Wall / Mur

Not sure about the crop. Thanks for any comment.

like it just as it is!congrats

Nice forms, but I kind of want to see this one more abstract. It is the sort of bare-bones photo that just begs for you to go nuts in Photoshop and create a really trippy, eye-candy artwork. And it is really rare for me to say that a decent photo needs MORE Photoshop, but this one just looks like it could be so much fun to mess with...

Good catch. I like the geometry. My only suggestion would be to clone out the utility box to the right of the door. I find it distracting.

I like that you sacrified part of the door for the sake of the geometry. An appreciated detail.

J'aime beaucoup le cadrage et la composition.

Good work ! Regards,

Nicely seen! Eye-catching. My reaction is the opposite of Rich's (again!). I'd like to see the whole door. If this were mine, I'd probably go with B&W or duotone, to enhance the abstraction and potential textures in the wall. Here's what I mean (apologies if this is totally wrong for you -- let me know and I'll delete it!). The attached is too dark, but the idea is clear.

Thanks Jenny! I'm afraid I'm no PS guru - barely getting the hang of it right now - I use it primarily to make minor adjustments, corrections or to retouch details. So believe me, you don't want to see what my "going nuts in Photoshop" would look like! :)

Many thanks Rich! Well, I wish I had the artistic intention you suggest for cropping the door, but I must confess that a few inches of dirty snow were my only reason for cropping and that, like Chris, I would have liked keeping the door whole. I just tried not to ruin the geometry with the crop... That was partly the doubt behind my original request for comments.

Thanks Iva, Ed, Mario and Claude, your positive comments mean so much to me.

Well, Chris. Glad to see you around, as always, and excited that you took the time to roll out this striking variation. I must say I **love** the texture of the wall in your version. I have to learn how I could obtain results like that in PS. The ice above and to the right of the door, as well as the stains at the base of the triangular window are given a leading role and become much more interesting (not the case at all with my few - now revealed - healing brush strokes!). So you made me see that getting rid of the color, in that regard, is a must. But the thing is I've grown attached to a few details that are no more visible in your version (at least on my monitor), details that are happening inside, through the window. I tried, while shooting, to align the shadow of the railing between the white border and the railing itself. I also like the cast shadow in the upper part of the triangle and its position relative to the railing. I feel that these shadows, and the slight discoloration of the inside wall, bring a certain depth, an added "emptiness" to the scene; a wall having a window opening on... another wall.

So... I posted a new version taking into account some suggestions in this thread: in order to make the scene more "abstract", or at least simpler, I tried to clone out the utility box, and I got rid of the reflections in the shadowy part of the window. Hope it's not too bad now...!

In any case, that lesson was a real treat for me. Thanks to everybody!

Q. When does a photo stop being a photo?

A. When you start going nuts in Photoshop.

 

Don't do it!

Hi Paul,

 

Yes, I see what you mean about the shadows on the inside wall. They are important. But it would be easy to keep them in the B&W version, no problem at all. Looking at this again now, I do think that this really is a very appealing graphic composition. You have a good eye for this sort of image.

Thanks George, I see your point!

OK Chris, I misunderstood, I thought you wanted to simplify the details in the window. As suggested by Ed, the box was distracting, I'm glad it's gone. What do you think of the retouched shadow in the window? Doesn't it look too compact? too flat? Personally I'm not entirely happy with it; I fear that it looks a bit manipulated to a trained eye.

Attached is my first B&W variation. I didn't succeed reproducing your bright, high-contrast wall of course; but I managed to preserve some detail in the triangle, even if the railing has a kind of unpleasant neon glow. The door really bugs me though, whatever I try it looks flat. Your B&W wall looks pleasantly grainy; mine looks blotchy at best.

Up to now, I still have a preference for the color version, for there is only a difference of tone between the exterior and the interior walls; in B&W, there is the added difference of texture, which, I feel, breaks their connection. Many thanks for your input, this is so helpful and fun.

Paul, The best technique for doing this in B&W is complex, though not too difficult. Almost all the texture in the wall is in the blue channel. The lines in the wall are most prominent in the blue channel also. The highlights look best in the red channel. The solution is to use the channel mixer two or three different times, in different layers, with masks to control whether each mix of RGB affects the highlights, shadows, or midtones. To create the masks, use Select>Color Range, Copy, then Paste in. Then you can run a gradient map on top of it all to enhance the tonal separation, and adjust the gradient map from 100% downward until it looks right. This sounds complicated but once you understand the principle it's not difficult. I've attached another version. This one looks good except for the reflection on the railing, which I think should be brighter. I'll try to send you the PSD file so you can see what I tried. I used the blue channel to put some texture into the door and the indoor shadow. Adjusting the RGB mix in different layers and, if necessary the opacity of the layers, gives you very precise control over the appearance of different parts of the image. This means that if, for instance, you don't like some aspect of the sample I've attached, it's easy to modify individual parts until you have exactly what you want.

Chris you are very generous. Your second b&w version says it all and is very convincing. The composition lines are emphasized and I can see better how they support the image. I received your file. I get the idea behind your "recipe", and I assure you that it sounds a lot less complicated than the manipulations I tried so far! BUT I should have mentioned that I won't be able to use PS for a few more days. I'm waiting for my personal copy of PS CS2 and should receive it this week. I'm stuck with PS Elements 4.0, which doesn't offer the channel mixer. I tried to emulate this using a Gradient map layer on top of a Levels layer, to be able to get to the individual channels, but it's not the same. I will play with this study a lot more and will post any significant result.

I can't thank you enough for the trouble and the inspiring advice.

Paul, you're welcome. I like how the latest version even gives us texture on the wall inside the stairs. I've become very interested in digital B&W and am trying to improve my repertoire of techniques. I still have a mixture of successes and failures. But I do think that majority of us have yet to fully exploit the potential of digital B&W. I recently read a book called _Mastering Digital Black and White Photography,_ by Michael Freeman. It was helpful, though it's mainly just a series of examples, without much theory tying it all together. What I learned from it is that previously I'd been used the channel mixer much too conservatively. For an orange filter effect, for instance, I might set it to 75/25/0. Now I might try 150/50/-50. This gives the image a wider range of tones and provides more control over how the image looks. Also, a technique that I discovered myself is to leave the image just a bit too bright and then run the gradient map on top of the channel mixer to increase local or micro contrast, and thus fine tone separation. I've found that many of our friends here at PN praise photos for "good tonality" when in fact the photos contain the potential for much, much more. Here is an example of what I mean by "more," though even this has room for improvement.

Chris, thanks for the link; yes, I marveled at the incredible texture of this pillar (looks almost in 3-D!) a few times last week and marked this picture of yours as a remarquable example of what b&w can really bring to an image. If I were to make a list of the 25 greatest photographs I have ever seen, maybe 20 of them would be b&w. I'm truly interested in b&w, by your work and by the book you suggest (I will get it ASAP). Meanwhile I'll get my hands dirty, shoot, and experiment with PS. Cheers!

Good eye. I like the color version best, though.