student shifts uneasily contemplating price of tmax 100

[affen_kot]

i've decided to start purchasing some finer grain B/W film for my

4x5; and in researching various films under 400 speed, i've noticed

the rather large pricing difference - at least in my area - between

ilford FP4 125 and kodak Tmax 100. at 45 euros, a box of Tmax

weighs in at just under three times the price of any comparably

packaged ilford sheet film at the shop; and my question is: why is

that? having only used these two films in 35mm, and being familiar

with both but not intimate with either, i was wondering if any

passersby had some thoughts on the subject. thanks in advance for

any thoughts or recommendations. cheers...affen

[silent1]

T-Max 100 is one of the fussiest B&W negative films there is in terms of exposure and development; it takes considerable practice and testing, and possibly even a change in the way you meter, to get it right -- but when you do, it just about sings.

 

That said, you may or may not like the songs it sings; for my money, I'd rather shoot twice as much FP4 (or Plus-X, but Kodak has apparently dropped that emulsion from 4x5). And you might or might not find TMX better than FP4 even when completely dialed in -- Kodak products routinely cost more than their competitors from either England, Germany, or Japan, and they still sell on the name and the history.

 

It's really too bad Foma and Efke don't make inch size films -- if you like FP4, you'd probably greatly enjoy Fomapan 100, and it should cost you about a third less than what the Ilford is running. Maybe you can get some 9x12 cm holders for your camera (the ANSI ones fit the same back), and try a box of the Foma. I get it in the US from JandCPhoto.com for $22 for a box of 50; it's likely you can get it direct from fotoimpex.de for less, and shipping is supposed to be simplified in the EU -- right?

[david_matuszek]

You can get Efke 100 and 25 in 4x5 sheat film from J and C photo in the US so i am sure you can some place in europe. I shot 50 sheats of it over the past month and I found the Efke 100 to be a great film. It has a very unique look I can't quite describe, but it's worth a shot.

[jay_de_fehr]

I'm a big believer in cheap film, especially for LF. The Ultrafine 125 sheet film from Photowarehouse is as good as any film I've ever used and a lot cheaper, which means that I can shoot a lot more of it, which is more important to me than the subtle differences in spectral response, gradation or grain in films of a common speed range. In EU there's photoimpex, if you don't want to ship from U.S. Buy cheap and shoot often.

[conrad_hoffman]

Unfortunately, Kodak seems determined to price themselves out of the market. FP4+ is a great film, and TMX, especially in LF, isn't worth three times the price. Or two. Or one and a half.

[affen_kot]

thanks a ton for the tip on Efke film. sure indeed, impex.de has 50 sheets of Efke 100 for half the price of 25 sheets of TMX. just the right price for my purposes. by the way, in your experience with Efke stock, did you guys ever shoot Efke 100 at 50 speed instead; and if so, how did it behave? thanks for the thoughts. cheers...affen

[affen_kot]

i dig your gravestone photo, conrad... gather ye rosebuds while ye may.

[brian_ellis3]

I don't know where you live but in the U.S. there's nothing like the price difference between the twofilms that you mention. A box of 50 sheets of 4x5 T Max 100 lists for $41.95 at B&H. A box of 25 sheets of FP4+ 4x5 lists for $17.95 so 50 sheets would be $36 compared to $42 for T Max 100 or a $6 difference, nothing like triple. Are you sure you were taking the different number of sheets in a box into consideration?

[brian_c._miller]

Affen, what is the price of Agfa where you live? Here in the US its much cheaper than Kodak or Ilford.

[gauthier]

Yeah, but Agfa recently decided to leave the LF market. No more APX 100 in 4x5 size!

[oskar_ojala]

TMax is very fine grain, finer than FP4+, but in 4x5" I don't care; both are sufficiently fine grained. They have different tonality and properties though, so the choíce needs to be made based on that.

[felix_ackermann]

I'm reading with the highest interest and I hope that there will be more practice reports concerning TMax100 versus FP4plus.

 

For 24x36 mm and principally for 6x6 cm TMax100 was my standard film for many years (before I used FP4) - but for LF (4'x5' and 8'x10') I'm seriously considering changing to FP4plus.

 

My photographic teacher (who generously presented me his whole, huge LF-Sinar-equipment) was never at ease with TMax100 for LF and used mainly TMax400 in the last years of his professional activity - that is an additional reason for me to change...

 

I'm not a professional photographer; only with +/- 10% of my photographs I earn a little money; the rest is dedicated to professional reasons on my own account and for pleasure. So the price for the material is an important argument...

I know this sounds weird, but I'm in the situation that I own a huge, high class equipment far beyond my economic background...

 

So I wouldn't be too unhappy to read arguments for economic film!

[tadge_dryja]

Yeah, I always shot TMX in 35mm, I think the diminished appearance of grain is really helpful when you're trying to push 35mm up beyond 8x10.

 

However, given the price of TMX, and all kodak films in fact in 4x5, I've never shot any that weren't given to me. I usually use HP5, and FP4.

 

In my prints from 4x5, I can't even tell the difference between *HP5* and FP4. Given this, I don't think there's any way I'd see a difference between TMX and FP4. Maybe if they were 40x50" enlargements. Maybe.

[affen_kot]

upon second inspection, the abovementioned prices are for 25 sheets of FP4 and 20 (!) sheets of TMX. brian e?s price quotes unfortunately stoke my arguable suspicion that just about everything photographic to be found in Vienna is marked at nearly double what I would be charged in the states.

 

i'm still curious as to why even ilford -within the EU - is twice the price.

 

that said, a student?s curiosity over 2-euro-per-sheet-film gives way to budgets and disposable income levels, meaning that i?m compelled to save the uptown TMX for a time when I?m shooting with more consistency.

 

thanks for all of the thoughts. cheers!?affen

[richard baznik]

Are you sure the box of 20 exposures of Tmax is not Kodak's Readyload format? That format comes 20 to the box, vs. their plain sheet film, and it's much more expensive.

[affen_kot]

that's a very good question; the shop's site doesn't specify. it just labels the tmax as 4x5 'blatt,' which means 'leaf/sheet' in german. considering that in the physical shop, i remember seeing several shelves of readyload stock, that might be a possible explanation. thanks.

[kirk_keyes]

At least in the USA, if a box of 4x5 film has 20 sheets in it, it is packaged in Readyloads, and the price difference here is similar. I think the smallest size of 4x5 TMAX in sheet only form is 50 sheets.

[bob.]

May I just make one suggestion: Delta 100.

 

Not as fussy as TMX and similarly minute grain.

 

 

Cheers,

[Jochen_S]

As far as I remember Foto Impex at Berlin are selling East European emulsions in 4x5". O.K. 9x12 sheets are cheaper so I got myself some 9x12 holders. I didn't test nothing yet and believe I never shot TMX all my life.