andrea_milano

I forgot to thank John as well, I apologize for it and many thanks to

him too!

Dear Geoffrey,

Thanks for your extensive review , I find very little to add to your

perfect introduction to these cameras, thanks a lot for mentioning my

name and indicating me as a European reference for these cameras. I am

more than happy to share the credit with you to have brought these fine

pieces of skilled photographic craft to the attention of the large

format public.

Inspite of a few discrepances between the cameras you saw and the ones

in my possession, I would like to point out that the cameras with the

titanium nitride coating are slightly more expensive than the ones you

saw and that my cameras fit a Polaroid 545 holder (you gave me a

fright, I went to check immediately!) and I see no reason why they

shouldn't fit the quickload(I don't have one so I cannot check...).

I had a good reason to doubt your otherwise very accurate judgement, I

seem to recognize the similarities between the Shen Hao and another

camera which I've owned.

<p>

I've owned a Horseman Woodman 45, this field camera is marketed by

Horseman but I have my reason to think that the camera might just

possibly come from the same hands who build the Shen Hao.

The camera back and few other details of the front are virtually the

same(having owned and used a Woodman I knew that that camera takes

Polaroid 545). The GG is very similar to Horseman's and , surprise

surprise, if you get an Horseman GG(Sinar, Bromwell, Inka and many

more) it fits like a glove! I am having Bosscreens for Horseman fitted

to Two cameras(this should also take care of your doubts concerning the

GG). Somehow I don't quite understand your remark about the back which

cannot be moved back but I will investigate a little further before I

say anything foolish about it.

If I would be able to have my say about this camera I would indeed

improve the finish here and there , but that seem to be done already,

take a look at some movements and last but not least take a deep look

at Wista's wideangle bellows or Walker's and more importantly would

look long and very carefully at their similar recessed lens board.

Personally, I have my reservation thinking that Shen Hao was made

without any liberal inspiration to better known brands and if that

would be the case I wouldn't find it any strange! The nice thing about

a flexible company such as this, is that you can have your camera

custom made and if you are prepared to think with them and master the

Chinese language (and I am afraid I don't!) you might open their

horizonts to a lot of Large format application.I'll be glad to hear any

comments from you and any contributor .

If he does, it is not on the web or in the catalogue, There is another

thread on the SHIRON which is a 6x9 wooden field

Geoffrey,

I am very happy that you wrote this review,I will read it carefully

but at first site there is one thing or two which puzzles me, as you

know I bought 4 cameras and I am trying to sell them, I was as excited

as you are about the cameras when I saw them at the Fotokina. I must

say that when I got deeper into the Shen Hao , I developed also a few

critic notes but will talk about it in a later stage.

My cameras are The HZX-IIA 4"x5" in the Titanium coat version and the

Crome coat version, the metall is brass (cannot be copper....)and it

is plated-coated with either Titanium nitride or Chrome, there are

certain parts made of stainless steel but certanly not all the metal

parts ! I would have been delighted of the contrary, did you perhaps

mistake chromed brass for stainless stee, or did Mr Chang change

something in the making of this camera? The wideangle bellows isn't

made of leather but rather of leatherette (Sky plastic with some

sintetic canvas backing).

I am very happy to hear that Perry Wang spoke to you about my advice

and hope in future to be able to give , together with you and all the

other contributors, more feedback to improve this already great

camera!

My best regards

OOPS! I spelled Ferrari as Ferrary, better correct this otherwise I

might loose the car they promised me if I mentioned their name!

Ellis (I am sure it wasn't a hostile comment, but at any rate....) and

any other person who might have had the doubt that I posted this to

score on selling anything.

Gilde is a product which I happened to come across two years ago at the

Kina in Cologne. I had already back then loved it and loved it even

more this year again at the Kina.

I don't have the money to buy a Gilde , just as much as I don't have

the money to buy an Aston Martin, I just love them both and if winning

one super-lottery prize I would certanly considering buying both.

