jonathan brewer

Have you been to ClassicCameras.US?

 

He's doing business as bpwltd.com, I just picked a shade from him

for my Minolta Autocord, best thing about it this outfit is on the

westcoast, in southern California, in Culver City which is LA.

 

He's got 35mm, plenty of MF, SLR, TLR, Rangefinders, and some LF.

 

I met the owner, Brian who seems personable and knowledgeable

about old and classic cameras, and he stocks a bunch of 'em pluss

accessories, he's got a lot of accessories, and it's great to be able

to actually look before buying since he's on the westcoast, check out

his stock at his website.

Francis...........since this is a matter of a custom camera with possibly new tooling it may cost you the same regardless of whether the camera is a 12x20 or a 20x24, for the amount of money involved you might consider giving them a 'bid', in other words, instead of asking 'how much' your project will be, tell them what you would like for the amount of money you want to spend.

 

 

'I want a 20x24 for x amount of dollars', they are not going to shout 'no' over the phone the second you make this request they will take some time and discuss your bid with their braintrust and their Artisans and they will give you a counteroffer or they will simply say yes they can do it.

 

 

They are not going to look down their nose at 10, 15, 20 grand, so they may consider making a 20x24 for the same price as the 12x20 since it will be a customized project no matter what they do, so I would not assume that since a 12x20 is so much, that a 20x24 must be more, if you automatically assume that, you're in a sense giving on a negotiating point that they may not insist upon for the bigger format, don't assume that they won't compromise on the issue of 'the bigger the format, the more we want', as opposed to your point which could be, 'it's new tooling regardless of the format so what about a 20x24 for this amount', they will consider it, I guarentee you, and at worst you get a counteroffer.

 

Deal, they'll deal, from what you've said, they looking at big money, they won't be so quick to ask you for more or say no, you've got the money for the project, they know that, they won't be giving you ultimatums on price.

'I spend an afternoon with him talking and handling his Ebony 20x26'................................What did his camera cost? I ask because I have in mind what Fracis is considering, so I wonder if the tooling/design already exists for a camera that is here and happens to be an Ebony.

 

I also see from another thread that an Ebony 11x14 is roughly 10 grand and change, francis what if you can get an Ebony between the 11x14 and the 20x26 that may be way cheaper with idea of cropping to 12x20 from a different format?

 

What if you can get a different format, crop to what you want, and save thousands, is this a consideration?

You steered the thread regarding the ULF toward the issue of cost effectiveness/performance, he's made it clear that he doesn't care, so it isn't a matter of big deal, it's no deal at all.

 

A work of Art valued as priceless can consist of a few dollars in stretched canvas and pigments, the 'value' we give this 'work of Art' is in our heads, a perception of something on the canvas that makes it worth more than its components, antique furniture sell for as much as a quarter million dollars, you may be talking about a couple of hundred dollars of wood, the 'perception' of it's value as a work of art valued at $250,000.00 is in the minds of some people because of how it joined and finished, performance is of course only one of the things considered by someone who purchase something, people can pay big money for intangibles, there may in fact not be that much difference in the performance of a $20,000.00 camera and a Korona or that much of a difference between the Korona and a Gandolfi.

 

Art/functional art has almost never been cost effective, and of course the bottom line is which pocket the money is sitting in, end of story.

Once you get past $500, it's all expensive, photography is not cheap, now I will not be getting a $20,000.00 camera any time soon, but there is somebody somewhere who is saying the same thing about the money I spent on my Toyo 810MII, in fact there was a post where they did say it.

 

There were probably some photographers reading and/or participating in the recent ULF Ebony thread who scoffed at the idea of an idividual considering buying a $20K camera, among those individuals I would venture that they're are some who, if they added up the cost of their cameras, strobe equipement, lenses, stands, softboxes, camera gear bought and sold in the past, films and other expedables, plus the cost of the computer gear they're typing these threads on would come up with what amounted to a fortune.

 

Past $500.00, since everything is relative, you could make a case for any camera costing more than that amount to be a ridiculous purchase. Most serious photographers Pro and Amateur, are on a quest for perfection, for the best work, the biggest negative, the sharpest lens, and in a sense there is a kind of reverse denial going on when somebody, myself included can claim that we found a deal on a particular lens for $750.00 that sells everywhere else for $1500.00.

