catherinevankempen

Hey Eugene, are the lost photos the stepping out/in/over fashion (can't remember the exact title you put on them ... anyhow, they are there, I just clicked through all the comments (without rating, too many to be quick about it) but they are most definitely there. I think they just don't let us see our own pictures in the rating part so we wouldn't be able to give ourselves 7/7 ;) So, no, you didn't do anything wrong. Cheers, Catherine.

I don't think you can see your own images in the rate photos part. Only in the critique forum. There is also a box that you can check to not let your images be rated, only critiqued. Cheers, Catherine

William, so here is where I 'fess up to my complete ignorance when it comes to music (my husband would be ashamed

of me since he is a musician). The first thing I'm doing after typing this answer is googling the song you

mentioned!

 

Fred, thank you so much for your insightful critique, your comment is exactly the kind of feedback I was hoping

for. I had my little story all worked out in my head but somehow between the working it out and the actual

shooting things tend to get jumbled. Add that to the embarrassment of showing up at the park or a bar (gasp)

with three chairs and shooting them ... welllll, you get the picture. I can promise you, I've gotten some pretty

weird looks working on this project.

Hi all, I've been working on a photo story and I was wondering if you guys could critique my work in progress. I

think I'm still missing a couple of frames and I would like to reshoot some of the ones I have but before I go

back to the drawing board I'd like some honest advice from my favorite critics :) Please view this as a slide

show since it helps with the narrative. Thanks a bunch, Catherine.

 

http://www.photo.net/photodb/slideshow?folder_id=847521

Hey Anthony,

 

Speak for yourself!!!!

 

;)

 

Catherine

Mike,

 

"First of all, everything has been done before...."

 

I agree with you on that one. I actually just responded to a post with those exact words. This does not mean that it is not up to the photographer to decide how he or she is going to develop their work.

 

"I would like to point out though that I did not post this in hopes of having someone tell me what to do for a final show. It was simply to get a conversation going and hopefully get my mind going in other directions. If I don't have any new ideas coming into my head, then my current thoughts will most likely just circulate and never develop further."

 

Why would you want your mind to go in other directions. You do what you do, you shoot what you shoot. Maybe if you have nothing else coming into your head it means your not ready to move on?

 

I think a better to pose this question is to show us your work, show us those images that you are proudest of and then see what comes from that. Having someone outside of your program critique your work may be a better way of letting your work grow than just asking others for ideas/concepts. I'm sure that plenty of people here would be more than willing to help you out in that way.

 

Oh and one more to thing in response to your statement that taking an other's concept and using is not cheating ... it really is. Like I said, I agree that everything has been done before, however, research, looking at other photographers, learning from your colleagues, ... is part of it. Finding what you want to do and adapting it and making it your own is the hard part and I guess this is where the omnipresent "concept" comes in.

 

Good luck

Catherine

Walter, I'm afraid that if you're looking to do something ground breaking, never been done before, show stopping your pretty much out of luck. Unless you are 100 times more talented and creative than the average photographer is, everything has been done before and probably better than you could ever do. The question is what is new to you. Cheers, Catherine

David, I am sorry but since I am new to photonet I did not realize that only a moderator could delete posts in the forums. For this I do apologize. I did not receive a notice that my post had been deleted do I am assuming there was glitch, which I did mention in my previous response. Oh, and no, I do not consider my post offensive. I will rewrite what I mentioned in my original post and you can be the judge of it.

 

Mike, since you did not get my answer I will post it again. Oh, and I do apologize for going off on you, apparently I was blaming you for something you can not do.

 

I find it hard to believe that after I assume 4 years in a photo program you have nothing to work with. I recommended going through all the contact sheets of everything you ever shot while in school and trying to find the thread that runs throughout.

 

I find it strange that you would ask others for a concept. To begin with I think the word concept can be interpreted in a very broad sense. What I found during my 5 years in art school is that what the professors are really looking for is for you to think about what you're doing and not just going about things willy nilly. Everyone has a reason to shoot what they do and it is up to you to figure out what that reason is.

 

It is important for you senior show that there is some consistency in your work. A show where a tree is hung next to a body scape, next to an abstract next to a self portrait does not flow and does not give the viewer a chance to really see what your work is all about.