Dr. Gilde doesn't know(I think ) that I am promoting his camera and I

doubt that he would part from one of his jewels in return of my

postings here!!!!!!

If you have followed, as I am sure you did my postings throughout this

last 4 years or so, you should have realized that from time to time I

engage myself into promoting some products (like Bosscreen, which I do

not represent!) and in which I am a firm beliver. Internet is a

powerful method to make peoople aware of what's going on around the

world. This forum is made for discussing and promoting is a way of

discussing.

This was also the spirit of my posting about inventors and inventions

(pretty stimulating don't you think?)

I already have given the address of GILDE (not Glide!!!) in fact it

appear in the original question, but anyway, here it is.

http://www.gilde-kamera.de

Again I am in no possible way connected with this company.

All the other people from many countries who wrote me privately and in

public on the forum about Shen Hao, can witness that I've never made

any mistery of the address of the company making anybody able to buy

cameras directly at the source.

I like the camera had to buy 4 asa minimum order and I doubt that I am

going to get rich at the price I am selling them.

I also don't think that you want any of the detalis of all the fuss

that this camera have costed me up until now.

I like nice large format products.

However.

Comparing the Gilde to a view camera is unfair because this is a

different camera , with all due respect, the technical complication of

this camera has nothing to do with the 6x17 film back (stilla t

prototype stage) which spledid Keith Canham is about to introduce.

Suffice to say that a multiformat back that can shoot between 6x6 and

6x17 caculating the lenght of the film at each shot is simply

fantastic.

What good is it?

I don't know!

What good is a Rolls, a Rolex, a Ferrary, Valentino's fashion, the Hope

diamond, and so forth.

If you compare the Gilde to a Linhof or a Fuji the comparison is fair

but they will not be able to compare to this spendid camera.

Wiew cameras cannot be used in the same way(you can shoot without

tripod!) so the comparison doesn't stand.

Point taken but I disagree, kindly look at the camera in details

avoiding hasty comments.

Murray,

What do you actually want to know about it, it all looks pretty

straightforward, I know the camera but have never needed special

instructions, however it is nice to have a booklet, I agree, I collect

them too!

Good Luck

Andrea

Jimi, I am very curious, which cameras can you buy that are more

interesting (within the same sort....) , I can figure a number of nice

camersa for that amount of money too but they aren't panorama/stereo

6x17(multiformat) cameras, come to think of it , this is the only such

camera in the world! And I don't even work for Mr. Gilde! Just love as

you said what can be achieved with lots of love for what one does!

Well done Mark! That's the spirit, let's bring some fresh air into

large format photography! That's what I was aiming at by asking

inventors and improvers to come forward, I am very curious to know how

it will develop.

My best wishes.

Silvestri

is

http://www.silvestricamera.com

they take a little while to answer!

Enjoy

So friends! I am happy to have been contributing a little bit to

spreading this Shen Hao in the Large format community.

Thanks To John and maybe Geofrey could help with translating some

things which Shen hao has translated badly.

A little correction the cheap models CGJ aren't built any longer. so

there are a series of HZX45-810 but they are largely to do with finish

or wether the camera has or not a wideangle bellows.

On top of their price you have to add transportation and taxes (to be

fair to those who are buying the camera through me.....).

Dear all,

when writing on the Gilde camera I thought of asking all inventors and innovators to come forward with their products so that more genius(I guess the correct plural is Genii) or geniuses will come forward.

please do and show us what your mind and hands have produced!

You'll be surprised on how many cameras( made in in the countries which

you mentioned and elsewhere) never make it to the production and stay

to prototype stage. The real problem is that shrinkage of the market

makes products more expensive and in so doing becomes such a small part

of this small segment that it is difficult to produce it at all.

