Filter Choices for Modern Black & White Film Emulsions?..

Within the next two months I will be entering the, new to me, world of medium

format film photography..

 

I've read many articles by various authors from all over the net (in English) to

learn as much as possible regarding the appropriate filters that can be used for

black & white film photography..

 

The broad categories seem to be as follows:

 

1. Yellow filters comprising the Wratten filter numbers---Light Yellow # 3,

Light Yellow # 6, Yellow # 8; Deep Yellow # 9, Yellow # 12, Dark Yellow # 15

 

2. Yellow-Green filters comprising the Wratten filter numbers---Light

Yellow-Green #11, Yellow-Green #13

 

3. Orange filters comprising the Wratten filter numbers---Yellow Orange #16,

Yellow-Orange #18 (transmits UV & IR only), Orange #21, Red-Orange #22,

Red-Orange #23A

 

4. Red filters comprising the Wratten filter numbers---Red #25, Red #25A, Red

#26, Dark Red #29

 

5. Magenta-Violet filters comprising the Wratten filter numbers---Magenta #30,

Magenta #31, Magenta # 32, Magenta #33, Violet #34A, Dark Violet #36

 

6. Blue Filters comprising the Wratten filter numbers---Light Blue #38B, Blue

#39, Blue #46, Blue #47, Blue #47A, Blue #47B, Blue #48, Dark Blue # 49, Very

Dark Blue # 50

 

7. Blue-Green filters comprising the Wratten filter numbers---Light Blue-Green #

35, Blue-Green #44, Blue-Green #44A

 

8. Green Filters comprising the Wratten filter numbers---Light Green # 52,

Medium Green # 53, Very Dark Green # 54, Green # 55, Very Light Green # 56,

Green # 57, Light Green #57A, Strong Tri-Color Green # 58, Green # 59, Green #

60, Deep Green # 61, Green # 64, Green #65, Green #66, Green # 67A

 

9. Infrared filters comprising the Wratten filter numbers---Red #70 (676 nm),

Dark Yellow-Orange # 72B (605 nm), Dark Yellow-Green #73 (575 nm), Dark Green #

74 (539 nm), Dark Blue-Green #75 (488 nm), Dark Violet # 77 (546nm) (glass plus

gelatin = 580 nm), Dark Violet #77A (546nm) (glass plus gelatin = 582 nm)

 

The above filter numbers & their respective descriptions were taken from the

following web page that I found by Googling "Filters for black & white film

photography"..

 

The majority of these filters are no longer used, except for special-purpose

black & white photography..

 

http://www.jackspecs.com/filters.htm

 

I am aware that modern black & white film emulsions have somewhat reduced the

need for using filters..

 

Some authors claim that ONLY yellow & red filters are now relevant due to the

advances & changes in modern black & white film emulsions..These authors say

that yellow-green, magenta, blue, blue-green, & green filters are no longer

necessary..

 

Any opinions as to what color filters are relevant with modern emulsions?..

 

Back in the day I carried a Yellow #8,an Orange #21, a Red #25, & a Green filter

that was what I now believe was probably a Yellow-Green #13..

 

I mostly used the Yellow #8 & the Red # 25 filters; only ocassionally using the

orange & green filters..

 

For those PN members that currently & regularly expose black & white film---What

filters, if any do you use?..

 

What would you recommend as a "basic filter kit" for someone re-entering black &

white film photography?..

 

After I get some time & experience under my belt exposing & developing 120 black

& white film---What filters from the above list would you think might be fun to

purchase & play with?..Please state your reasons for choosing a "fun" filter..

 

Thanks for any & all responses!!..

 

Bruce

I don't believe that modern Film require any less filtration than older films. I carry and use a Red filter (for darkening blue skies) , Orange (for the same thing but not as pronounced), Green filter (for lightening foliage , and darkening the sky), Yellow (for the same as red and Orange, but even less of a effect). I also shoot some B&W infrared and use a darker red for that. I say you start with what you used to use and then adapt it with another filter if you need it. Some people believe that you can do all this with Photoshop after you scan the film in , my thoughts are its better to have it in the Neg to begin with.

I will disagree with Michael here. I don't think filters are necessary for black and

white photography these days unless you have a specific look you are going for.

Filters were originally designed to help correct orthochromatic film to allow them to

show natural looking skies. Almost all current films are panchromatic and do not

require filtration. That said, adding a filter will still have an effect. In most cases it

will generally add contrast. I rather would do this in the darkroom than by adding a

filter. I used to use orange and red filters on occasion, but I found that they could

often blow out highlights that I did not necessarily want blown (particularly details in

clouds). By doing the filtration in the darkroom, I can control the level of contrast

more carefully.

