Minolta CLE AE problem

I recently purchased a Minolta CLE on ebay that hadnt been used for over 15 years. I got

the camera serviced and although all shutter speeds fired accurately, the AE drastically

overexposed in low light conditions (although in direct sunlight it worked perfectly). My

repair guy isnt sure what to do, so I'm wondering if anyone has had problems with the

CLE's autoexposure and if so, how they fixed it? In case I do need an entirely new circuit

board, does anyone know whats the best way to get one? Thanks.

Hi Lerner,

It could be that the battery used is wrong and the meter needs to be adjusted for the type of battery you are using. This is a common problem with the CL meter and maybe the CLE meter has the same problem. If it is the AE system then you are looking at a larger repair bill.

The AE system of the CLE is taking the reading on the shuttercurtain, from 1/1000 to 1/60 after that the meter "looks" om the film base, the reading is done DURING the exposure not like usual BEFORE.

Typical filmbase is light grey - if the film you are using is darker this could be the problem - the camera are using standard silveroxide batteries.

I dont think Raid is correct in it being a battery problem in that the CLE doesnt take discontinued batteries like the CLE just regular MS76 batteres that are readily available.

Kaj may be closer to the mark here as the cameras metering sydtem does use an average system between what its read off the curtain and what it reads off the film during exposure so some films may throw it off especially at slower speeds. Usually CLE meters are thrown off by bright light sources but that seems to be opposite whats happening here. What I would suggest is sitting with the camera without a film in it and firing it dozens of times and rotating the shutter speed dial back and forth. CLE's dont like sitting idle and the contacts underneath the dial can go a bit whacky if not used. If its been in a box for 15 years it probably needs a workout.

Im not convinced you need a new circuit board at this point. They generally only need to replaced when absolutely nothing works. Replace the batteries to play it safe and use silver oxide batteries not the A76 Alkaline ones. If you still feel it needs to be repaired ask you local Minolta repair agent to send it back to Minolta in Japan. Let me know how you get on.

What Joel says about rotating the speed dial through the speeds several times to "clean"

the contacts is exactly what I had to do when my CLE started acting up on me. It didn't like

speeds below 1/60. The "cleaning" worked. However, this was only in manual mode, ie no

meter. But you never know. Also, couldn't it be that your meter just reacts to low light as it

would in front of a very dark subject, ie overexposing by trying to translate into the

(in)famous 18%

grey? Try compensating under next time. Who knows?

Lerner....it's very hard to know what you mean by 'drastic overexposure' in low light. Are

you judging this by looking at standard machine prints? Standard machine prints will

almost always 'underprint' your low light negative because it sees all that darkness in your

image and automatically tries to compensate it to a middle gray. The machines have auto

exposure meters just like your camera. Between the camera's compensation and the

printer's compensation...you may end up with something much lighter than what you

remember in the scene. If you are seeing very weak, gray shadows in your prints, this may

indeed be the case.

Also....Kaj's statement concerning the camera's 'off-the-curtain' and 'off-the-film'

metering may be relevant. When I first got my CLE, before I even put any film in it, I was

test firing and found that at slow shutter speeds, the meter read out was showing perhaps

1/15, but the shutter sound was clearly more like 1/4 or 1/2. I finally realized that

without film in the camera the actual shutter speed would never be accurate.

Subsequently, with film it was fine. Joel also takes this thinking further by stating that

some film emulsions may be tricking the meter at slow speeds. Are you using negative or

slide film? In any event, try some of the home remedies recommended by others here.

And then try to see if you can work out some compensation routine that's not too much of

a pain. Also, try other film types to see if that is the problem as Joel suggests. In other

words, do the easy things first before looking into major repairs. I've heard that repairs

for this long extinct camera can be difficult and/or pricey. Good luck.

The CLE meter reading operation is a little strange compared to other cameras, a trait it shares with the Olympus OM2 and other "meter reads off the film plane" bodies. In brighter light it takes a reading off the white pattern printed on the shutter curtains: the speed indicated on the display is pretty close to what you'll get. In dimmer light, the actual meter reading gets progressively more mixed, and the less the display speed might match the set AE speed. The display will show a "preview" reading off the white shutter curtain pattern, but as the shutter stays open longer, more of the reading is taken off the uniformly colored film surface.

The discrepancy usually falls in the photographers favor, with the real time reading off the film being more accurate than the preview reading off the curtain. One minor issue in borderline light is the display may show a hand-holdable speed when the actual AE speed set will be slower, and on rare occasions a darker-than-usual film base can fool the meter into overexposure in low light.

