Canon EOS Rebel Body Questions for begginer

[justin_davis2]

I am a "mid range" begginer and would like to buy a new (new to me

that is) camera that isnt too expensive that will do a profesional

job for taking some nice scenery pictures / star trail pictures. The

problem is that I have no idea what I am doing and I see on ebay that

there are Canon EOS Rebel X's that are like $115 with some amenities

and then I see a different type of Canon EOS for like 400 or 300. So

my question is, what is the difference, and is there that big of a

difference to someone who is just getting into "proffesional"

photography and wants to hang a cool picture that he took himself

over his own fireplace? LOL, appreciate any help you experienced pro

Canon EOS users can give me! Thanks!!!

[phule]

Professionals know that the camera body is a box to which lenses are attached. Professionals know that the body doesn't take pictures, the photographer does.

 

Concentrate on buying better lenses. Worry about the body later.

[everitt]

Don't expect any camera to give you great results by themselves. What is

more important is how you perceive a scene to photograph and how you use

the equipment to achieve it (i.e a camera is a tool for you to use to express

your desired scene, not something that will create wonders out of nothing).

Anyways, if you want to do star trail pictures and other low-light photography

requiring long open shutter periods, I recommend that you buy an old manual,

mechanical SLR like a Pentax K-1000 etc. along with a cable release and a

tripod. Mechanical SLRs are much better suited for very long shutter speeds,

since they do not require batteries for keeping the shutter open like many

modern SLRs do. Plus, using a mechanical SLR is a great way to learn

photography, not relying on the camera to do everything for you IMO. I have,

for instance, gone backwards technology-wise, having started with a fully

automatic AF Nikon SLR (which is collecting dust right now!) and now using a

30 year-old Twin-Lens Reflex and a 30-year-old rangefinder. These old

beasts allow me more flexibility than my Nikon ever did. Anyways, I'll stop

ranting here, and I wish you the best of luck making your decision! Have fun

shooting!

[b.j._porter]

It sounds like you have no body at all at this point, is that correct?

 

With no body, you can't just throw away the body question - picking a "family" for your camera means you are choosing the mount/compatiblity for future lens purchases as well, so you can't run out and buy an old Pentax body and expect to use Canon L lenses directly.

 

Canon makes a number of SLR bodies for film and digital. Generally the more you're spending the more "features" you have, but this is not always the case. Some times you have more program modes, or better metering built in, higher shutter speeds. Differences also include contruction - i.e. the Digital Rebel has a plastic body, the 10D is metal and more rugged. 10D supports ISO 3200, longer bursts, etc. It's also about $500 more.

 

Try looking at B&H's site, and the Canon site, for info on the production models. B&H may provide less technical info and slick marketing, but you'll be able to get a feel at least from the prices so you can tell a $200 body from a $5,000 one. Don't get too excited by e-bay and pay more than B&H or Adorama list it new.

 

Finally, even though I am pretty much a beginner myself I do tend to agree with the statement that it is 1) The photographer 2) the lens then distant 3) the body. If you have the skill to take a decent picture in the first place, you can take just as nice or poor of a picture on an Elan IIe with decent glass as you can on a more expensive and newer body. The body just has to make sure it get's the settings right and the image recorded correctly.

[NK Guy]

Well, I wrote a beginner FAQ to address questions from folks in your position, if you're

interested.

<P>

<A HREF="http://photonotes.org/articles/beginner-faq/">http://photonotes.org/

articles/beginner-faq/</A>

[casey mcallister]

"that will do a profesional job"

 

What?

 

If it were that cheap and easy 'everybody' would be a 'professional'

 

$5,000 and 10,000 trial pix with some 'eyes'; 'brains' and 'study.'

 

...For starters to be 'pro'

 

...Then you can call yourself an ENTRY LEVEL!!!

 

Maybe I miss interpreted your question?

 

Star Trail? Your talking tele 'L' glass...about twenty times the price of your intended body...