However in times of plenty, although shrinking in numbers the market

allows for luxurious cameras but numbers are limited because the

volumes do not allow for expansion, pretty much like for hand made

cars! Prices go up, models get better and waiting time rises

exponentially!

if you like to see the best camera ever build to fit this format (and actually the camera built by the most dedicated person I ever met, no offence to all the other buiders Like Keith Canham or Mike Walker whom dedication is also gigantic).

Take a look at:

<p>

http://www.gilde-kamera.de

<p>

you have to see it to believe it and especially listen to Dr.Gilde, he knows that you are never gonna buy because it will seriously damage your bank account but he carries on regardless.

Great guy!

Again, Bosscreen sells to private customers so it might be convenient

buying direct, I do. American contributors might, but I doubt it find

it more convenient to buy through Bromwell. I don't want to infringe

anybody's right to make a living but they charge twice as much as the

Company which makes the actual GG. The choice is yours..........I rest

my case!

Brian, It is not exactly correct that camera manifacturers don't supply

bosscreen as a standard feature of their camera because Walkers

actually do. However the ground glass is positionded so that the wax

layer is exactly where the mat glass would normally have been (They use

a spacer stip with the same thickness of the layer to insure that,

details might be obtained from the directly if you write to the address

I gave previously). concerning the second glass it is very thin and

smaller than the outside glass, so it is laying inside the camera and

wouldn't shift the position of your ground glass. Prices: The price the

importers normally charge about bosscreen is almost double of the

original price a 4x5 would be around $75 at the souce and a 8"x10"

around $120 (must include sending and taxes), in the U.S.A. I am aware

of them being imported from Bromwell and I know that Cakume-KJP carrys

them too (must check in their american catalogue, I've got it somewhere

else).

My typing notoriously stinks and makes the weardest mistakes seem

funny, I apologize.

Thanks for your answers, I am naturally curious about this Maxwell's

Otics focussing screen and would like the contributors who are familiar

with it to elaborate on the way this ground glass is mad, infact the

comment made about bosscreen being able to be used with a 7x loupe is

crucial to explain the qualities of a good screenm any screen which is

matted bya a mechanical proces is bound to be made of minute mat dots,

bosscreen instead has a layer of uniform (at least for our

purposes....) beewax and paraffine enclosed between two glasses (hence

the problematic behaviour with extreme temperatures.

If Maxwell is the product of a mechanical process or a chemical one

this can radically change its performance.

Plastics have been used very oftem but to my impression with very poor

results. If Arca has a Fresnel towards the lens then its structure will

be a part of the image formed on the ground glass , thereefore any

loupe would enhance the fresnel lines making the precise focussing

almost impossible. In my experience Bosscreen has no need for further

fresnell, however maybe with extreme wideangle it might need it, up

until 75mm I've never needed any!

Getting in touch with Bosscreen can prove tricky.

At present they have no Internet site, they are a small company with

very few people working there, this is both their stength and their

limitation. They will work for you and be flexible but orders might

take some time to be fulfilled because of too big a workload.

However, you can call them at +31 (0)70 3970061 or write at Stabilix

B.V. BurgmeesterHofylaan 84 The Hague The Nehterlands. they sell to

privates and they also sell surfave mirrors (for reflex cameras) and

they will also polish or coat lenses.

Dear Friends and contributors,

as some of you know I am very much in favour of this unique focussing screen and keep on wondering why it isn't provided from camera producers as a wothy option to their , sometimes very poor, focussing screen.

The only itch that anyone could find id that in extrime temperature conditions it might the wax and paraffine layer might cristallize or bubble(several degree below 0 centigrades and above+ 60-70 degrees centigrades) in most cases all you have to do is protect you camera fron the sun if you are shooting in death valley(you wouldn't go youself withot as much as a strw hat would you? Why do you leave the camera cooking in the sun in your Black car?).

However every medal has its side and apart from this debateble point the screen is near perfect. I visit their factory every now and then and it is so nice to meet people who take you seriously and are prepared to custom make products for you, the best thing is that they are prepared to think together with you like in realizing a bosscreem for my Rollei GX 2,8 Edition .