How would a filter blow out a highlight? You are doing that with your exposure choice.

 

"Almost all current films are panchromatic and do not require filtration" That really makes little sense, filters are you useful way to create the image that you want. No film "requires" anything, the requirements come from the results you want to obtain.

Filter are jsut as useful toady as they were 50 years. Look at Ansel Adams' work from the 60's.

 

Just run your own tests. Find an outdoor scene and use yellow, orange , and red filters. Look at the results. Pick your filter.

 

I use Yellow 12 filtesr or Red 25 with Ilford HP5. Works fo me.

 

If the sky is overcast & gey the filters have no effect and I take them off. But if the sky is blue let the fun begin.

Hi Bruce.

That probably doesn't answer your question, but this site http://www.acecam.com/magazine/filters-faq.html has quite useful information. By the way the link on your post doesn't work.

To judge the effect load some colour images into photoshop and use the b&w conversion tool, this lets you try every filter you could ever want.

 

I use an orange filter by far the most. It darkens the sky a reasonable amount and makes clouds stand out.

 

Occasionally red for more pronounced darkening of the sky, red is often too much

 

Rarely a green for lightening foliage when I want to make a plant stand out from rocks etc.

 

Yes you can print with more contrast but you can change the relationship of the tonal values between different things in the darkroom.

The correct link is http://www.jackspcs.com/filters.htm

 

Sorry about the mistake!!..

 

I added an e to the description where none was needed..

 

Bruce

Filters are absolutely appropriate for today's B&W films.....whether you use the wet darkroom or Photoshop. Michael's kit is exactly what I use in 35mm, med and large format. Some films, however, do react to filters in different ways. For instance, Ilford XP4 seems to be tonally the same as Tri-X with a yellow filter.

the BIG difference today is that COLOR films are less affected by off, or strange colors when the eye does not see it.

 

with a slr, using a filter and B&W film can be annoying as you are looking thru green or orange or yellow.

 

with an older rf camera this is not the problem.

 

the worst thing is that the filter sits there at the extreme end of the lens.

if a camera was MADE that way, it would be said " that model is too subject to flare" This applies to folks who always cover the lens with a UV filter to "protect it"

 

If you use a filter you MUST use a lens shade.

aside from that I agree, but today photographers may not be as careful

or unwilling to use a filter when it would improve the photo.

everything seems to move at a faster pace.

I carry only an orange (O2) filter but do not use it 99.95% of the time.

 

25 years ago I used to always carry yellow, orange, green, red, ND & POL. And I was using one almost all the time.

 

My lenses have not changed. Nor do I think the film has changed much. I have just come to the realization that all those filters did not do anything positive for my photography. They did add an element of complexity that I once equated with doing better work. Now I have come to appreciate simplicity.

I often use filters when shooting B&W film. THere just any other practical way to get the effects that filters provide.

"How would a filter blow out a highlight? You are doing that with your exposure

choice.

<P>

"Almost all current films are panchromatic and do not require filtration" That really

makes little sense, filters are you useful way to create the image that you want. No

film "requires" anything, the requirements come from the results you want to obtain."

 

<P>David -- just in answer to your questions. I found that by using orange or red

filters I would get darker skies and whiter clouds, but at the expense of tonality in

those clouds and skies. This is not an exposure issue because the remainder of the

photo is properly exposed, but the added contrast from the filter would block up the

highlights. As I said in my post, I prefer to control this relationship in printing,

through dodging, burning, split-grade printing or flashing...even bleaching if

necessary. It gives much more precise control than the blanket filtration of a lens

filter. Why apply an orange filter to your entire image when you can just burn your

sky selectively at grade 4 and maintain a normal tonal relationship in the rest of your

image? <P>The second question, referring to panchromatic films is because in the

past, filters were absolutely necessary. Old films were orthochromatic and as such

very insensitive to red. This meant that blue skies were easily washed out, movie

stars' red lipstick came out black and so on. Photographers used colored filters to

compensate for the abnormal sensitivity of the films. As film sensitivity became

panchromatic, many photographers just kept on using filters because they were

used to it or because they liked the new effects they had. But strictly speaking, the

original reason for their use was no longer an issue. <P>Anyway, by all means use

them if you want to, but as I said, they are only useful for specific effects now, not

for correcting film to a normal tonal balance (unless you are using ortho or infrared

film)

Filters are still useful, but can be overdone. Yellow, orange and red filters are progressively stronger in making clouds stand out against the sky, and in reducing haze in a distant scene. Sometimes foliage renders rather darkly, and a yellow-green or green filter can help. Some think that a yellow-green filter aids in a more natural rendition. I suggest taking the photo, both ways, with and without a filter, and seeing which you like best. Also, don't overdo the effect -- white clouds against a black sky gets tiresome if done too often. My favorite filters are yellow and yellow-green. A polarizing filter can also be used. The results will also depend on the film -- many panchromatic films still have excess blue sensitivity relative to human vision -- TMax films are an exception.