 

This is a rather serious professional place, and your liable to get slammed for not doing your homework before asking a beginner question wherein you've not done your homework.

 

Astrophotography is not my thing. Quite frankly I do not get involved with anyting more than 200MM, because to get 'pro' results means another $5K for primes on top of the basic pro kit.

 

If you wanna do it right save up for a DSLR, and learn how to get KILLER prints that are ARCHIVAL grade on PAPER! That's your starting point!

[everitt]

William,

 

you don't need a tele to do star trail pics. You can use wide-angle, normal,

tele, whatever you want. You are confusing star trails in scenery (which is

what I do believe what he wants, IMHO) for astrophotography (i.e taking pics

of galaxies etc.).

 

"This is a rather serious professional place, and your liable to get slammed for

not doing your homework before asking a beginner question wherein you've

not done your homework. "

 

No, this is a place where anyone regardless of ability or experience who has

questions regarding Canon EOS equipment can post their questions. We

were all beginners once, remember that,

[ron c sunshine coast,qld,a]

I used to use entry level EOS camera alot(have a digi rebel now)they are my favorite cameras,they do pretty much anything you can possibly want!

<BR>If you really need high speed film wind and/or focus tracking you should consider the second model up the range (at least) but for allmost everything else the pro models just add conveniance features

[mike_sazhin]

The added benefits of a "Pro" labeled camera are: Faster AF, More metering modes, durability, and reliability. Certainly not features that a rebel would share. If you want a pro camera for $100 - $300, get a used Canon F-1 (cheap, durable, reliable "Pro") and you can learn a lot with that camera.

[jirka_vejrazka]

Please keep in mind that most of consumer level Canon cameras are not very suitable for very long exposure times, because they consume battery power for the time of exposure and some of there (i think that Elan 7 does this, but I'm not 100% sure - not shooting stars) limit BULB time to 10 minutes.

 

Others might give you better answer.

[scott_milso]

Canon Rebel G II - $139.00 from BH.

Add a 50mm 1.8 for $69.00 and your set for now.

The 50mm seems in short supply now so you may have to

search for it.

A nice zoom would be the 28-105 f/3.5-5.6

the "other" 28-105 f/4.0-5.6 is not as good.

Oh and get a cable release for like $15.00 and a tripod for time

exposures.

[scott_milso]

I meant to say f/3.5 - 4.5 for the 28-105

Avoid the cheaper one if you can, as a matter of fact If I couldn't

get the better zoom (if I was getting a zoom) I would just kit the kit

35-80mm with the rebel G II for about $200 from BH.

[phule]

<< Please keep in mind that most of consumer level Canon cameras are not very suitable for very long exposure times, because they consume battery power for the time of exposure and some of there (i think that Elan 7 does this, but I'm not 100% sure - not shooting stars) limit BULB time to 10 minutes. >>

 

There are two ways around this:

 

First: take the battery out. You do this in the following manner:

 

Step 1: set up your long exposure

 

Step 2: begin the long exposure on bulb mode (with remote release)

 

Step 3: put the lens cap on (or cover the lens)

 

Step 4: Take the battery out

 

Step 5: Uncover the lens

 

Step 6: expose for a couple of hours

 

Step 7: Cover the lens at the end of the exposure

 

Step 8: Put the battery back in and release the shutter.

 

I have not tested this option, but I have heard from other photographers that it can work.

 

Or, the second option:

Buy the external battery grip and use AA rechargable batteries.

[john_nastelin1]

FYI, the EOS 10s does not require battery power to hold the shutter open. See http://photonotes.org/reviews/eos-10s/ for a detailed review of this camera. I see it selling on ebay in the $200 range with a decent lens.

[jbq]

You'll find on eBay tons of cheap full-mechanical cameras that accept threaded cable releases and that will be perfect for star trails (assuming that you are serious about those). Heck, you'll find cheap medium-format TLRs for that kind of price, I go one for $55 that would be perfect for the job.