 

Taking someone else's idea and running with it seems a little bit like cheating to me. Finding your type of photography is half the work. The other half is perfecting it. I remember in photo I we would get a new assignment every week: motion, architectural, nature, abstracts, ... Once we get past the photo I phase it is important that you spend more than a week practicing and reshooting "your" style or subject.

 

Even a commercial photographer needs to develop a style so that when one sees a photograph by you they will immediately say ... that must be by Mike. In your initial post I can already see what your concept is, it just needs to be executed. Why not just trust your own instincts, rather than depend on others to tell you what to shoot.

 

I remember getting very frustrated while I was in school having to constantly explain why I was shooting what I was working on. But after a while I realized that if nothing else it made me think more about what I was doing rather than just going around pointing my camera at whatever I saw.

 

Again, please go with your own ideas, taking anyone of these responses and shooting their ideas, to me, seems very close to plagiarism. Your years in school are meant to let you develop as a photographer. Shoot what you want to shoot, do it in your own way and I'm sure you'll be just fine.

 

Though most of the students in my program where going the art gallery route, some, like you were obviously more drawn to commercial photography. This does not they weren't creating art and they still had a "concept" which I prefer to call "personal style" that they developed over the years. I have posted a link to one of the girls in my class that was more of a commercial photographer and I still think her work is very artistic.

 

http://www.randallscottgallery.com/caitlin_phillips.html

 

Good luck,

Catherine

Hi Mike, am i to understand that you deleted my comment or did it simply not post as I intended. If it was a simple glitch in the photonet system than disregard the rest of this message.

 

If indeed you did delete this message simply because you didn't like what I had to say than that seems rather immature to me. I put time and effort into my answer and if you would have taken the time and got off your high horse for a minute or two you may have found there was 'in my eyes' helpful comments in there. If you post on site like photonet you can't expect everyone to agree with you. I've got to tell you, if you were so offended by my post, how on earth do you make it through a crit at school. I'm expecting you get upset quite often.

 

Anyhow, I'm sorry you didn't find my advice to your liking, I just wish you would have had the gumption to answer rather than take the rude way out and just delete.

 

Catherine

Pam,

 

In my humble opinion very few photographers will create images that are so wonderful that someone is going to steal them and make a bunch of money.

 

Even if people don't flat out steal your actual physical photo, it can still be copy-catted. Photography and art in general is constantly being copied. How many people have tried create images just like Ansel Adams or tried to be the next Nan Goldin. Besides, i'snt imitation the highest form of flattery. If you spend all your time worrying about someone stealing your stuff you are going to miss out on the really important part of shooting, your own personal pleasure. So my advice would be to chill out, enjoy your camera, take lots of pictures and post on PN to your hart's content.

 

Cheers,

Catherine

Don ---

 

Your condescension towards people not of your social, educational, and economic class is evident.

 

I resent that you assume to know me, what do you know of my social, educational, or economic class. You know absolutely nothing of who I am, where I come from, or how I got where I am today.

 

I refuse to argue with you on the rights or wrongs of our government. This post was about an entirely different topic and you for some reason latched on to a few comments made to illustrate a point. Any war, any famine, any disaster could and has been used to do so.

 

I will say one more thing, in my job I see many military personnel leaving and returning to Iraq. I will agree with you that I saw people of all ages but a large number of them were very young. I also saw the families (wives, husbands, children) crying at the gate as they boarded the plane and I can assure it is a very painful picture. I was also on more than a few flights that were bringing back the dead bodies of our soldiers with the family waiting on the tarmac crying as the plane pulled in. I have been lucky, none of my family or close friends have lost their lives to this war, but I have seen and heard enough that I can not and will not condone this war.

 

I will not pretend to be more intelligent than I am, I am not going to spout statistics at you for the simple fact that I do not have them. It is however amazing to me that otherwise very intelligent, reasonable people can become so agitated and angry on this subject.

 

I am with Fred on this all the way and he put it much better than I ever could.

