Cameras in which it is important to set/change shutter speed before/after cocking

<p>As my collection of older cameras grows, I'm getting increasingly nervous about the fact that some of them need the shutter speeds to be changed before cocking, whereas others prefer the shutter speeds to be changed after cocking the shutter. <br>

I often find it difficult to remember which cameras require which approach. Therefore it would be a very helpful reference for all classic camera users if the experts in the group could add to this thread a list of cameras in which it is important to set/change shutter speeds 1) before or 2) after cocking to prevent damage to the shutter mechanism.<br>

Thanks in advance for your help!</p>

<p>Not sure if a list as such exists, but you might search older posts for specific cameras that you have. The Rollei 35/35S/B35 though can be set either before or after, but of course the shutter must be cocked before the lens can be collapsed. I think most twin lens reflexes can work either way.<br>

I'm wondering if this is critical on some of the leaf shutter SLR's.</p>

<p>The only cameras that need a shutter speed selection before cocking seem the leaf shuttered ones offering 1/500sec with twice the spring strength?<br>

FP shuttered ones where the entire knob rotates during winding seem to prefer the speed set after cocking, but maybe I am mixing things up? <br>

For me it was so far quite easy to spot the various kinds with shutter dial either on top of the body, with various distances between shutter speeds as on FED 2 for example or separately cocked leaf shutter like the Super Isolette.<br>

<br />Whast would be examples of confusing cameras?</p>

<p>Hello everyone. You sure picked a duzzy Raj. If you have any of the Former Soviet Union (FSU) 35mm cameras marked as Fed or Zorki, YOU MUST ADVANCE THE FILM / COCK THE SHUTTER before changing the shutter speed. I memorized that matra while waiting for the Zorki 4 last month. Bill</p>

<p>KMZ Narciss slr must cock shutter first, then set speed dial, otherwise the shutter stop working<br>

<img src="http://d6d2h4gfvy8t8.cloudfront.net/18272576-md.jpg" alt="P1030342.JPG" /></p>

<p><strong>Mike</strong> and <strong>Jochen</strong> - thank you! So I'd presume for cameras like the Barnack Leicas (IIIf etc), the process is cock > speed; and for leaf-shutter cameras (eg Kodak Retina, Agfas), it's speed > cock. How about Contax II/IIa and Rolleiflex TLRs, especially when setting the latter to 1/500s?<br>

<strong>Bill</strong> - thanks for the warning - this is good to know!<br>

<strong>Martin</strong> - thanks for adding the Narciss.</p>

<p>If the Rollei has the old scale of shutter progression (broadly, up to and including the 2.8C) it has a Compur Rapid type shutter (regardless of what is engraved or painted on the exterior, which is usually "Synchro Compur"). With such a shutter, you may safely set to or from any speeds but 1/500 before or after cocking it. But it's important not to select, or de-select, 1/500 with the shutter cocked. These shutters use a booster spring for 1/500. When the shutter is cocked it is under tension ,and trying to change the speed may cause damage. It is also essential <strong>not</strong> to set the self timer on the 1/500 speed as it will jam the shutter should you do so. The owners manuals do cover these points, at least the 2.8C one, does.<br>

<br />From the 2.8D Rollei began using the Synchro Compur shutter which has the new shutter progression scale (1/4, 1/8, 1/15, 1/30 and so on). This does not use a booster spring for the 1/500, you may safely select any speed before or after cocking the shutter, and use the timer on any speed but Bulb if you wish.</p>

<p>The Contax II/III can tolerate having its speeds set before or after winding on. But it's a really bad idea to change speeds if the mechanism is neither one or the other (Ie. only partially wound). The problem with altering the speed before winding on is that, if you are, Eg. increasing the exposure duration, you must lift up and rotate the speed setting dial clockwise, which is, of course, the same direction the camera is wound in. It's then very easy indeed, to find yourself winding the camera on instead of changing the speeds (or indeed, doing a bit of both), because the spring for the setting dial is quite powerful, and if you don't keep a firm grip on the dial as you twist it and it drops down only slightly, the peg underneath will mesh with the wind gearing and you'll start to wind the camera. You have to be a bit unlucky, but it's possible to get the shutter ribbons in a real tangle if you have a half-wound Contax and you turn the setting dial the wrong way.</p>

<p>In this context, winding on the camera fully to the next film frame, and then, and only then, changing the speed, is a safer option. Once you have the mechanism safely cocked and the curtains latched, you can turn the setting dial back and forwards in either direction (clockwise or anti-clockwise) without any fear of damage.</p>

<p>On a slightly related note, I collected my second Contax II this morning from a local seller. It was a one owner camera sold to me by the late owner's son, I had the good fortune to meet him at a local classic car display when (unsurprisingly, to those who know me) I had another Zeiss Ikon on me (a Contaflex II with Teleskop mounted). Purely a chance encounter but the result is that I'm now the proud owner of two 1936 Contaxes. This one came with its original never ready case and 50mm collapsible f/2 Sonnar. I'll replace the shutter ribbons as soon as I get time and am looking forward to using it frequently.</p>

<p>Thank you, Brett, for your detailed response.<br>

Excellent score with the Contax - I have a IIa (just back from service and about to hit the streets with me) and a pre-war II. Such lovely cameras :)</p>

<p>What Brett mentions for the Contax is also valid for its Russian off-spring, the Kiev rangefinders (at least for the Kiev 4 models, I have no experience with other ones myself but believe the same applies).</p>

<p>Thanks, <strong>Wouter</strong> - I also have Kiev 4/4A so this is good to know.</p>

Isn't a Contax IIa post WW II?

<p>When Dresden was turned over to the Red Army, the original plant and many of the workers were removed to Kiev, where the Contax II and III were put back into production. A few early Kievs were made with actual Contax parts (the name being stamped out and re-engraved as Kiev). (<a href="http://www3.telus.net/public/rpnchbck/zconrfKiev.htm">link</a>)<br>

For all practical purposes the early Kievs were Contaxes. Indeed, repairs of real Contaxes with parts from Kievs created what are known as "Frankencontaxes".<br>

The non-Soviet occupied areas Zeiss plants had to start from scratch to make their Contax II, and the differences are substantial, while looking much the same. The Contax IIa is a different camera.<br>

It can be a crap shoot to get a "pure" Contax II, but not so for the IIa.</p><div></div>

<p>Thanks for the info, JDM - especially 'Frankencontaxes', which I will find hard to forget :)</p>

<p>In the RF cameras with a rotating timer dial, such as many of the Zorkis and Feds, one cannot set the shutter speed without cocking the shutter. Only after we cock the shutter the timer dial will come into position for setting the shutter speed. sp.</p>

<p>Good point, <strong>SP</strong> - thank you.</p>

<p>Kiev-88; wind first, then set shutter speed <br /><br /></p>

<p>For the cameras where the shutter speed knob rotates during exposure, you won't know where it set it if you do it at the wrong time. I don't know that it actually hurts anything, but normally you won't want to set it when you can't line up the numbers with anything.</p>

<p> </p>

Indeded the info on the Feds/Zorkis and other rotating dial(Contax D/SLR??) is right on the theme here. I do recall a post a

bit back where the Contax Manual (II&III) was quoted and addresses this issue head on. Wind then change.