How To Handle This (Tactfully)?

Just tell her that you saw the picture in your mind and then got lucky with no special technique. Sometimes that is not so far from the truth. The pic is in the eye of the photographer, and then we make the photo. Ansel said something like that.

Hi David:

 

Isn't that the truth? I don't want to put words in Ansel's mouth (it may have been him or Robert Doisneau or someone else -

- someone help me out here), but didn't he also say "If I knew how to take a great picture, I'd do it every time."?

 

Cheers :)

 

Karen

If there is any error occurs due to conversation or during the work, so at that point of time the most tactfully answer is sorry.

 

__________________________

 

maks smith

My very first job many many years ago was in a textile mill. The older people who came up from the south and had only a few years left to work would not tell you a darn thing about the buisness even tho they were suppose to be teaching you for fear of their job. This is what this sounds like to me (fear) dont't be afraid to tell your competitor anything just be BETTER

Hey Karen in this frustrating moment I would like to thank you for all of the help you've provided me! It's nice to know

there are some out there that I can bounce questions and info. off of! (without feeling like an idiot). You've been very

helpful while I've been trying to set up me email blasts! All of that aside I think you've gotten some great advice but in

scanning I didn't see anyone mention PPA. I'd refer her there. Rec. she join and go to the seminars, conventions

and meetings. It was very helpful to me when I first started out!

 

Good luck! If none of that works you could always black the email address! :-) Then you could honestly say if she

were to ever call you "I didn't get your email"!

You can show someone, i.e. workshops, or tell someone how you make pictures, all the technical side of photography. What doesn't get translated is one's personal style and vision. That's as unique as you are, and can't be copied because when you press the shutter release, the image you're creating is the sum of your experiences and what motivated you to capture the image at that moment is distilled in that one image.

 

Only YOU could have captured that evocative and provocative moment.

 

A Renoir copy is STILL a Renoir COPY. A Raphael copy is STILL a Raphael COPY. After looking at your website, people can make similar photos, but wont be able to capture what you've captured no matter the equipment or expertise.

She is really not a serious professional rival. (I have seen your marvelous website.) Therefore it probably comes down to how much time you have to deal with such a person, and my guess that you are probably too busy to enjoy chatting about photography with someone who brings so little to the discussion.

 

On the other hand, there are some truly superb pros such as Ellis Vener (http://www.photo.net/photodb/user?user_id=17942) who do precisely that: talk about photography with those of us who have little or nothing to offer by way of return.

 

When one meets a great photographer with magnanimity of spirit, then one has found one who will be willing to share. It thus is perhaps not so much about her as about you, and what you think of when you think of what being successful entails.

 

--Lannie

I'd thank her and suggest some books that have helped you out.

I know the answer to your question, but if i tell you the answer then you are going to steal my job, so... no I can't tell you ;-)

Tell 'em: "Oh I dunno. Just use F8. And BE there!"

 

scot

I wasn't saying you did have any magic secrets, just comparing how some people are or get thinking they know something the rest of the world doesn't. I believe in sharing knowledge too.

While not a professional photographer, I still am a professional (self employed IT consultant). Drawing a parallel to your dilemma, here is what I do:

 

Neighbors and family get help for free (with computer stuff), 2-3 times each. By then they're at the end of my patience. I try to make them understand that every free hour I spend with them goes from my billable hours. They all get the point, and there are never any hard feelings. I'll even point them to self help sites.

 

Besides, removing 250 vira and cookies from a teenager's laptop for the 4th time gets old, very quickly. If they can't figure out how to do stuff themselves, perhaps they should do something else?

 

Now, as for photography I share all I can for free with friends, family, and everyone. That's a hobby, not my bread and butter.

I will always try to answer all questions and be as helpful as possible regardless of who it is.

 

What goes around comes around, so I believe. It's creates good Karma. It just feels right etc etc...

 

Many others offering suggestions to me was instrumental in my own photographic journey.

 

If I am too busy, I will tell them that and get back as soon as I have a few minutes.

