Bronica ETRSi vs Mamiya Super 645

<p>I read that the ETRS(i) has bulb mode - can someone confirm if I need to switch the slider on the lens before and after the exposure? So can I press in and pop up the cable release as I do with my manual Nikon? </p>

<p>I read the Super 645 Mamiya's film backs not that reliable ... seems like Keh.com don't have much of the newer bodies going. Short supply huh ... Mamiya lenses seems lighter than Bronica PE lenses by 200g each .... </p>

<p>http://www.cameramanuals.org/bronica/bronica_etr_si-1.pdf<br>

The slider is for the T exposure. B works just like any other B, although it runs down the battery.</p>

<p>The main difference is that the Mamiya is a focal plane shutter camera and the Bronica is a leaf shutter in each lens camera (the Mamiya does have some lenses that have leaf shutters).</p>

<p>Which one meets your needs better? Buy it.</p>

<p>Have a Mamiya 645 Super kit and a Bronica SQ-B(the ETRSi 6x6 cousin). Mamiya backs unreliable? How? If anything, they're less prone to light leaks since they don't use foam seals like the Bronicas. Both 645s really need a winder grip if you plan on doing any handheld shooting.</p>

<p>Bronica all the way :-)</p>

<p>About the bulb mode, it's actualy a T mode. Does not eat batteries. You have to enable it with a slider on the lens and then the exposure starts normaly via the shutter button or cable release. You end it with the lens slider again.</p>

<p>The main difference is the shutter system as was already explained. Mamiya has a focal plane shutter in the body and IIRC 3 leaf shuter lenses. It integrates better thant the Bronica (ETRSi + winder + prism looks less coherent thant the same M645 equivalent). M645 has a better lens selection.</p>

<p>The m645 Super was the weakest body in the line I think. It was unreliable when used with a motor winder (some gears in the body were not sturdy enough). I'd pick the Pro if possible as the lowest entry.</p>

<p>Put a "vs" in the thread title and you'll always make people come a runnin'!</p>

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<p>Mamiya lenses seems lighter than Bronica PE lenses by 200g each</p>

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<p>Sounds about right, for the non-leaf shutter lenses of the same maximum aperture.</p>

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<p>Mamiya has a focal plane shutter in the body and IIRC 3 leaf shuter lenses.</p>

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<p>4: 55/2.8, 70/2.8, 80/2.8, 150/3.8. The 70/2.8 doesn't connect to the auto-cocking power drive grip, however - it must be manually cocked.</p>

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<p>M645 has a better lens selection.</p>

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<p>True. Faster options, wider range, and in some cases, newer designs. A considerable number of specialist lenses as well.</p>

<p>And don't forget, with a focal plane shutter camera like the Mamiya, you can adapt all sorts of other lenses and optical devices. The leaf-shutter Bronicas are for those who have considered the available lens range from Bronica and are perfectly happy with it, as there are no 3rd party options to extend the range.</p>

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<p>I'd pick the Pro if possible as the lowest entry.</p>

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<p>I have no experience with the Super or Pro - preferring the older M645 1000s and the newer 645AFD - but on the basis that nothing is lost going from the Super to the Pro, while improved build quality is gained (and to my eye, nicer design lines), I would concur with that recommendation.</p>

<p>"<em>The m645 Super was the weakest body in the line <strong>I think</strong>. It was unreliable when used with a motor winder (some gears in the body were not sturdy enough</em>)."</p>

<p>Really? Care to share some documentation?</p>

<p>Back in the days when a business partner and I where considering moving to 645 for wedding photography we tried both cameras. The Bronica came out as the sharpest in our test shots so we went ETRS. Never regreted it and I still have and use my basic ETRS kit. I sold the motor winder and the 35mm back as I was never going to use them now but apart from that it is a great camera system.</p>

<p>Just my .02 worth. No scientific evidence to back up the impression I am afraid, but it was back in the late 80's early 90's IIRC.</p>

<p>Jim</p>

<p>Lubos Soltes--<br>

The <strong>ETRSi</strong> has a standard bulb mode: it is on the shutter speed dial right after the 8 second setting. It works like any ordinary B mode, and as stated by Jerry, it uses battery power.</p>

<p>@Jeff Livacich - well yes, but that one is time limited to save battery ... never used it :-) the mechanical T mode is much more usefull.</p>

<p>@C Watson: there are 2 motor winders in the system, one that came with the Super and cannot cock leaf shutter lenses is ok. The other one came with the Pro (or Pro TL) and is more powerfull, however it damages the winding gear of the Super.</p>

<p>I have, at last count, four ETR series bodies as well as two M645s, one 1000S and a J. When motorized use is not needed I find the Bronica Speed Grip more convenient that the Mamiya left hand grip. Partly this is because I am right handed. The speed grip doesn't add that much weight and makes shooting verticals easier. I have not added any motorized grips for the ETR series cameras because I have an SQ-AM for the 6X6 format. The Speed Grip is awkward with a waist level finder but fine with a prism finder. It's almost mandatory with the heavy and boxy Action Finder.<br>

The motorized Mamiya grip I have is the right handed one. It's quite heavy and not very fast but it's good for vertical shooting and works well. Without grips or brackets of some kind, both series of cameras are inconvenient to use hand held. Of my Bronica lenses for the ETR series cameras I like the 105 because it gets closer than the 150 and less expensive than the later and even closer focusing 135. Of my Mamiya 645 lenses, I find the 70/2.8 leaf shutter model to be a nice slightly wide normal. The more common lenses for both systems are reasonably priced and show good performance.<br>

I wish there was something like the Speed Grip for my Mamiya 645 cameras. Eventually I would like to get a bellows for the Mamiyas so I can experiment with various lenses for macro work. This is not really practical with the Bronica bellows. Which system is better? I enjoy using both.</p>

<p>"@<em>C Watson: there are 2 motor winders in the <a id="itxthook0" href="#" rel="nofollow">system<img id="itxthook0icon" src="http://images.intellitxt.com/ast/adTypes/icon1.png" alt="" /></a>, one that came with the Super and cannot cock leaf shutter lenses is ok. The other one came with the Pro (or Pro TL) and is more powerfull, however it damages the winding gear of the Super</em>."</p>

<p>Not so sure there's any horsepower difference between the two since I use both with Super and Pro bodies. Leaf shutters are cocked electrically--not mechanically--by the drive anyway.</p>

<p>The Bronica ETRSi is an excellent body, and the Bronica lenses are very good. I used to shoot weddings with them. I think the Bronicas are now the best value.</p>

<p>Kent in SD </p>