 

I would be curious about the total amount of money spent on photography particularly by some of the folks who commented on the ULF Ebony thread and some the regular contributers of both forums from day one to the present, a would bet that the amount for more than a couple of dozen would approach 30, 40, 50 grand, and not just for the working pros.

 

I based this assumption on reading all these threads on the forum and what people say they've bought, one guy who says he is not a pro and who participated in the ULF Ebony thread, scoffed at the idea of the purchase of a $20,000, has purchased quite a bit more than this amount per his posts in cameras, tripods, heads, and so forth.

 

I'm not buying a $20,000 camera, but for me and a lot of other folks it all adds up, I think if everybody around here were to add up what they have actually spent of photography from the beginning they would be shocked. One year after my wife did the taxes she mentioned what I had spent on purchases that year, I was shocked, yes it would make an interesting thread to have everybody come clean about what they've spent, I would guess that the range would be from $200.00 to xxxxx,xx.

 

One telling comment that I found stunning was the comment on the ULF Ebony thread that these ULF cameras are on backorder, there seem to be a number of folks who are buying these cameras, is it ridiculous, hey, a guy who loves cars may sink money into a car that he should using to spray his house for termites, a guy who loves boats may sink all his discretionary income into his boat, I know from comments I've read here that like me with my wife there are folks here who had a diaglogue with their wife about purchases, a case could be made that the pursuit of the ultimate by the obsessed describes a hell of a lot us not just somebody considering the purchase of a $20,000 camera.

Everything is relative, the money I paid for one of my rolls of film I've got in my freezer is a fortune to somebody who hasn't eaten in a week.

 

I would ask you to reconsider Michael since it would leave one less person on the forum who feels as you do.

 

'There never was a cowboy who couldn't be throwd, there never was a horse who couldn't be rode'...........well now I guess there isn't a camera somebody can't afford. My hats off to you francis, whatever anybody thinks, it your money, if and when you get it, I'd like to see it.

Francis............feel free to ask your questions and speak your mind, now and in the future, if the question wasn't legit the moderators would've deleted, they haven't so fire away.

Quite a few processes that precede today's modern film are in use starting with the Daguerrotype, and still with us are Kallitypes, Salted paper, POP, Platinum prints, Bromoils, Cyanotypes, the number of folks doing these alternative processes is growing not dwindling, of course my Brother in Laws digital camera of old is a paperweight right now since it can't talk to todays software.

 

No true artform or its tools ever dies, and it's my firm belief that the people of the future will have the same wonder and awe for their past as we have for ours.

I'm having too much fun on this Classic Camera forum, SO NO FLAMES, but I will say this, having been into digital since '97 I send certain trends and cycles that were not apparent to me when I started, the promise of digital is truly that of a 'kid in a candy store', over the long haul, the grueling long haul at times, is the hours spent with tech support after the hours spent on hold waiting to talk with tech support, the constand upgrades(I started on Photoshop 3), hours/weeks/months deciphering manuals, crashes, patches, shipping the tower back to the manufacter, spending a LOT of time working on an imagfe in Photoshop for a client, I've been through all of this.

 

My point regarding this issue relating to trends and cycles is that when folks first get into digital, it's new and innovative and all of those things, the cameras, backs, software, photoshop and REMEMBER I said this, Digital is great AS adjunct/supplement to film/as a marriage made in heaven with film, now is it a replacement, I just won't get into that, but whatever digital is, it is FOR ME expensive(a fortune on the combined upgrades since I started in '97), time consuming(downtime, studying manuals for Photoshop/Freehand/Illustrator), but I digress.

 

I STILL USE DIGITAL, BUT WHAT I GET FROM MY FILM AND CLASSIC CAMERAS IS SOMETHING DIFFERENT, the two things are not the same, for me and for a lot of people it just isn't going to be a case of either/or, it doesn't need to be, I believe lower prices for film/Classic/35mm/MF/LF gear is a boon, more people will buy not less, which means more film consumed, and as I've said in other forums there are millions of cameras on the planet going back in excess of 100 years, I've heard that(correct me if I'm wrong) film is a moneymaker for many film manufacturers who then dump the profits into Digital R&D,

I believe this to be the very point/issue of how/why film and classic Cameras will always be around, film gear(the bells n whistles notwithstanding) doesn't change all that much and most of the improvements are in the film, with Digital it's the gear itself that goes through reinvention, several times.

