Basic Nikon Manual Body & Modern Lenses

What is a good Nikon manual focus body? I.e. which model? I know

this has been covered before, but I can't come up with anything on

the search.

 

I'm looking to back up my digital stuff with a film body for

specialty tasks (architecture mainly), simply because the lenses are

cheap. I have an old Yashica that I love and I'd use for this but

the pentaprism is cracked (still useable though) and I'd rather

slowly start moving everything I own to Nikon for the sake of lens

availability.

 

Also, does anyone know if modern Nikon AF lenses can be used with

old manual bodies (i.e. as manual focus lenses)? I have access to a

bunch of gear that's used with an F100 and it'd be nice to e able to

use it with whatever manual body I choose.

 

Many thanks,

 

Chris

Is TTL flash important? Is batteryless operation (except meter) important? Do you want an autoexposure mode? Mirror lock? Do you wear glasses?

 

Basically the post 1977 manual bodies will work with any AI and AIS manual focus, and any AF lens with an aperture ring (not the G lenses). The can also accept non-AI lenses that are AI modified (beware of hack jobs). The pre-1977 bodies require a lens with the rabbit ear prongs to meter. The prongs come standard on the non-AI, AI and AIS lenses and can be added to many others, even AF lenses.

 

Myself? My Nikon F3HP will leave only my cold, dead hands. It is battery dependent, has a less than convenient TTL flash interface but its built like a truck, has mirror lock and an amazing viewfinder. Compared to my FM2N, it is SO SMOOTH. Answer some of the questions above and you will get answers all over the map. The best way to proceed from there is to actually try a bunch of the suggestions.

a question like this pops up every day or so, so i'm quite surprised to hear you say you

can't find anything

 

fine mf bodies include f3hp, fm2n, fm3a, and more....most af lenses will work fine but not

g lenses

Thanks for the response and the tips on subsequent questions to ask myself.

 

TTL flash isn't necessary.

Mirror lock would be nice.

Batteryless operation I'm indifferent to.

No motor drive.

Auto exposure isn't needed.

 

Thanks,

 

Chris

<I>Also, does anyone know if modern Nikon AF lenses can be used with old manual

bodies (i.e. as manual focus lenses)?</I><P>Yes, with the exception of the G-type lenses

that only allow control ofthe aperture via the body on modern AF bodies. It isn't often that

I have to use it but I still have a 1976 vintage F2 body that I use with all of my AF, AF-D &

AF-S Nikkors.

Post 1977 F2A or F2AS, Nikkormat FT3 and F3HP are your choices with mirror lock. FM, FM2, FM2n, FE, FE2, FM3A have a pseudo mirror lock when you use the self timer. Try starting <a href="http://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography/companies/nikon/htmls/models/htmls/slrmain8090.htm">HERE</a> to narrow your choices and learn the differences. GOOD LUCK!

Chris, look into the F3, F3HP, F4 bodies. If you decide you can live without mirror lock-up (or you can accept a mirror that swings up and stays up during self-timer operation) you have more choices, including the manual exposure FM and FM2n bodies, and the manual or aperture-priority FE and FE2 with TTL flash option.

 

There was also the Nikon FA, with which Nikon introduced its matrix metering and its implementation of the four exposure modes now considered commonplace (program, shutter priority, apoerture priority, manual).

 

The EM is amazingly inexpensive and is for aperture priority without a manual exposure mode. Its cousin the FG is a remarkable critter, offering manual exposure or aperture priority or program mode.

 

If you put the little metal rabbit ears on your current lenses (tha is not expensive, nor is it difficult as modifications go... they just screw into the aperture ring) then you can also look at the older F and F2 bodies, or at the various Nikkormats.

 

Today, Nikon produces the FM3A, which offers manual exposure or aperture priority with TTL flash, and will still run all of its shutter speeds if the batteries take a nap.

 

None of these bodies will be happy with G-series Nikkor lenses, because G-series lenses do not have an aperture ring, and these bodies all rely on that aperture ring for exposure settings. But any other autofocus Nikkors (in other words, almost ALL autofocus Nikkors ever made) will work fine in focus-by-hand mode on these bodies.

 

Lots of choices. The best match with your stated preferences is an F3 body but you could get any of these and have a wonderful time.

 

Be well,

I've got a Nikon FM2n, and it's a great cheap, all manual body that has a very accurate meter and will accept AI and AIS lenses. THis thing will work with zero batteries. AI lenses are ridiculously cheap right now.

Many thanks for all the responses, this has been a great help. It looks like I get to spend the weekend hunting for a new camera. The F3HP has peaked my interest (I wear glasses) as have some of your other suggestions.

 

Thanks again for all your help.

 

Chris

As far as newer lenses with older bodies: As stated above, any lens with an aperture ring (non-G) will work even on the earliest F, but you will not get full-aperture metering with any models that predate the AI metering system, such as F's, older Nikkormats, or the first iteration of the F2, unless the aperture ring can be fitted with a metering prong. E series lenses and some of the newer AF lenses aren't designed to allow this, so you're probably best off avoiding the real oldies.