I like to promote the use of this screen among large format aficionados and make it known to all those who don't.

If you have ever used a screen with a Fresnel lens built in like Wista, you know that they are really badly though and are almost impossible to use with a loupe, try the Bosscreen and wouldn't want anything else. This is my third screen and I'll probably will buy more.

Another thing about the Yaw-free movements.

If you really think you need them(most people don't and they certanly

don't need them in field photography). You can obtain a pretty good

yaw-free camera jut tilting the camera on the side and in so doing

thasform vertical in to horizontal movements and if your camera has

axis tilts, voila' you have Yaw-free movements. Curious about it, try

it! In reality since cameras arewn't made to be used this way the

movements might be less than confortable but Hey! it is yaw-free

isn'it!

Aaron,

as usual when posting a broad question like this you are about to

receive tons of opinionated contributions, the do's and dont's , the

pro's and con's.

The only thing is prioritize and look at the different qualities of

each camera and your requirements.

I seem to have understood that price and wideangle capabilities are

your priorities.

Wista VX is a good camera I have owned one for 3 years and sold but

liked it all the way.

it isn't a Japanese Linhof, the only similarities end at the metal

constuction, the rotating back, and the lens board; but all the rest is

radically different.

The Wista has wideangle capabilities which are different from the

Linhof and I don't intend to discuss the merits of both. Suffice to say

that it is true that the recessed lens board is very good but as

someone else said if making vertical shots you might just photograph

the base of the camera.It can happen from 75mm under(I have some 6x12cm

shots with the nice endbit of the camera in it, both pinhole and

regular lens!). The camera is poorly reppresented around the world and

accessories are pricy and difficult to get. The Wideangle bellows

aren't cheap and extension rail or bellows are a real rarity and very

expensive. The revolving back of the Vx has a funny prong which you

are led to believe that is the lever to enable the rotation-wrong- the

thing has no purpose on the VX but only applies to higher models the VX

has only click stops in four position.The spring loaded back has a

feature which only comes handy if you use a Prontor shutter and that

otherwise sits in the way of some film or Polaroid holder actually

pushing the holder out of place!

The Walker is heavy, but it is a fantastic camera, what you apreciated

in the Wista , the recessed lensboard is the same as in the Wista and

the bag bellows are very good.

it comes in two models a standard and a wideangle.

It is incredibly sturdy!

You cam be rough to this camera and it will still love you.

Do not dismiss the ABS it looks very army-like but it is great.

Photographers are feticists so we go for nice things instead of

functional things, but if reason plays any role in the choice, Walker

is the one.

Now if you want extended camera back movements then you might consider

other cameras too.

The Shen Hao is good but not yet finished(the metal parts are very

sound but lack the perfection of the stainless steel of the Walker) the

way that some other cameras are. The wideangle capabilities are O.K.

and I know the company is working on improving it.

The wood is beautiful teak, the back movements are very good and

certanly good value for money. I sell them at the moment and I am using

one, will articulate more on this camera as I experience it in the

field.

regards

BTW. Canham is great too and although I know little about them speaking

to the owner at the last three Fotokinas and having been fiddling about

his cameras has been real fun,very well made too!

Abaut the Shen Hao, better get in touch with them directly at

http://www.camerachina.com or e-mail perry@camerachina.com

To mr. Perry Wang. I am the Dutch importer(at least having bought four

cameras and sold one I feel myself entitled to the title!)and would

sell to rivates but selling across the Atlantic seems to me a way to

finance the custom and post service, so I sell only in Europe.

Good luck! In writing Shen Hao, please quote my name.

Could you please go to visit Shen Hao at stand #1027? I have previously

invited all contributors to go and visit this new company and look at

their new large formats, I'd like to share my experience with other

contributors since I recently begun importing their cameras in Europe.

Bring my regards to Mr. Perry Wang and share with us your impressions.

Thanks!