 

Oftentimes I have found I can just copy and paste advice already given to somebody earlier. I have no problems doing this

and will even at times tell them just that.

 

Even with local competitors, I will even share with them where I get my mats, bags, prices I paid, printing done etc. I believe

there is enough business to go around for all of us. And I believe I have no enemies in this competitive biz because of doing

this as well.

 

Though occasionally they may have to dig a little to get some of my better secrets.

 

: )

Hooray, Vincent. :) <p>

Most of us have benefited from the generosity of others. It can even be a living if we had enough to share, as Ken Rockwell has done.

A photographer with a studio asks you how to get color into eyes? Any photo hobbits looking at your picture will

know that its pp. Asking you about ISO, aperture and lighting is disrespectful? This information you look as your

trade secrets?

 

Mr. X got himself a camera, and is calling himself a photographer. When the wife pulls the mini van out of the garage

Mr X opens a studio. That is not your competition. Your competition has ISO and aperture figured out.

 

But then again you know all that, You just want to drum up business for your $500 web instructions on how to take

pictures. ;)

Because you claim you make $1500 a pop, sure sign me up ! please

I think, letting that fellow know a bit more about ISO, metering, process etc...is not going to harm you at all.

Hes still trying to figure out ISO, metering.....and all that. If he were your competition, he should have been

able to look at your photos and estimate what ISO range was used, metering mode, flash technique,lighting, even

photoshop processes, ....etc.

 

he's still not a competition yet.

 

personally, i do not mind answering any questions. I am no name photographer and charge very low fees, but i have

a degree in computer engineering and know a thing or two about "digital".When oldies where scratching their

heads trying to figure out how to use a DSLR, i was always willing to help in any way i could.

the more you share, the more you learn.

 

i always find it a priviledge to share what i know. I am self taught and only I know how hard it was to learn all

that I know now.

Thanks to good folks at photo.net, I have learnt a great deal from this community. and am willing to pass the

torch to newer shooters.

 

yes its a lot of practice, the "competition" will probably be good enough to use the camera well enough in a few

months, but getting that eyes of a photogrpaher takes a long long time. You will always remain ahead of the

competition.

 

 

Ujwal

I understand what Karen is getting at.

 

I think what she's pointing out is that we all work very hard and spend most of our working hours trying to build and run a

business. It's very tough as it is to keep all the balls in the air and it takes a lot more than what anyone thinks on the

surface to be profitably. For people to just "pop in" and ask "Hey, tell me how you do that" doesn't take into account all

of the work that goes into what you see and is not taking into account the time it takes (even if it only seems like 30

seconds to the person) to formulate and send a reply when you're probably already knee-deep in stuff that needs to get

done (let alone family, dinner, laundry, etc.).

 

I've worked with Karen and she is nothing but kind, giving, and genuine. She has really helped me in many ways to get

my business going in the right direction (she has told me exactly the ISO, f-stop, and post processing she uses, and

yes, my shots are different). I quite happily invested a lot of time and money with her and from my perspective, I

appreciate that she doesn't just "give the farm away" when I've paid her for that same time and information. Her efforts

should be for her clients (mentor and photo clients both).

 

Karen never claims to "know it all" or have any secrets. She is consistent in her approach, but she will be the first to

say that even with slight variation in the light, the effect will be all different. She often tells me, "There might be a better

way, but this is how I do it." The many years of trial and error is what we all have to figure out ourselves. McDonald's

special sauce is just Thousand Island dressing. It's not so special for its ingredients, it's special because someone

figured out it tastes good on a burger. I doubt if I e-mail McDonalds and say "Hey, what's in the sauce?" they would

answer. Just as you're not paying a plumber to turn a wrench, you're paying him to *know* which wrench to turn. Karen

understands how to turn wrenches in the camera, in pp, and with her clients and that's why she's successful.

 

I think she's expressing what we all feel on some level, just that she wants to help others and contribute to the greater

good, and she just doesn't want to be labeled a jerk if she uses her time and information to *her* greatest benefit.