 

For the rest of the stuff, the camera doesn't do much for the image quality. It holds the lens and film parallel, and the little influence that a camera might have on image quality is the flash sync speed if you use daylight fill flash, and mirror lock-up if you're planning to do some short-to-medium tripod shots (in the 1/15s to 1/2s range). Other than that what matters most for the technical aspect are the lenses.

 

In reality, what matters most is you. If you're not a good photographer, you won't have good pictures, or at best you'll have a few by accident that you won't be able to reproduce.

[ribook]

With the right film, a good lens and adequate technique you can take pictures that you will be proud to hang in your home. You can do this with a rangefinder as well as an entry level SLR. You're looking at SLR's and you're looking at Canon. I have no doubt it is very possible to take "good pictures" with a Rebel, but I'd suggest you take a look at the Elan 7 as it offers you a bit more in the way of options, features, etc and it appears you are hoping to get into photography in a way that would render these options/features an advantage to you in the long run. If your budget won't allow you to purchase the Elan 7, then begin with a newer-model Rebel and learn how to use it. Either it will meet all of your needs, or at some point you'll identify shortcomings that are important to you and you can think about an upgrade that will address those specific shortcomings. If someone were to give you the gift of the most advanced SLR right now, it's likely you wouldn't be able to take advantage of most of its features and thus could not appreciate them. A good reason to start somewher nearer the beginning.

[peter_phan]

Justin, I have the Rebel X. It was my first Canon EOS camera many years ago. Great little camera. I still have it to this day, even though I graduated up to an Elan IIe, and now a 10D. The Rebel X is a basic SLR camera with all the core features to do great photography: aperture priority, shutter priority, manual exposure, matrix metering, partial metering, plus a bunch of PIC (fully automatic) modes that I never touched. I learned photography on this camera. And it follows the philosophy that the photographer makes the picture, not the camera. I would not call it a "mid range" camera. It's more like a bare bones autofocus camera. It has no pop-up flash, no custom functions, no E-TTL compatibility, and it's all plastic. But I can still stick it on a $5000 Canon Image Stabilizer supertelephoto lens and have everything work perfectly. And I've kicked and dropped it all over the place, but it still works as good as the day I bought it.

<p>

For a starter "mid-range" camera, I would highly recommend getting an Elan II or IIe (the "e" model has Canon's Eye Control Focus system). It is great full-featured camera. <a href="http://www.keh.com/shop/product.cfm?bid=CE&cid=02&sid=newused&crid=7286935">www.KEH.com</a> has several used Elan II/IIe's for $200 or less. Here's <a href="http://www.keh.com/shop/SHOWPRODUCT.CFM?CRID=7286935&SKID=CE0299900851404&SID=newused&BID=CE&CID=02&SOID=N&curpic=0&dpsp=0">one</a>. Much for full-featured than the Rebel, better construction, great control layout, extremely good low-light autofocus (thanks to its on-camera near-infrared autofocus assist beam).

<p>

For a full chronology of all Canon models, you might want to check here: http://www.eos-magazine.com/System_EOSmodels.html

[awindsor]

For star trails you do not need an particular lens length but I would recommend

buying a cheap manual body. For star trails you can have hour long exposures. This

means you will need a tripod. You can buy reasonable tripods cheaply (vibration in

not a problem in really long exposures). I would suggest a metal one with leg braces.

It should be heavy.

 

Once you have a cheap manual, a lens, and a tripod buy lots of film and try it out. I

recommend learning to shoot scenery using slide film since it is less forgiving and

you can see the image that the camera captured and not the one that the processor

was able to extract. I use a spirit level to level the horizon. Unless you are shooting

B&W I don't think you need a filter to begin with though a polarizer can add a bit of

bang to images.

 

It is true we were all beginners once but I was never a begginer.

[everitt]

"It is true we were all beginners once but I was never a begginer."

 

LOL!!

[byron_w]

In regards to long exposures:

 

The cheaper bodies use the battery to hold the shutter open. If you remove the battery with the shutter open, or the battery runs down, then the shutter closes.

 

Just so you know.