What makes for the best seperation lighting combo?

[beeman458]

As I put the studio lighting kit together, it dawned on me how little

discussion is posted about the very important but hidden, little

seperation light:) I'm curious what you folks have to say about what

makes for the best seperation lighting setup.

 

For a seperation light, I have either a Speedotron MW3R or MW3U on

it's own D402 power supply. The GN is 270 but Speedotron doesn't say

how they came up with this GN:) How thoughtful of them:) If need

be, the lighting controls I'll have available run the gamut from

simply the attached flash reflector with 4-way barndoors and diffuser

cloth hung over the barndoors to either stripboxes or softboxes with

grids, umbrellas, umbrella boxes or pretty much anything necessary to

soften and control the cast of the diffused light on the background.

 

If you would be so kind as to share your experience with seperation

lighting and what you think makes for the best, most versatile

seperation lighting setup.

 

Thanks in advance.

[jerry_hyman2]

Thomas, I have tried it a number of ways and my experience is that a straight reflector with barn doors doesn't ususally give me as tight of control as I want from the light, so I ususally use a snoot and sometimes even narrow that beam somewhat by using cinefoil (black aluminum foil). I am generally shooting portraits of one to three persons. I have also found that putting the light on a small stand and placing it slightly behind and to the right or left of the subject works best (10:00 position). I leave all the modeling lights off except the fill when placing the light so I can see the effect (if the key is on it overpowers the accent light and I can't see easily). When I use an accent light it is used to highlight the rim of the face, or the head and shoulders if I am using a dark background.

 

All that being said I plan to try a strip box with egg-crates in the future to see how much control I can get, and still get a soft diffuse quality when I want it. I have also purchased an old mole-richardson baby fresnel spotlight that I am converting to flash to use as an accent light, background projection, and key light.

[beeman458]

Jerry wrote<p>

 

<i>Thomas, I have tried it a number of ways and my experience is that a straight reflector with barn doors doesn't ususally give me as tight of control as I want from the light, so I ususally use a snoot and sometimes even narrow that beam somewhat by using cinefoil (black aluminum foil).</i><p>

 

Thanks for the snoot suggestion. I have in the kit already, a 5 1/4" snoot that fits the MW3 series flash but the reflectors are still silver'd as opposed to being matte black and are the snoot reflectors for the M11 series Brown Line and Black Line flash heads.<p>

 

Can I get away with the silver'd reflectors or will I need to spray paint one of the MW3 reflectors matte black? I'll have to get a roll of cinefoil as it's been mentioned many times on the forum here as a sort of necessary tool when one works with flashheads for light control.<p>

 

<i>I am generally shooting portraits of one to three persons. I have also found that putting the light on a small stand and placing it slightly behind and to the right or left of the subject works best (10:00 position). I leave all the modeling lights off except the fill when placing the light so I can see the effect (if the key is on it overpowers the accent light and I can't see easily). When I use an accent light it is used to highlight the rim of the face, or the head and shoulders if I am using a dark background.</i><p>

 

I have the small stand, made by Speedotron. Better then the Bogen/Manfrotto version, by far:) What I'm hopefully looking for in an answer is the art or act of shaping the light that's used as a seperation light.<p>

 

<i>All that being said I plan to try a strip box with egg-crates in the future to see how much control I can get, and still get a soft diffuse quality when I want it. I have also purchased an old mole-richardson baby fresnel spotlight that I am converting to flash to use as an accent light, background projection, and key light.</i><p>

 

I was going to go with Photoflex but have been put off by comments here as to the build quality of the Photoflex line. I've put into the shopping cart over at B&H, a couple of small Chimera, 9"x36" stripboxes, with forty degree grids and barndoors for rim and hair lights.<p>

 

<a href="http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=119027&is=REG">9"x36" Chimera Super Pro Plus Strip Softbox. </a><p>

 

<a href="http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=details_accessories&A=details&Q=&sku=124338&is=REG">Fabric grid for strip softbox, forty degrees. </a><p>

 

<a href="http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=details_accessories&A=details&Q=&sku=71236&is=REG">Long ways, barndoors, for strip softbox. </a><p>

 

If you could, would you be so kind as to share some more information/insight into the act or art of shaping the light used as a seperation light.<p>

 

Thanks for your answers.<p>

[jerry_hyman2]

Tom, I am a serious amateur and not a Pro, but I will try to answer your question as best I can. Hopefully someone like Ellis is monitoring the site (he is a working pro) and will give you some better answers.

 

In reference to "the art of using the accent light" I will use it generally in three situations. If I have a woman with her hair pulled back and I am shooting a 2/3rds view using short lighting I will most likely want to accent the far outline of her face (forehead, brow, cheek, chin). By putting a bright outline that is usually a stop or more brighter than the key I can really enhance the beauty of that curvature. Since I only want the light at that point I really have to control the spread and direction.