 

Now as I've said, this is my opinion so spare me a verbal war, I simply feel that whatever is lowering the prices be it digital or otherwise that film/film cameras have been around too long and are too resilient to be counted out as they have been in the past, I believe that my Son's Greatgrand son will be using my Agfa Super Isolette.

Let me know when you're tired of that Healey, also remember what you said about it when it comes to naming a price.

Some while back you could ge a Mamiya Pro SD, 127mmKL lens, Pro-SD back for under $2000.00 or thereabouts from Robert White, Lawrence who you can contact at .....ebaylaw168@yahoo.com.......as of a couple of years ago was selling the above outfit for $1750.00, he also sells 645 gear and accessories, all of it with a warranty.

 

These prices compare favorably with used gear here in the states, which makes the issue of a grey market warranty to me a moot point, I firmly believe that more gear is going to be sold brand new/used now than ever, and that the ultimate winner is the photographer on a limited budget.

 

In case you're wondering I've bought plenty of gear from Lawrence and he honest, prompt, and offers a warranty, and he and/or the folks like him, along with Robert White helped in a big way to drive the mark-ups down that were in force for years.

 

That's great you could buy and assess the used gear that you bought, could return it and go new for a reasonable amount.

When I got my Super Isolette from him he knocked off $175.00 from his sticker price because I told him I was interested in the camera but wasn't paying the his current asking price, my sense of him is that he will throw prices out there, if nobody bites he'll deal, he likes stuff to move.

I posted in an earlier thread about checking out UK websites and

also German websites for MF folders, the German outfit that sold me my

as new Agfa Super Isolette is located at

....................http://www.arsenal-photo.com/index.htm...........they

have everything for sale, everything classic from 35mm to LF, check

'em out.

I would ask you to think of this from another angle, you have a tight budget so I'm assuming that means not a lot for an expensive repair, to me this suggests getting a 'A-team camera' of a known standard, a Mamiya/Blad/Bronica/Pentax because my thinking is the less money you have the more you need a dapendable camera.

 

A Kiev is a gamble, I think it's a gamble worth taking if you have another camera/if you're in a position to gamble which I don't think you are, good luck.

It would depend on how you threaded the leader to the take up spool.

The correct positioning of the roll means that after you've snapped the roll into the top and bottom spindles you'll be pulling the leader out out from that roll BETWEEN the roll and the back, and then around and over the pressure plate, and then in between the back and take-up spool.

Your camera works with Polaroid film, you've checked the operation of the camera, you took out the darkslide when you exposed the 120 film, the only logical conclusion is that you loaded the film backwards, with the film facing the pressure plate and the backing facing the lens.

 

If something else is wrong you shouldn't be able to get an exposure with your polaroids, so either it's a loading problem or the film defective.

Lex......be advised that the Agfa Super Isolette(coupled rangefinder, senses first frame) is more plentiful in the UK than around here, I got one of my Agfas from there after a deal with somebody here in the states didn't work out. You need to search the classic dealers out the UK because IMHO there are many more mint and/or as new and for a lower price.

 

I've been advised that you should watch out for the transport system if you go for a Super Isolette as they are reportedly impossible to fix, so that you be your first question about this camera, the Agfa that I got from the UK was mint-, but I still had to take both of them(one from the Uk, one from Germany) to Ross Yerkes who said that the rangefinders on both cameras were mis-aligned, so I in fact had to have both cameras CLA'd adding $140 to what I paid for the cameras, I'm not really unhappy to the extent that everything else on the cameras were as represented.

 

One was from the UK and the other Agfa was Germany(as new unit), so search German dealers there may be a few that have been doing nothing but collecting dust for years.

 

These things looked good when I got 'em after Ross Yerkes cleaned and polished them, they have an 'Art Deco' sculpted and lithe beauty, you will not be sorry if you find an example in good shape, also ask whether or not the rangefinder has clouded up.

Feel like it's carved out of sold steel doesn't it.............