 

Catherine

Don - I'm pretty sure that despite your decision to leave this discussion you will be back to check on the responses so ... If you prefer the words "men & women" that'll work for me too. "Today's armies are made up of volunteers, professionals, mercenaries, and private security forces." How can the average 18 year old be expected to make an informed decision about something as life changing as joining the armed forces and fighting a war, most of them can barely decide on a college major. How many US citizens were lured into the war with promises of great pay, protection, and wonderful benefits only to discover they had been lied to. As to the private security forces, from what I have read we may be better of without them. I think Fred is right on the money with his answer.

"Why am I dangerous or how is it dangerous to me? You cannot make a political statement or a photograph of any value out of platitudes." I think the most dangerous thing is ignorance coupled with stubbornness.

 

Pnina - "Where's the change?" I think Allen said it very well. Would it be better for the journalists to just stop reporting these atrocities? At least now we know and how much worse could it have been if the rest of the world had been kept in the dark about this? I think you agree that photography is an important tool of change.

 

I am sorry this has turned into a political battle, the question was originally about photography, not about who is right or wrong.

 

Peace Out :),

Catherine

You should become a member (paying) of PN and leech every bit of info you can on photography from these pages. I am very curious to see some of your photos too.

Cheers,

Catherine

This is obviously not the main problem here but I was under the impression that as long as she was not selling/making money off of these pictures there is no need for model release forms. Am i incorrect in this assumption. I personally do not see the big deal of her posting pictures of children on her website (and Im a mom too). My son has his picture taken all the time and not always by me, at parties, at daycare, even the YMCA has you sign a release form in case he happens to be in a picture they take and want to use for advertisement or brochures or anything. I think I'd be flattered if they choose a picture with him in it .. Anyhow, this is besides the point.

 

The issue to me seems that she is disregarding the contract between the two of you and it seems to me that you have a right to insist she remove those images from her web site.

 

 

Catherine

I am coming in a little late on this discussion but I still wanted to put my 2 cents worth in.

 

Does it really matter how many people you effect with a photo. Whether you convince 1 or 1,000,000 people that war is a terrible thing and must be avoided at all costs.

 

What if every photographer out there would just give up and decide they aren't going to make a difference. What if the writers out there give up telling us what they see because obviously its no use, governments are still waging war, boys and girls are still being sent out to fight.

 

Thinking and believing that photography can not change the world is a very dangerous attitude. I am not naive, I know photos aren't going to bring about world peace. But I do know that if we give up trying we might as well through in the towel and drop the bomb.

 

It's a pretty scary thought if you ask me.

 

Catherine

So if I understand this correctly, Prince did a series in which he rephotographed ads, one of which was a photograph by sam abell done for Marlboro. This photograph has now been bought by the Guggenheim for big bucks.

 

What I am not clear on is what was Prince's intent and ultimately does it matter.

 

Do you not think that the reason these images have become so (in)famous is precisely because of the controversy surrounding their creation. In my humble opinion that is the reason Abell's version is not in the Guggenheim.

 

It is a good picture, not a great picture. After being re-photographed by Prince it is still just a good picture, not a great picture. It's interest lies in its creation, not in its aesthetic value.

 

Do I condone what Prince has done? $%?! no!!!!!! Do appreciate I the statement he is making? Yes.

 

Just playing devil's advocate.

 

Cheers,

Catherine

Paul, Paul, Bob, thank you for your advice, it is much appreciated. How would I go about becoming a second shooter or assistant? Do I just approach several wedding photographers and see if I can tag along? Do I need a portfolio to show them, ... I am so new to this field I don't know the first thing in how it works ... obviously. Would offering my time to more friends and family to shoot events be a good way to learn (pro bono of course) or is it the working with a professional and seeing how they work more important?

 

Anne, thank you for your wonderful compliment on my work. I guess that I get stressed out when confronted with the responsibility of getting everything perfect on someones big day and I'm afraid to take risks. Maybe I could offer my time to friends and friends of friends and ask if I can cover their big day in addition to the professional ... would the main photographer be offended by this, is there a way I could run it by them ... maybe lay down some ground rules, what I can and can't do?

 

Thank you all for taking the time to advise me on this.

