mark_man

Excellent question and one which I've often thought about. I guess the digital era is different to the film one where SLR feature sets were relatively constant within a price range, and you would keep a body essentially until it wore out. I thought when I finally converted from film to digital in the form of a 5D that I would keep using it for a long time, possibly even permanently. The 5DMkII, however, appears to be a major development at this price point, especially in high ISO performance as well as video (which we all say we don't need but I suspect we'll all find an excuse to use...). Until the DSLR sector matures (not for some time yet), there will continue to be significant improvements, and useful new features introduced. That "permanent" xD camera will not appear for a little while yet...

My take:

 

If the 5DMkII performs as advertised this will be an excellent and well priced successor to the 5D (and I for one will

upgrade from my existing 5D)

 

Canon has moved ahead of SonyNikon in terms of sensor technology (resolution/ISO balance) (other aspects may

be arguable)

 

The MP race is heating up, not slowing down. Canon is making an emphatic statement: 21MP is for the midrange,

NOT the next flagship. The 1Ds replacement will come soon, and will be 30+ MP, if not 40+. In Canon's view, the

just released A900 and presumed equivalent Nikon will be competing at a lower level than Canon's new flagship.

 

SonyNikon has succeeded in forcing Canon to lift their game, but has to get back on the front foot to compete

against a resurgent Canon.

Canon has a history of releasing DSLRs which seem to tread on the toes of their bigger brothers at least in terms of

MP eg 300D/10D, 400D/450D/20D/30D, now 50D/5D. I don't see why it shouldn't happen again. Presumably Canon

is

more concerned about bettering Nikon's offerings than upsetting its own customers. Anyway, I think people are well

used to the concept of rapid obsolescence by now.

 

I agree that the never-ending MP race is more about marketing than real advances in printing quality but that does

not mean we're nearing the end by any means. The march towards ever higher pixel counts will continue for some

time yet, as will the inexorable shift to larger sensors. Forum posters can say what they like about being happy with

xx MP, x.x crop etc, but the bottom line is that paying customers' perceptions determine how the market behaves -

and clearly most paying customers do not post on these forums!

 

BTW, I do regard the ISO race as being of real value to at least some photographers, myself included.

I would not discount the possibility of the 5D replacement being superficially close in spec to the current 1Ds MkIII.

With the 50D, Canon has shown its hand in terms of what their current technology is capable of. Surprisingly (given

Canon's recent slow pace of technological progress), we know there is now very substantial headroom in terms of

ISO and MP at least. We could see a MkIV in the not too distant future which would put a 21MP 5DMkII (and

anything else for that matter) well and truly in the shade... Nikon had better be planning on a 30+ MP flagship...

I think the unexpectedly early and highly specified 50D indicates a more aggressive stance from Canon (thank you Nikon...) The next couple of DSLRs from Canon will almost certainly also contain big jumps in ISO and MP, taking advantage of their well established FF semi/pro line. I don't think Canon will be worried about the 5D replacement interfering with the 1DsIII in terms of MP - my guess is that the mark III will be soon upgraded with a shocking MP number in order to emphasise its flagship status.

I for one am very pleased that Nikon is pushing Canon to offer even higher and better ISO performance. For weddings and people photography in general, the ability to capture available light images in (very) low light conditions I find extremely valuable. 1600/3200 on my 5D is not always adequate even using f1.8 (and it would be great to be able to use smaller apertures). For me, signficantly improved ISO performance would definitely trump more MP a la Nikon's D3.

 

BTW the point about the specs being like the 5D replacement are of course very valid - people have been saying for some years now that the two lines will merge at some point, that point could come very soon...

I think it's been very clever of Nikon not to target Canon head-on with the D3. This way, it's unclear to the average punter which DSLR is actually better. Actually, it's unclear for everyone! Doesn't matter, sounds like a great camera which should put a bit more pressure on Canon, especially pricewise (hopefully). Looking forward to seeing more Nikon FF DSLRs too...

Very happy for all the Nikon users out there! Despite the naysayers, Nikon has of course long realised the value of FF and has now proved that DSLRs are no exception with the D3 announcement.

 

Great move not to do a me-too re Canon. Instead they've gone for a low-res, high speed, very high ISO FF combo which Canon doesn't currently offer. Should sell very well, and hopefully will push Canon to reduce prices and offer even more innovation.

