mark_harrington1

<p>Sadly in California we aren't always blessed with nice clouds or even a blue sky. I always shoot wide to allow for cropping as I don't know what the client's final output request will be, its a long debate, crop in camera or in post, and I'm sure it won't be solved here. My original post was to stimulate conversation, I did not post the final image as it would not have been nearly as robust a conversation. I hoped to get some serious discussion so I could help share my knowledge and see the image from a different perspective. The image has long since been delivered to the client. Here's the final presentation form (formatted for a 10x10 album). You can see it address several of the comments made by others but sadly because of the tone and lacking a true sense of community and learning the discussion has degraded into a more defensive and frustrating process than I anticipated. You can see the negative space, formal balance, symmetry and color harmony work much better to improve the image from its original presentation. Comments regarding personal style such as bringing ladders and flowing veils are one way to shoot the image, but remember, weddings are hectic and frenetic, I've never photographed a wedding where everything worked well and ran on schedule. In this instance, bringing a ladder to the site would not have been practical, even if it could have been secured on the rocks (which it couldn't) the time to arrange and throw the veil would have eaten away at the precious 45 minutes usually allotted for formals. After all, there are many people to pose and photograph, time with the b/g is limited as they want to socialize with family and friends too. The image described with the flowing veil would also have been out of balance and harmony in this setting. The eye is always drawn to areas of greatest contrast (color, brightness, action) these are standard compositional elements. As captured the flowing veil would have led the eye out of the frame and away from the b/g who are the purpose of the image. Additionally, the way the image is presented here a single 10x10 of the couple is possible, an environmental portrait is possible as a double truck (as here) or the opposite page from the b/g could be faded to enable compositing other images. We should all strive for flexibility in our work. I'm sorry my efforts were met with derision and my work isn't up to the standards of this group and is sadly perceived as unprofessional. I'll bet I have a lot to share if egos could be put aside and a true desire to share knowledge were fostered...<br /><br /></p><div></div>

<p>Sadly Wade I agree with you. I used to love this site and frequented it often. I thought I'd try to stir the pot with an image for discussion. I selected an image that had plenty of opportunity for learning and that had good and not so good elements about it. My efforts were met with harsh opinions from it was not focused or captured correctly to it just flat out didn't meet professional standards. That's a pretty harsh statement and perhaps why people won't put themselves out there. Its no secret that putting anything on line can be discovered by prospects and clients. How would you feel if the photographer you hired or were planning to hire was tagged with comments like its not professional work? Of course, you'd be miffed and reluctant to post anything more. Making matters worse, the protagonists seem to pile on to the emotion of the image or get lost in meaningless banter about EXIF data (when the more complete metadata is the standard for editing and graphics, but I digress) to what end? Who cares what camera or settings were used to capture an image IF the information isn't used to convey a point or educate? Even more egregious is the "experts" who readily smear the poster are ignorant to the impact their comments have not only to the original poster's reputation but to the community in general, again, why would someone participate in an activity likely to cause more harm than good? Its easy to hide behind cliche's of you need to have a tougher skin or you asked for help but don't like what's said. - You want to know the real fun part? Yep, they are so confident in their own work they post nothing to show what a "professional" image should look like or at least give us an opportunity to evaluate their work so we know what emphasis to place on it. Kind of makes you sad for the lost opportunity. What qualifies most to make a critique? Sure, impact is the biggest part of the image's success, but there are many other elements that go into a successful image. Communicating clearly with knowledge is sorely lacking. Its not a too much sky, its too much negative space, its not the subject should be larger or isolated from the background, its formal and informal balance are off. What about color harmony, highlight control, shadow detail... way too much but then again I don't do professional work so I should quit bitching.<br> I asked the same question just the other day, I was pointed to several links where this issue had been discussed in the past. Sadly previous laments were not addressed so the forum continues to wilt and the question is asked again. Why did I vent so much about my experience? Sure part of it was to vent the frustration, but most was because I see something dying, right in front of me, I attempted to inject something into the mix and instead of feeling like I could participate in a safe environment, I was judged inadequate, without concern for the impact such comments may have on my business and without explanation, my original intent overlooked even though clearly stated to stimulate conversation. Did it stimulate conversation? sure did, was the conversation worth the effort - nope, it was misunderstood, I should have been more clear in my post I guess. Will I do it again? Maybe, I don't know. I do know I am a full-time professional photographer who lives an extremely good lifestyle from my efforts. <br> So I support you in your desire to see a more robust forum. I throw the gauntlet down to the others in the group, especially the more active members to post an image from their last wedding (which should be their best work yet) and use it as an opportunity to allow others to see their work so as to develop their own opinion regarding the weight they should put into the person's input and to educate the others who aspire to be like them. I've proven my worth to myself and my peers through my education and sustainability. I'm an active member of the professional organizations that relate to my business (PPA, WPPI) I attend both ImagingUSA and WPPI conferences at great cost so that I stay current in trends and techniques. I'm a CPP and will obtain WPPI-C when its released later this year so rest assured I am a professional and I can withstand any critiques given. What's the expression, Money Talks, BS Walks. I hope my challenge is accepted, its just what this group needs to move forward.</p>