 

I like doing low key work and often I like to accent the legs or arms from the side and will employ one or two kickers to get that effect. It really adds a lot of dimension to the image. A person who is a "true artist" that really employs that a lot (I don't mind admitting that I try and copy him) is Oscar Lozoya. If you haven't seen any of his work or books (Amherst) it is a must if you are serious about light control on art portraiture.

 

And of course on the simple head and shoulders especially on a dark background I like to rim the shoulder area but only that area.

 

I don't think it matters that your reflectors are silver and I don't think you need to paint them black, the snoot should do well enough in restricting the light.

 

I think your choices on the chimera is a good one especially that you went for the PLUS version that has the recessed front and the front is diffuser is removeable.

 

I hope that I answered your questions but if not someone else may give it a try. Good luck!

[beeman458]

Jerry wrote<p>

 

<i>Tom, I am a serious amateur and not a Pro, but I will try to answer your question as best I can. Hopefully someone like Ellis is monitoring the site (he is a working pro) and will give you some better answers.</i><p>

 

All responses, good, bad or otherwise, are all appreciated. The more the merrier:)<p>

 

<i>In reference to "the art of using the accent light" I will use it generally in three situations.</i><p>

 

I might have confused you as to your following reply with the comments about the strip boxes by Chimera and rim/hair lighting. What I'm trying to get some insight to is the rear seperation light as opposed to accent lighting.<p>

 

<i>A person who is a "true artist" that really employs that a lot (I don't mind admitting that I try and copy him) is Oscar Lozoya. If you haven't seen any of his work or books (Amherst) it is a must if you are serious about light control on art portraiture.</i><p>

 

Thanks for the thoughtful suggestion in regard to Oscar Lozoya. I'll see about picking up a copy of one of his books. For me, first things first and that's getting this lighting set put together. Then when I'm ready to play, out come the books:)<p>

 

<i>I don't think it matters that your reflectors are silver and I don't think you need to paint them black, the snoot should do well enough in restricting the light.</i><p>

 

What made me ask is, Speedotron has a matte black reflector that's specifically blackened for the use of snoots.<p>

 

<a href="http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=NavBar&A=getItemDetail&Q=&sku=50423&is=REG&si=feat#goto_itemInfo">Speedotron blacken reflector </a><p>

 

<i>I think your choices on the chimera is a good one especially that you went for the PLUS version that has the recessed front and the front is diffuser is removeable.</i><p>

 

Thanks! I'm sure I'll enjoy the Chimera's from a quality of build point of view as well as the functionality of the design. I'm a sucker for quality of build:)<p>

 

<i>I hope that I answered your questions but if not someone else may give it a try.</i><p>

 

If you might be able to comment more about the art of shaping light that's used as a seperation light. If anybody would like to chime in with their two cents worth, that would be nice as I'm interested in learning more about this subject. I searched the web but to no avail and was hoping someone could give some insight to this most undiscussed of lighting issues:)<p>

 

Thanks for your response regarding rim and accent portrait lighting.<p>

[arturo_maceda]

I guess am working out the same issue. However, let me elaborate further so I make sure we are on the same lane.

Background lighting separation in low key style has an special function in the problem you propose and that is to provide an atmospheric effect to the portrait which emulates those dramatic scenarios found in many masterworks of realistic painters such as Van Dick and Rubens. The goal as I undestand it is to make the viewer feel that someone has painted the air around the subject and separated him/her from the rest of the world but at the same time leaving the world out there to remain comtemplative on him/her. To put this feeling in a portrait has become my obsession. Unfortunately, no lucky yet.

Nevertheless, I have experienced some progress and here are four recommendations that may help you.

1. Shoot with portrait focal length (80mm at least with 35mm SLR) and always use the smallest apertures. You may need to lower the flash output to the minimum.

2. Try to keep 1.5/2.5 f-stops difference between your background and your subject and narrow the snoot beam until the spot light become of slightly larger in size in respect to the subject head when looking thru the viewfinder.

3. Keep a goob separation between your background and your subject -3 to 4 mts separation worked for me-

4. Unless you have total control on the developing process, shoot bracket by 1/2 to 1 f-stop.

 

To be honest, I don't think this is going to help you. It sounds quite simple and technically poor because this is not a matter of lighting settings exclusively. When coming to portraits like those we are going after, having the adequate background, atrezzo and the outfit of the subject are as significant as the lighting setup. Take a look of the joyce tenneson photographer website and you'll see what I am talking about. That is high key mainly, but may give you an idea about the trick behind it.

[beeman458]

Thanks for the response and yes it'll give me some help.

 

I found that information on seperation lighting to be woefully lacking and any ideas, by everybody are greatly appreciated.

 

Thanks for adding to the information stream. I like the gobo idea to soften and add a painterly texture to the seperation lighting.