8, 2004 Nathan, where did you hear from that Pan-F was being discontinued? I missed that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Luttmann Posted November 8, 2004 Share Posted November 8, 2004 Jim, I'd like to get some info on the Pan F issue as well. I've seen rumours, but nothing in print. Anyone out there have anything on this topic. Thanks, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al_divenuti Posted November 8, 2004 Share Posted November 8, 2004 Concerning the future of PanF+, the link below is to a discussion on APUG... http://www.apug.org/forums/showthread.php?t=8929&highlight=Ilford+Discontinue The post cites information from the (alleged) French director of Ilford Marketing. I have no idea what grade of rumor this qualifies as... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmc Posted November 8, 2004 Share Posted November 8, 2004 Adonis, Try this web site. It has Silver.... Great stuff. Id say this is the one you are looking for. http://www.celluloidandsilver.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
always_wanderlust Posted November 8, 2004 Author Share Posted November 8, 2004 Whoa! That's it! Thanks Greg, I love the texture and tonality of his pics.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ken_hughes4 Posted November 8, 2004 Share Posted November 8, 2004 "really designed for studio use where lighting is controlled" not true, this film is used by many in all situations with fantastic results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lex_jenkins Posted November 9, 2004 Share Posted November 9, 2004 Regarding the alleged discontinuance of Pan F+ or any other material, please either provide substantial evidence to support the claim or don't bother with the insinuations. Rumors and allegations from other websites do not qualify as credible evidence. Much as I admire and respect the folks on apug, some of them are just as likely as we to report rumors incorrectly. Repetition of an incorrect report will not make it any more correct. I'm going to start deleting them outright and without my usually polite e-mail explaining why I've altered, editing, modified or deleted someone's post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raczoliver Posted November 9, 2004 Share Posted November 9, 2004 Well, I don't know about other parts of the world, but on the Chinese market, Ilford's XP2 plus and the whole PAN line (PAN F plus, PAN100 and PAN400) will disapperar. No more supplies are coming. The dealers have been informed by Ilford, and I don't know why would the dealers (several) say so if it weren't true. As for if this affects the rest of the world, or Ilford only found there was no need for these films on the Chinese market,....... The rest of their lineup will keep on coming at around 20% higher prices than before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_waller Posted November 9, 2004 Share Posted November 9, 2004 I use Ilford Delta 100 almost exclusively, rating it at 50 ASA and devving in Rodinal, 1:50, 20 C, 8 minutes. Four inversions in the first 30 seconds then one inversion every 30 seconds after that. And I give a 2 minute pre-soak. I use Kodak Indicating Stop bath and Ilford Hypam Rapid Fixer. Now, as a matter of course, I double-fix my negs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frank.schifano Posted November 9, 2004 Share Posted November 9, 2004 B&H certainly has stocks of PanF+ and FP4+ in 35mm and 120 formats. Both are good, but unless you plan very large prints from 35mm, I'd go with the FP4+. PanF+ can give you very harsh looking prints if you are not very careful about your lighting. FP4+ has more latitude and less contrast than PanF+. Download the pdf tech sheets from Ilford at http://www.ilford.com/html/us_english/bw.html and look at the characteristic curves for each film and you will see what I mean. Kodak's Plus-X falls somewhere in the middle. If you need more contrast from FP4+, you can always up the development time a bit, print on a harder grade paper, or use a higher grade VC filter. If you like the idea of PanF+, and you want to save a few bucks, look to Freestyle for the Arista Pro line of films. I've read in a few places that Arista Pro films are re-branded Ilford films and I believe them. My experience with their Pro 400 sheet film tells me that this is true. It behaves exactly like HP5+, and you know what they say, "If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it must be a duck." They say the film is "made in England" and how many film manufacturers are based in England? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lex_jenkins Posted November 9, 2004 Share Posted November 9, 2004 "Oliver Racz , nov 09, 2004; 02:39 a.m.: "Well, I don't know about other parts of the world, but on the Chinese market ... the whole PAN line (PAN F plus, PAN100 and PAN400) will disapperar. No more supplies are coming. The dealers have been informed by Ilford, and I don't know why would the dealers (several) say so if it weren't true... The rest of their lineup will keep on coming at around 20% higher prices than before." =================================== Oliver, with all due respect, again, this is hearsay from a dealer, not official word from Ilford. Dealers have been known to misinterpret or misrepresent what they're told by marketing representatives, who in turn may not be receiving or passing along correct information from corporate offices. Among other reasons besides a demand for accuracy, I want to see factual information posted on these forums rather than hearsay because these rumors can be self-fulfilling. If enough photographers are convinced that a film is no longer available the demand will shrink, making it more rather than less likely that the film will continue to be produced. In my case of everything and anything I've seen and heard locally the only thing I can and will say for certain is that buying Ilford *film* is no longer the bargain it once was. A 35mm roll of 36 exposure HP5+ is only a couple of cents cheaper now than the equivalent in Tri-X. I refuse to speculate on whether that *proves* that Ilford increased their prices or whether local stores responded to increased demand from shocked customers and jacked up the prices for as long as they think they can get away with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob haight Posted November 12, 2004 Share Posted November 12, 2004 Lex, didn't Ilford just announce a few weeks ago the only films going forward are Delta 100, FP4+ and HP+. Pan F and the Infrared are histoire as far as I know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ken_schroeder Posted November 13, 2004 Share Posted November 13, 2004 Adonis, I believe it is important to choose one film and one developer. For static subjects, the best film/developer combination is the one used with a solid tripod. Pick a medium speed film and a gentle developer. (One which is not being discontinued!) After you have exposed and developed 100 rolls, consider if you might want to change or stay with your hard won familiarity. At that point you will have a solid basis of comparison. For the record, my film and developer of choice is Tri X and HC 110. Yes, it is not considered fine grain. However, most of my work is done with 4x5. Keep in mind that part of the technical quality you admire in the 6x7 work is a result of negative size. Experience and careful technique can't hurt either. Simplicity is the key. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Luttmann Posted November 21, 2004 Share Posted November 21, 2004 Bob, Where did you get that information on Pan F? Dave Luttmann Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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