Rick, I did not post this image with the intention of setting a trap, either an image works or doesn't work. iI posted this image because it has good and bad points and I'm totally ok with discussing them. I've had more than my share of critiques, both good and bad, so I am fairly immune to feedback that is specific and well reasoned. Saying a photo isn't up to professional standards without specifics is not only unfair to the maker, it can damage their reputation and persuade others who may google them for potential commissions to avoid using them. It is for this reason that a rebuttal on my part is required, and perhaps why there isn't more life in this forum. Posting metadata adds nothing to the conversation unless you say by using an aperature of 3.5 you could have reduced the shutter speed to 1/125 for example, and helped separate the subjects, but that wasn't expanded upon, so who cares that I used a D3s with an effective fl at 35mm. Again, my reasoning was to discuss what works or doesn't work not to make personal attacks such as this is not up to professional standards. You expect to be taken seriously but your critique was not serious... Lex, again I am good with critiques of my work, silly me for using the opportunity to review images as an opportunity for others to benefit from, especially those who are lurking in the shadows trying to decide how to improve their work, a model I've been trained in and use in other critique forums (pretty much most professional critiques explain why) however, when a critique is offered which is not substantiated and has the potential of discouraging business prospects a reply is mandated. Technique is quantifiable, art is subjective.

<p>Rick, I don't get offended by constructive criticism and I don't explain why an image does or doesn't work, but in this case, I will. For this image the focal point was set on client's face, shadows were opened up with fill flash due to the afternoon sun streaming in directly behind the subject; contrast was reduced in post to apply a painterly soft effect to the image which the client wanted. The image was captured in RAW and intentionally underexposed slightly to keep the whites of the dress from blowing out and shadows blocking up. Actually there was only one spot to shoot from so the POV is what it is, and I have presented the image full-frame to stimulate conversation. The final image was cropped to a 10x20 image for the client's book tightening the crop. As far as separating the client from the background, the easiest way would have been to lower the ISO and open up the aperture but this was a quick shot taken on the path back to the reception venue and we were running behind so more than three images was out of the question and I needed to make sure the faces were in focus. Side lighting would have been better to carve out some depth but not possible given the hassle of setting up the light stand in the rocky terrain and lack of time. Sometimes you just have to work the best you can, with all the elements involved and get a workable image. I think you must be seeing the effects of the paint texture layer for the oof areas because I can assure you the focal point was dead on the face. As for professionalism of the image, that is your call and subjective. I am a Professional Photographers of America Certified Professional Photographer (CPP) which means I had to pass a comprehensive written test about equivalent exposures, composition, posing, processing and a whole host of photography related topics as well as a portfolio review from 5 certified judges including things such as selective focus, short light, broad light, various ratios, posing and other such things. In addition, I have an AA degree in photography, am a Nikon NPP and support myself solely on my photography business. Does this mean every image I take is a winner? No, of course not and sometimes I just wing it and ignore all the "right ways", but it does mean that I can converse with you or anyone else in a competent, professional manner and have a basic understanding of photography, which is why I say gratuitous statements without reinforcing support aren't beneficial to anyone. In addition to all this, I just picked a recent image that had some good and bad points to discuss and was trying to breathe some activity into a forum that I used to really enjoy. If this forum is going to be just a bitch-fest of egos and one upmanship, I likely will loose interest rather quickly and continue to participate in the other forums of which I am a member. If that is the way it ends up, it will be a shame because in all of this, I'm only trying to grow and help others grow as well.</p>

<p>Everyone has a unique skill set. Some can sing quite well but can't play a note on any musical instrument. Many of the greatest photographers still have lighting technicians, retouch artists, art directors etc. I think its extremely narrow minded to think that a photographer has to be an expert in all areas of photography. Besides, even if the OP knows intimately every aspect of taking and delivering a perfect image, it doesn't mean he likes every aspect or has the desire to do so. </p>

Excellent eye on the phone Peter!

I whole heartedly agree on the crop. I would add that there are some distracting branches between the faces. As far as flatness, focus and lack of professional look, you need to be more specific and say why and how you would have shot it differently. The purpose is to learn, blanket ubjustified statements aren't teaching tools...

<p>Let's get the party started with an image review. This was taken at a wedding in December. What do you like or not like about it? How would you have posed or shot the couple?</p><div></div>

<p>I rarely visit this site anymore so my question is a bit hypocritical, but I remember a fairly robust site with lots of new threads. Granted, many were infuriating and repetitive, like What lens should I use or what should I buy next, but there was a good sense of community. I see a couple of old names I remember but sadly looking at the post, there are very few new discussions... What happened? Why is there so little activity on a site that I used to really enjoy?</p>

<p>What does your work look like? If it's the same or better than your competition you should charge the "market rate", if you still have more to learn and your images don't meet critical exposure, composition and color balance, charge what you can get...</p>

<p>I received an email from Nikon with my NPS number and a statement that the resource material and card would be sent in approximately 4 weeks. Going on 8 weeks, should I contact them or are they as slow as they seem. Do I even need the card with the number, anything else in the package I should need/want?<br> Thanks!</p>

<p>I'll jump in...<br> <br />Lauren and Evan - Poor exposure, focus, cropping, lens flare, contrast and white balance<br> Crystal and Eric - Poor focus, blown highlights, poor white balance, poor cropping, low-contrast and lens flare.<br> Jessica and Matt - Blown highlights, low contrast, lens flare, cropping issues<br> You have the potential to create some great images but you need to master exposure and focus. Use a custom white balance and crop the image for more impact. As far as story telling, I'm not seeing a common thread in any of the galleries to tell the story and the images don't do it on their own...</p>