 

Catherine

Hi Paul,

I'm a flight attendant so this question was right up my alley - or aisle as the case me be ... sorry about that, I just couldnt help it :). I've taken my fair share of airplane window pictures. As has already been pointed out the shutter speeds won't make a difference. Depending on what plane your on and your seat you can sometimes get some really cool shots of the reflection of the plane in the engines, very cool. Also the wings can be very interesting compositional elements and also pretty cool in and of themselves. Depending on the time of day you can sometimes get really cool sunset/sunrise pictures. One thing is to make sure you dont get your own reflection in the window, unless that is what you want of course. This will happen if you shoot straight on the window, but if you shoot at an angle that can usually be solved. Also, if its dark outside and the cabin lights are on you won't be able to do much, but they should be off for a while after take off and before landing. About the comment concerning not being allowed to use cameras during t/o and landing ... well, I personally have never told anyone or heard anyone being told by one of my colleagues, to turn off their camera. Laptops, ipods, dvd players, ... yes, cameras, no. Technically it isn't allowed but ... you get the picture. Just make sure you have only have your camera in your lap or hands since they probably will call you out if you have a huge camera bag that isn't stowed. Have fun with this but as someone else mentioned, airplane window pictures are fun but art they usually are not. Good luck and happy travels, Catherine

Hello,

 

I have been browsing many wedding portfolios on PN and each time I am flabbergasted by the level of creativity,

talent, and technical expertise showcased here. I am almost embarrassed, but apparently not enough, to pose you

all this question. A few years ago I shot a few weddings for friends, lately I have been thinking about picking

up my camera for wedding purposes again but on a more ... dare I say it ... professional level. I have a few

pictures in my portfolio and I was hoping for some honest, tough loving from you guys. In order to make this

doable I would need to invest in a digital outfit, since I am still a film gal. Should I save my time, effort,

and money and quit while I'm ahead or do you think I may have it in me to develop my skills and actually be able

to make this into a career? I realize I only have a few pictures up, and even those aren't of the best scan

quality (please don't nail me on that). I would just hand over the negs to the couple after the big day and I'm

afraid I documented little or nothing of what I shot, not the smartest move, I know. Any ideas, comments,

critiques would be most appreciated.

 

Thank you,

Catherine

Doug, I think we are on the same page here. I guess I'm finding it difficult coming from an environment where critiquing was the name of the game and it could get ugly. The good thing was that it was face to face and there was more of a dialog going on, it wasn't the one shot deal you often get here. Since we did so much of it (I was an art student) it seldom got taken personally, everyone understood it was about the images, not about personality or getting back at someone. It didnt matter if you liked the person, you were critiquing there work. Im learning that the majority of PN'ers are on the same page as you and I.

 

Hakim, It does feel nice to get a wonderful compliment, and I cant ask for more than "catching someone's eye". I dont think you need to be a pro to critque someones work, I personally like reading or hearing what kind of emotions one of my images provokes and you don't need to be an expert to have reactions. Sometimes its even better to hear from someone who doesn't let composition and technicalities get in the way of how an images makes them feel. I'm on my way over to your portfolio, can't wait to see it.

 

Keep on Keepin' on,

Catherine

Hi Maija,

I think what kind of paper you print on is a totally personal thing. There is no right or wrong, no pro or amateur. I think every photographer goes through a lot of different papers until they find the one or some that suit them and there work. The only paper I personally stay away from for darkroom work is b&w RC because that does look pretty awful. I have printed huge prints on glossy color paper and they look absolutely great just because the subject matter fits. That being said, I have yet to find a really nice digital glossy paper. You can tell the ink just sits on top, the image is not a part of the paper like with darkroom prints, oh how I miss working in a darkroom.

Good luck,

Catherine

Hi Alexis,

Here is my all time favorite list of books on photography

For intro stuff I agree with Barbara London's "photography". I really liked Henry Horenstein's "Color Photography" book. If you are going to be shooting a lot of B&W I'd recommend Carson Graves' "Zone System for 35mm photography". A book that really helped me with lighting is Christopher Grey's "master lighting guide for portrait photographers". It gives a very straightforward explanation of all the different types of lighting and how to accomplish them. Now if you want to see what those lighting techniques can do for you I loved Steve Bavister's "lighting for portrait photography". It has some next to impossible lighting set ups but it is very inspirational. A book I really like to see what the range of the all the different types of photography is is the "Photo Book" published by Phaidon. My personal bible is Christopher James' "book of alternative photographic processes" but that is pretty specialized and if you are looking to get into commercial photography probably pretty useless to you. To me it is absolutely inspiring.