In the handheld photography a CLE is mostly used for, the discrepancy in display vs actual AE shutter speeds should normally not exceed one stop, perhaps two at the outside extreme (if the display reads 1/30, it should not fire much slower than between 1/15-1/8). Unfortunately many CLEs do seem to develop a bug as they age, where AE readings consistently go completely wonky below the 1/30th sec changeover point. This requires adjustment or sometimes replacement of circuit parts, which most repair techs are no longer willing to attempt (since spare parts are long unavailable).

Depending on the exact cause of the slow AE problem, you can sometimes fix it for awhile by exercising the shutter speed dial (click thru and fire all the manual speeds repeatedly). This helps clear off some of the oxidation that builds up on the contacts, which can alter electrical resistance and affect the AE system/display LEDs. If your viewfinder display LEDs tend to flicker or dance up and down the scale or get stuck on the bottom arrow, and you often get gross overexposure on films shot indoors, thats a tipoff either the contacts under the shutter dial need cleaning or the meter circuit needs adjustment at lower EV range. Theres also potential for oxidation buildup on the somewhat inaccessible battery compartment cover, and an interaction between normal AE and TTL flash circuits (the flash circuit sometimes need to be "goosed" to stabilize the normal available-light AE).

There are some common myths about the CLE, chief among them being the "every malfunction means it needs a new circuit board, but parts are no longer available" boilerplate excuse many repair techs throw out to avoid dealing with it. While its a unique one-off rangefinder camera, service adjustments are not that different from popular Minolta SLRs of the same period like XG or X700 (the CLE uses similar but not identical circuits/parts). Sadly most rangefinder techs simply refuse to touch it, more out of disdain for electronics than any real difficulty, while techs who normally handle classic SLRs are afraid of it just because its a rare rangefinder that most have never laid eyes on.

The CLE meter reading operation is a little strange compared to other cameras, a trait it shares with the Olympus OM2 and other "meter reads off the film plane" bodies. In brighter light it takes a reading off the white pattern printed on the shutter curtains: the speed indicated on the display is pretty close to what you'll get. In dimmer light, the actual meter reading gets progressively more mixed, and the less the display speed might match the set AE speed. The display will show a "preview" reading off the white shutter curtain pattern, but as the shutter stays open longer, more of the reading is taken off the uniformly colored film surface.

 

The discrepancy usually falls in the photographers favor, with the real time reading off the film being more accurate than the preview reading off the curtain. One minor issue in borderline light is the display may show a hand-holdable speed when the actual AE speed set will be slower, and on rare occasions a darker-than-usual film base can fool the meter into overexposure in low light.

 

In the handheld photography a CLE is mostly used for, the discrepancy in display vs actual AE shutter speeds should normally not exceed one stop, perhaps two at the outside extreme (if the display reads 1/30, it should not fire much slower than between 1/15-1/8). Unfortunately many CLEs do seem to develop a bug as they age, where AE readings consistently go completely wonky below the 1/30th sec changeover point. This requires adjustment or sometimes replacement of circuit parts, which most repair techs are no longer willing to attempt (since spare parts are long unavailable).

 

Depending on the exact cause of the slow AE problem, you can sometimes fix it for awhile by exercising the shutter speed dial (click thru and fire all the manual speeds repeatedly). This helps clear off some of the oxidation that builds up on the contacts, which can alter electrical resistance and affect the AE system/display LEDs. If your viewfinder display LEDs tend to flicker or dance up and down the scale or get stuck on the bottom arrow, and you often get gross overexposure on films shot indoors, thats a tipoff either the contacts under the shutter dial need cleaning or the meter circuit needs adjustment at lower EV range. Theres also potential for oxidation buildup on the somewhat inaccessible battery compartment cover, and an interaction between normal AE and TTL flash circuits (the flash circuit sometimes need to be "goosed" to stabilize the normal available-light AE).

 

There are some common myths about the CLE, chief among them being the "every malfunction means it needs a new circuit board, but parts are no longer available" boilerplate excuse many repair techs throw out to avoid dealing with it. While its a unique one-off rangefinder camera, service adjustments are not that different from popular Minolta SLRs of the same period like XG or X700 (the CLE uses similar but not identical circuits/parts). Sadly most rangefinder techs simply refuse to touch it, more out of disdain for electronics than any real difficulty, while techs who normally handle classic SLRs are afraid of it just because its a rare rangefinder that most have never laid eyes on.

Thank you so much for the response and information. Aside from trying to find a tech that can service it, I suppose the most realistic remedy is to just use manual when shooting at slower shutter speeds. While maybe not the most convenient workaround, I do love using the camera and it’s lenses. I will also try cycling through all the speeds in manual mode as suggested. I sure wish they put an AEL button on this camera, or at least the ability to meter in manual mode, but I digress. It’s still a great camera. Thank you again for the detailed info!