In that time period I was like any young person, I paid more attention to my future than my past, so I eventually sold my Nikon FTN and Vivitar Ser 1 35mm-85mm(that first series 1 lens was a truly great lens) which I sorely miss now. I used this camera to get my first shots which everyone who looked at them suggested that I had found my calling, for several years I went everywhere with camera, I had loved watching movies, especially how the close-ups were framed, had watched a TV series about a reporter with a 4x5 camera call 'Man with a Camera' starring Charles Bronson, had watched the movie 'Blow-up' about a famous photographer who discovers a murder while he thinks he's photographing something else.

 

For the better part of a year I would take this camera to MacArthur park in Los Angeles to photography everybody there, there were wary of me but after the better part of three months, but after this they stopped paying attention to me, I became the park photographer, the camera became an extention of my arm, and then unfortunately my eye wandered to something else and being a youngster without a lot of money I traded the Nikon and Vivitar on something else.

 

I will of course never find this camera, it is now nothing more than a pleasant daydream for me, but if I could find a bottle on the beach, rub it three times to cause a puff of smoke which produces a Genie who offers me any three wishes of my choice, I would spend some serious time contemplating this 'old friend'.

Keyword is has the Mamiya RB you're after been properly maintained and not abused, if not they'll last forever, and won't jam, you'll need a 'no-hassle' return guarentee from the seller which means he selling you a good camera, and you'll need to take it to a technician to confirm it's condition otherwise it's be what you paid for it up front + the CLA and/or repairs.

 

Things that be wrong are endless if the camera has been abused/dropped/neglected, like the rack focus out of whack, seals dried up/crumbling, at some point in time Mamiya went to a newer type shutter because the older type shutters would sag and this didn't happen often but it could/can happen.

 

Get a moneyback guarentee and a grace period to have a tech give the camera a clean 'bill of health' then you are in business becuase some of these RB have reportedly gone 20-30 yrs without malfunction in spite serious neglect in many cases.

 

I would urge despite your budget to think of TWO cameras eventually, the RB is big, but you can supplement it with an Autocord or Rolleiflex TLR, sure you're stuck with one lens with the TLR but so was Avedon, the RB system and the Autocord should be somewhere in the ballpark of your budget, this gear will give you ability to 'hang with anybody', the flexibility of having multiple lenses nothwithstanding.

 

Just don't get talked into/stuck with a dog.

I would also suggest that it's a good idea to sand whether you use a scraper or not, get plenty of practice before going the scraper route, steaming it up is good too, but you'll also need to sand, wetsanding is great after drysanding with your 120 grit and 150 grit, then wetsanding the danish in with 320 grit don't wetsand it coarse grit, but I recommended the sanding since it takes the least off leaving a bigger margin for error if you have't done these repairs before.

 

Maybe we've started you off in a new career.

Buy 120 grit, 150 grit, and a sheet of 180-220 grit of sandpaper, sand around/and the marks themselves to get the marks and the area around the marks smooth and on the same level(not the whole camera, just a small area around the marks), depending on whether your camera wood was stained or not you need to find a Danish Oil(it comes in clear and with a stain to match the look of several woods) which you can use with a fine steel wool(not the one you use on your sink/the one sold for applying danish oil) or a rag, dip the fine steel wool/rag in the danish and apply to the area you've sanded, wipe off excess after 5-10 minuets and you're done unless you want to apply more coats.

 

If you're not confident doing this yourself, understand go to a Rockler's or other Woodworking outlets with your camera, they'll walk you through making what is essentially an 'itty bitty repair', woodorkers are just like photographers they won't turn you away, they'll definitely be intrigued by your camera and will help you, guarentee you.

 

Do the above before taking it to a woodworker, but having said that an Artisan may just fix for you or charge you a nominal fee, this isn't a big repair so don't pay out a roll, materials will come to$10-$20 for you to do it.

 

This is assuming you don't have overcoats(polyurethane) on the camera which you probably don't, take it to a woodworkers supply outlet if you're unsure and they'll tell and as I said, they'll help, no biggie.

Try Craig Camera, he sells manuals and/or Xeroxed copies of manuals, dial in his website with your search engine. Good luck.

Skully.....by all means e-mail me with what I need to do, I'm not to sure abuout how to do that, so if you'll kindly walk me through it, and if you guys have agreed to this then I'll follow your directions and upload to my portfolio.