I agree with the others that interaction with other photographers is going to teach you the most though. Take a class, join a photo club, be a faithful visitor to PN, ...

Where do you live, maybe someone can give you some hints on where to take classes.

Good luck,

Catherine

I have not shown any work recently, but while I was still in school it was stressed that presentation was the most important part of a gallery show. You can have the most gorgeous image ever but if is printed poorly and matted and framed shoddily people will judge your work on that.

As to size, that is really up to you. If your subject matter lends itself to big images, by all means go as big as you can get it and vice versa.

I would not recommend you try to cut corners or do it the cheap way when it comes to a gallery showing. This is how you are choosing to present yourself and your work to the art community. Especially if you are looking to further a career in this field it is of utmost importance that you leave a professional impression.

Every show I have ever been in I have always used black metallic frames (nielsen) with museum white mats. Not cheap by any means but your work just pops when they are professionally presented. Oh, and if you are printing bigger pieces use plexi since most galleries won't even accept glass frames.

Dick Blick carries nielsen frames <http://www.dickblick.com/zz174/11a/> but you could probably even go to a place like Michaels or Hobby Lobby and get somewhat cheaper simple black frames. Just remember if your frames look cheap that's what people are going to remember about your work.

About printing, I always do my own printing, be it darkroom or digital so I'm afraid I cant help you on that one.

Good luck,

Catherine

Hey Christopher,

 

If nothing else you learn something new from these forums because I had no idea what marmite was till I googled it.

I do agree with your post though, art is by nature a subjective thing. I think it is next to impossible to view any art in a purely objective way. We are humans and humans will always attach their own experiences to anything they view.

 

That being said, I am passionate, I am proud, and I am ambitious, ... its the realistic part I still need to work on.

 

BTW I checked out your portfolio and I guess I'm a lover. I never have had the self confidence to take a red rectangle and tell people: I have created this, this is my art. I admire and envy you that.

 

Catherine

Hi Ilia,

I'm afraid I disagree on that point. I do not believe critique implies one party is superior to the other. I think "being critical" and "critiquing" are two different things. Being critical has a more negative connotation than the word critiquing carries with it. I think constructive (with constructive being the key word here) critisism is a conversation between two, in this case photographers. It is an exchange of ideas; it is not meant to tell someone there work is bad or how they should shoot. It is just a way for two artists to exchange ideas about ones work.

 

The reason I post my pictures on PN is to see what others think of my work, what they think I could do to improve, what others think works or doesn't work. I think this is where being thoughtful comes in. It is so easy to say you do or don't like someones work, it is much more difficult to tell them why. Everyone has their likes and dislikes, and most everyone will have a different opinion. If I see a photo I really like but it is not sharp I could "critique" that photographer by saying that I really like the image, I like the emotion, composition, color, lighting ... but it is distracting to me that the image isn't sharp. On the other hand if I think a photo is absolutely gorgeous I will say why.

 

I think the reason why I read complaints on PN about people not getting their work critiqued is because others are afraid to give an honest critique. If you only react to those image you really like, the less successful images get no feedback and are left to wonder what people really think or how they may improve their images. It seems so much more constructive to me to openly say to someone:"In my eyes this image is not working because of ... [fill in the blank]. Whether or not that person agrees with you, disagrees, sort of agrees, ... really doesn't matter, it is just a different opinion.

 

If I just want people to pat me on the back and say how wonderful my work is I just show it to my mother who would still put my pictures up on the fridge if I let her. According to her I am the next Nan Goldin or Cindy Sherman (not that she knows who those women are but you get the picture).

 

Anyhow, I have rambeled on long enough, but if I can ask you for one favor, if you do run across one of my images and you have any kind of emotional reaction to it, be it positive or negative, please let me know. I for one would welcome it.

 

Catherine