 

Michelle Mitchel

As a courtesy you might want to be more specific and reply that you used a $10,000 Leica lens, $7,000 canon camera, $2,300 tripod and ball head, and an estimated $43,000 of time spent learning how to get the best results from that shot - and there was a little luck involved, as well.

I'm an amateur, but I share everything I know about stuff, and think I would as a pro. It's not only promotes general nice-

ness, but it has come back to bless me. (I'm not a hindu, but the "karma" concept of what goes around comes around

comes into play here.)

 

I am a church musician in my professional life, and I share everything I know about what I do for a living with everybody who

asks anything

 

That said, I don't train and teach them. I'd probably answer questions about ISO, exposure, etc, but I'd probably recommend

good resources and books and stuff when it comes to lighting and more "advanced" technique. Some of the advice above

seems really good, especially Sarah Fox's above.

Karen, I'm not sure how "tactful" this would be (not exactly a strength of mine), but what if you were to try to make her understand what it is like to be in your shoes? Answer her questions with questions:

 

"How would you feel if you worked long and hard, and studied and attended paid workshops, and experimented and failed and finally arrived at a way of working that pleases yourself and your clients, and someone just wanted this handed to them?"

 

"How would you feel if a competitor approached you and wanted to know, without equal dedication to discovering for herself, my personal approach to photography and hard-won techniques that no one handed to me?"

 

"Would you be eager to hand over to someone who is an acquaintance, and someone who is competing for the same business, all that you learned and worked for over many years?"

 

My opinion is that the person in question never considered the "Golden Rule," or she just doesn't care, and she made a huge gaffe for asking in the first place. Someone needs to put her in her place. She's either very dense, or doesn't care about your position, or she needs to learn a lesson.

 

I can just see her gushing over how grateful she is for your help while at the same time mumbling to herself how smart and clever she is for getting you to give away your hard-won knowledge. Maybe not, but maybe.

 

In the end, you can feel good about being honest and being true to yourself. If someone can't respect that, then that's not someone you would want to know.

There is a lot of difference between getting mentored help and asking about an iso, kind of film, filter or lens used for a single shot. Your competitor admires your shot and simply wants to know how to recreate that effect. If your scared that they will make better prints than you with that information, no offense, but they must be a better photographer.

Karen, Teaching someone who wants to learn is rewarding, but someone wanting to copy is like me asking Rembrant how to paint, I can't even draw a straight line let alone paint. People want it now and for free, there is no apprenticeship, no learing curve. How many times have you heard"I don't have time to read the manual" just like the guy in school who couldn't read the assignment. A lot of us "oldies" have spent a lot of time and effort to pursue this adventure which some take as something that is learned on a weekend with a good camera and a couple of websites. Sarah hit it on the head. I get strange looks when I show them my camera and it's set to manual. Just tell her there is no magic, it's just exposure and the light is always changing.

I answer all questions, however very briefly. I just don't have the time (and wrist health) for more. In general, I have found that people are appreciative that you reply at all and understand.

Well, my take on this is as follows: it is similiar to asking a 100m record holder "How did you manage to do that and

could you give me some tips ?"

 

The answer in this case is simple: "Well, I just took off from the starting blocks and run damn hard". It does not

mean that anyone would be able to repeat the feat.

 

In other words: details regarding aperture, metering etc. are not really that important. All this is just a fraction of what

comes together to produce a great picture, so you are in no real danger of someone copying your work based on

such scant information.

 

It is entirely possible that this photographer genuinely is a newbie - otherwise he would know that creating an image

based on information like aperture is a rather tall order. The way I read it he just wanted to be pointed in the general

direction in order to try and achieve good result.

 

A bit of kindness goes a long way sometimes...and this is not saying that you should share all your secrets in depth

with a potential competitor. YMMV, of course.

 

I like your images, BTW.

Karen,

 

You stuff is good enough that you could tell the person all of the details and not risk losing any business. You could

use this as an opportunity to turn a competitor into an ally. I see that you have nothing to lose.

 

 

BTW, how ARE you getting that look?

 

(sorry, I couldn't resist)