Point taken Jon - seemed a bit far fetched to me too. But it would definitely be in Canon's interests to not hack off too many EFS lens owners if/when it eventually moves the xxD line to FF. Technically difficult yes, but marketing wise, very clever if they can do it. And yes, I think most new DSLRs (except entry level models) will be FF or near FF in the future, even non-Canon DSLRs - give it 10 years or thereabouts...just my HO.

Also interesting if you look at the 5Dmk2 page is the entry for 19th Aug which talks about Canon potentially allowing use of EFS lenses on its FF DSLRs. Thus blurring the line between its cropped and FF bodies. So those EFS lenses might not be a complete waste of money after all... Also supports the theory that the xxD line could eventually become FF - without completely alienating past/current users. Myself, I think I'll wait till 2/08 for the 5D replacement.

Wow! Roll on 5D replacement...at PMA...please?

Hate to be the first to raise it but you might have a credibility problem if you go with Sony for weddings at the moment... Sad to say but perception counts in this game - punters like the Sony brand on their TVs, not their wedding photographer's DSLR. Wait until Sony takes over Nikon, then you'll be safe shooting weddings with your Sony!

Jessops has basically pulled out of supplying anything but rubbish consumer films. They're busy chasing the digicam market and then they wonder why no-one prints anymore...

I think the apparent "overtaking" of the 30D by the alleged 400D supports the theory that the 30D successor will represent a much more significant advance than the 20D -> 30D makeover. Hopefully the much anticipated 30D/5D FF hybrid many of us have been waiting for...? Definitely I agree with Bob that it's now looking quite likely that the 30D will have a relatively short shelf-life. PMA 2007 would therefore be a logical time to replace both the 30D and the 5D with one DSLR in one hit. If the price were midway between the two I'd buy it!

According to Uncle Bob we only need to wait a couple more weeks - Canon's "reply" is due on the 24th isn't it? Don't jump ship just yet!

With film, you get the colour, skin tones etc you like straight out of the box. (this is assuming of course you've found films which you like)

Can I make a suggestion? Start with one lens (whether prime or zoom) and build from there. It's just a way of disciplining yourself and learning how to extract the best from a particular lens before moving on. Additionally, if you are just starting out, you may find yourself developing unexpected interests which may influence future purchases. Best not to lock yourself into a particular combination at the outset.

If you use the F10 without flash, the ISO is *not* preset at a particular value. However, it is true that the value it sets might not give you the same noise performance as if you set it yourself to a different value. Experiment in a given situation and see. It is indeed extremely useful to be able to take (relatively) low light shots without flash, though for night photography I'm not sure if you can always get away without using the flash.

Looks like good news for Canon and Nikon users as well as KM - we badly need a bit of price-pressure on the big boys. The Sony makes the D200 and even the 30D look very expensive for what they are! I definitely smell price gouging going on - Canon/Nikon are profiteering big time while APS-C sensor prices have fallen through the floor... Come on guys, you're having a laugh, aren't you?

It's not so much speed but skin tones you should be concerned with if you are shooting portraits. Try several films and see what suits you best - Fuji do produce some very nice portrait films eg Pro 400H, 160S etc.

Hate to pour cold water...but the authorities seem to prefer bad passport photos, at least in the UK! You're not allowed to smile, for instance, have to pin hair behind your ears etc. Basically, your photo needs to look like you just got off a long-haul flight so they can tell it's you and not the handsome chap you would otherwise have them believe...

Have you tried putting the same negative through both machines and compared the prints? I too would be interested to know whether the output is different on Fuji CA when using Frontier vs dlab.

I have no personal experience with the Casio, but it appears that the recent non-Fuji products touted by various manufacturers as having high ISO capabilities do *not* deliver according to dpreview. Just because the box says 1600 ISO does not mean it is useable...

I agree. Been there twice, and it really is luck of the draw! Nutleigh is right - don't forget Doubtful Sound. A bit more work, but well worth it.

Everyone tends to recommend piazzas/plazas/placas which of course are great for photo ops. I like to look for markets (which may or not be in the local piazza) for that extra dimension of colour and human-human interaction. Often markets are where the life of the town is...