Don't overlook the Nikkormats, they're lovely bodies, heavy, all-metal, built-like-a-tank, with mirror lock-up and ability to use pre-ai/ai/ais lenses. Af lenses will do if "modified" as above.<br>

Here's my FT2, which I got dirt cheap, and really is a joy to use (nice additional feature is the meter window on the top plate, for shooting from the hip). <br>

<img src="http://www.photo.net/users/Carrus/DSC_6120IV.jpg"><br>

<br>

BTW, FT and FTn are beautiful too, but they use the old, hard to find, mercury batteries.<br>

<br>

Ciao!

If you look around you will find dozens of older Nikkors with the rabbit ears for almost nothing. Put it on an older F or F2 or Nikkormat and go to town. You can put together a very complete kit for well under $1000, probably less than $800. Personally I think the F2 is the best camera ever built. The F3 is also quite good though I have never cared for it. You can also pick up the AI and later lenses for super low prices but they will need slightly more recent bodies, F2A and later. I never used one but I think Nikon used to make a 45mm lens that had some form of perspective control. Finally, if you can find an FM, FM2, FE, FE2 and several other of the compact bodies on Ebay, they are almost giving them away.

 

Rick H.

Manual focus Nikon bodies - the usual suspects are F3HP, M2N, FM3A.

 

But my question for you is, if this is mainly for architecture, don't you think you'd get better results with large format rather than 35mm??

FM3A tops my recommended bodies list because it a fine tool and still in production, followerd by F3 and FM2n.

<P>

An used F3 and an used FM2n are probably a better bargain than one new FM3A.

In response to why I'm using 35mm and not larger format, the answer is $. I would love to go medium format, I used to use a Yashica Mat-124g when I was first learning. But any medium format camera with a decent range of available lenses will cost more money than I have. The nice thing about these old 35mm bodies is that the camera can be had for $200 and a decent range of lenses will run me less than $800. I can't think of a single medium format camera that has that kind of cost effectiveness.

 

Anyone want to sell some medium format equipment really cheap?

 

I'm getting really psyched about getting this 35mm Nikon though, thanks in large part to the responses so far.

 

Chris

Actually a lot of used Hasselblad stuff is relatively cheap in these days, mainly as a result of a lot of wedding photographers moving to digital. Whether that fits into your price range is another issue. Moreover, medium-format processing is not inexpensive.

 

If your primary camera is Nikon digital, I would suggest backing it up with a more modern Nikon AF film body such as an F100, N80 or N90s, depending on your price range. Manual Nikon bodies are designed some 30 years ago, including the latest FM3a, which is still primarily based on a 27-year-old design. Inevidably, there will be all sorts of incompatibility issues between those older designs and your modern DSLR, e.g. modern G lenses cannot be used on those old bodies and old MF lenses without CPU cannot meter on less expensive DSLRs.

 

If an MF film SLR is indeed what you want, don't let me stop you, but I suggest think through all the issues before you spend your money.

Shun offers good advise though your comment about the lenses being cheap seems to indicate that you want to buy some manual lenses. That is the best way to make use of these cameras, and I don't see any reference to using the camera as a backup.

 

However cheap Hasselblad has become, you would be hard pressed to much more than an 80/2.8 Planar, body and back for less than $800. Its the cost of the lenses that really kills.

Also, you can look into a N8008s or F801s body: just leave the autofocus switch on 'M' and you have a somewhat newer Nikon body that can use Ai, Ais, or AF lenses, plus it has a small spot or large spot meter with the Ai or Ais lenses, and a matrix meter for AF lens use.

Earlier, I left out F801/N8008(s) on purpose because they cannot drive AF-S lenses. If you are going to use them as MF bodies, that is fine. Otherwise, not being able to AF with AF-S lenses is a pretty major disadvantage. There are good reasons why AI/AI-S lenses and N8008 bodies are dirt cheap in the used market. They can be great bargains as long as their short-comings are not problems for you.

Amen. I have an 8008s and use it with AI and AIS lenses all the time. In fact, the 8008s

and N90s are the only relatively affordable Nikons that will spot meter with AI and AIS

lenses. It's a great camera and built like a tank. Far better than the current N series bodies.

Why not just get a new FM-10?

 

I got one from B&H for $219 (US) complete with batteries and leather case then I took off the zoom it came with and put a manual focus 50mm f1.8 Nikkor on it for another $100. It takes as good a picture as my Nikon 8008.

 

I bought it primarily as a light weight alternative to the 8008 and as a field backup to my digital Sony 717 which I don't like using outdoors. It's quickly becoming my favorite camera for everything except shooting grandchildren running around the house (can't focus fast enough). For that I use my Leica Z2x. Of all these cameras, the FM-10 produces as good an image as any of them. It's becoming my favorite camera.

 

Regarding viewfinders, I wear glasses so I wasn't too thrilled with the low eyepoint viewfinder when I got it but I'm getting used to it.

 

The FM-10 has certain advantages:

 

-low cost, don't have to worry about it.