Blown highlights, if the shadows are properly placed, is a development issue.

"What would you recommend as a 'basic filter kit'"?

 

You already said it:

 

"Back in the day I carried a Yellow #8,an Orange #21, a Red #25, & a Green filter that was what I now believe was probably a Yellow-Green #13"

 

I use the orange filter the most

Orthochromatic film hasn't been regularly used in 50 years so that's not even worth discussing. For B&W I generally use a No. 8 yellow for virtually all outdoor shooting except when I want to go for more dramatic cloud effects or dramatic contrast maybe in something like weathered barns. Then I go to a No. 25 red. And a polarizer if I need to get rid of reflection on glass or water. I rarely shoot B&W without a filter, except for flash shots and indoors. Even then there is a UV, skylight or clear filter on the lens for protection.

"Orthochromatic film hasn't been regularly used in 50 years so that's not even worth discussing. "

 

Its still used and quite easy to find is both sheet and roll film. Its worth discussing, and using.

Filters have always been as required for panchromatic film as for orthochromatic film. The difference between ortho and pan film lies entirely in their spectral response curves. Filters for each type carry out similar effects ; the aim is still to modify the film's spectral response in order to produce a desired rendition in shades of grey of a (generally) colour original. Only the starting point is different. That's all.

To pretend that the entire array of filters available for B&W film were originally

designed for correction purposes is not accurate. That's why blue and green

filtration are part of the same series as the red, orange and yellow filters. I'm

personally more familiar with the history of cinematography, but from introduction of

panchromatic film stock, cinematographers were using colored filters for artistic

effect. From my readings on early cinematography, most correction issues were

handled in make-up and set dressing, as the film was generally to slow to filter.

 

In terms of using filters, it's easy. First, learn the color wheel and remember which

colors are each other's opposites (complements). Second, understand that filters

are subtractive (not additive) and take away the opposite colors of whatever color

filter you are using. A red filter is actually subtracting specifically cyan but

additionally and to a lesser degree, blue and green.

 

So you can say that a red filter darkens the skies or brightens flesh tones, but it

may be doing more than that depending upon what else is in the frame. By thinking

consciously about the colors involved, you'll be less likely to miss objects in front of

the camera that are going to be affected by the filters. If you just remember "red =

dark sky", you're asking for unpleasant surprises later.

I use mainly a yellow (K2/Wratten 8), and a yellow-green (X0). I occasionally use an orange (G) or a red R25.

Thanks for all the answers..

 

I am learning more with each additional post..

 

I am leaning towards the purchase of a Yellow # 8, a Light Yellow-Green # 11, & a Red # 25 filter..

 

Does anyone have an opinion regarding the use of the Light Yellow # 3 filter as an everyday, stay-on-the-lens filter?..

 

How much effect will this filter have on modern emulsions?..

 

As regards orange filters, if I was going to choose between the Yellow-Orange # 16, the Orange # 21, & the Red-Orange # 22 for my first orange filter; which of the three choices would you choose as your first orange filter?..

 

If I was going to choose between the Light Blue # 38B & the Blue # 47 filters, which would you choose as your first blue filter?..

 

B&W calls the Yellow-Green # 13 filter a green filter, & they offer none of the higher Wratten number green filters as stock choices..

 

This filter looks to the naked eye to be a green filter, although I am sure that spectrally it is indeed a yellow-green filter..

 

As my first choice for a green filter, would you choose the Yellow-Green # 13 filter?..

 

Or special order one of the higher Wratten number green filters as a first choice?..

 

Keep the responses coming, please..

 

I am learning so much from this thread..

 

Bruce

A yellow filter as "every day filter" would be fine. But make it the nr. 8; the lighter variety (in my opinion) is too weak to make a difference.<br><br>The set described earlier (yellow 8, yellow-green 11, orange 16 and red 25) is all you will ever need for B&W. (It's also the set i carry.)<br>You could decide to let the yellow 8 slip, and use the yellow-green 11 instead. This filter also does what a green filter would very well, so (again, in my opinion) no need for a separate green filter.<br>And whether you will use the red 25 a lot depends on taste, since the effect it creates is already quite strong, and not to everyone's liking. Certainly not something to have in the majority of photos.<br><br>A light blue filter would be good, but for colour photography. There is little need for one in B&W.<br>So if you get a light blue balancing filter, and/or a darker blue conversion filter for colour work anyway, these will double as a B&W contrast filter more than well enough.