 

-weighs only 1.5# with film and batteries

 

-I've heard people complain about the plasticy feeling but I like it, means it won't rust when it gets sprayed by salt water. Also, I read of a review in one of the photo mags where they cut the body in half and found the plastic was covering a metal skeleton frame. Further, if you drop it the polymer body has a lot more impact absorbing capability than metal, even titanium. It also has vibration damping properties which helps control vibrations. And it has a nice velvety texture which makes it easy to hold onto with wet hands. By the way, the stealth fighter's wings are made of abs polymer.

 

-It has aperture priority. Just set the aperture and adjust exposure with the shutter speed dial (:>.

 

-It has shutter priority, just do the reverse (:>.

 

-The three exposure led's actually give 5 indications of exposure: over (+), slightly over (+ and 0), perfect (0), slightly under (0 -), under (-).

 

-as far as the zoom lens that comes with it, it isn't that bad. I got the 50/1.8 only because I shoot mostlylandscapes with it and scan my slides then zoom and crop in ps so I like distant detail.

 

-I thought of upgrading to an F3HP after hearing everyone rave about it but when I compared the two side by side in the camera shop I preferred the feel and weight of the FM-10, not to mention the lower cost. As far as the FM3a goes, sweet little camera but I find the viewfinder difficult to use with glasses and I don't see that it does much more than the FM10 to justify it's higher price.

In response to Barnard, I would avoid the FM-10. I bought one several years ago and

it soon died. The light meter was inaccurate, and the circuitry stopped working if the

exposure was set at 1/8 sec or slower. I brought it in for repair at a local

reputable Nikon shop, and they said these cameras often had such problems and

weren't worth repairing. Also, the lens that came with it in the kit was so bad that

even 4x6 inch prints were blurry! My son took photograghy in high school, and about

1/2 of the class bought FM-10 cameras -- all were broken by the end of the year

(unlike those who used other Nikon manual camera). It is a dog, isn't even made by

Nikon, and IMHO shouldn't be sold by Nikon.

 

That said, I'd consider the FE-2 as an option as one of the best laid out cameras ever

made. (Even though it has "pseudo" mirror lock up). I have one and love it. I'd love to

get my hands on an F3HP one of these days also.

 

Bob Y.

Just to muddy the waters. It's pretty easy these days to find a lightly-used Mamiya C220 for $200-$300, then add a 55 or 65 and an 80 mm lens for a few hundred each. I'd much rather have the larger negative for architecture.

In response to Bob:

 

Sorry your son didn't have good luck with his camera. Having been a school teacher at one time myself, all I can say is - give cameras to a bunch of teenagers and you're lucky to get the pieces back. My FM10 has suffered its share of knocks and drops and it still works fine.

 

As far as the lens goes, if you will re-read my post above you will see I put a Nikkor 50/1.8 on it, one of the sharpest lenses made by Nikon. I chose to buy the lens new but I understand they are available on Ebay for considerably less than $100.

 

All I can say is when I leave the house on a photo expedition, usually in the mountains, in a boat or out on a salt marsh I take my FM10. The Nikon 8008 stays home (too big and heavy), the Sony 717 stays home (too big, too fussy), the Leica stays home (after 2 trips and 3.5 months at Leica for repair, I don't trust it). If I had an F3, it also would stay home because I don't feel like lugging that weight around and I don't feel like subjecting an expensive camera like that to the hazards of landscape photography.

 

As far as an F3 goes, you can buy 7 new FM10's for the same price as a new F3. You can get a so-called "mint" F3 on Ebay for $500 or so, but I prefer not to risk buying expensive used cameras on Ebay.

 

If my FM10 ever dies on me, I probably won't repair it either. It would make more sense to just go out and buy another, they're so inexpensive.

Barnard, I am gad you're having a good experience with the FM-10. I had bought

mine for exactly the same purpose you bought yours -- as a lightweight camera to

take hiking, and it seemed an ideal candidate for that. I sincerely hope that yours

continues to function well.

 

I know it's easy to blow off the problems with the camera my son and his classmates

had, but again, those classmates that bought other cameras fared much better. (And

I later got my son an N80 which held up very well.) It is hard to get reliable

information on camera repair rates, but I think that if you look at a number of web

sites

where people rate their cameras, you'll find a disproportionate number of complaints

of serious probblems with the FM-10. I'm just saying that there are so many really

good manual Nikon cameras you can buy used that I would look at those before the

FM-10, which I think is way below any other Nikon in terms of quality. Also, I'd

personally hate to go backpacking for a week with a camera and then find all my

pictures were ruined because the meter started failing. I would look at a used FE-2,

for example, which one can buy in excellent condition from KEH for $215 right now.

I've dragged mine all over the place (a week bushwacking in Alaska, etc.) and it's

performed wonderfully. Yeah, it's a bit heavier than the FM-10, but not that much.

 

So anyway, those were my thoughts. But if you or someone else gets an FM-10 and it

functions well, I agree that the lightness is a real asset on long hikes! Enjoy.

 

Happy shooting, all.