Tmax 3200 for indoor concert?

[etakelly]

Hi,

 

This seemed like the most suitable forum for this question. Apologies

if i'm a little off the mark.

 

I'm shooting an indoor gig for some friends of mine. Its their first

gig and I asked could I shoot some shots for the experience and

enjoyment. I'll be using an eos 30 with a 50mm 1.8/28mm 2.8 and an

old chinon manual focus with a 135mm/2.8 (THAT should be fun!).

Lighting on the night should be fairly consistent, "normal" small

club stage lighting.

 

I've read and really enjoyed Steve Mirarchi's comments in the

learning section and have looked through the other threads etc

regarding concert photography. There is no real pressure on me to

produce rolls and rolls of pristine shots (my friends would be happy

with some half decent shots of the night, fingers crossed!) so it

will be a perfect learning opportunity. I'll be able to get real

close to the stage also, and am negotiating the use of fill in flash.

 

I'm kinda decided on NHG-II for colour shots, using the fast 50mm.

But I've a few questions about b+w. Steve discouraged using tmax3200

and advised t400cn pushed instead. My local lab don't have a clue,

unfortunately. Is the 3200 that bad? If i use 3200, can I adjust the

iso rating down on my camera if required? Anyone had similar

experiences/dilemmas like these? Any general advice, outside of

Steve's excellent section, keeping in mind i'll be able to get closer

than he was really talking about in the article?

Thanks in advance everyone,

Edwin.

[sm. alec]

I'm partial to Ilford's 3200 as I get better tonality (keep in mind I'm also dev. and printing it as well), but keep in mind that neither are a "true" 3200 ISO. For the Ilford, I rate it at 1600 to get enough exposure in the shadows, others go down to 1200. With a 2.8, you should be in good shape. Sounds like a lot of fun, please post some results.

[scott_eaton]

If your lab has no clue about how to push C-41 film, then how do you expect them to process the very fickle (if not impossible to process commercially) conventional B/W 3200 speed film?

[gareth_harper]

I use Delta 3200 in very low light situations. The T-max3200 should be just as good though I haven't used it.

 

What I have found with the Delta film is that it gives it's best results with the recommended developer DD-X. I also found the Ilford development times well out (as have most others here).

It's definately a good idea to process this film yourself. If you must use a lab make sure they are confidently familar with these films and will be using the recommended developer with them. I'd also strongly recommend bracketing the exposures until you are also confident at using it. I've used Delta 3200 @ 3200 and 6400, it should also give good (better) results at 800 or 1600. T-max 400 gives great results at 800 but that's as far as I've pushed it.

[bernhard]

You can get 1600 from Fuji Superia/Press 1600 dev'd/Printed in a consumer minilab, but for anything above that you need a pro lab. I would probably use NPZ pushed 2 stops or Superia/Press 1600 pushed 1 stop. Shooting a B&W 3200 ISO film (TMZ or Delta 3200) and sending it to some place for developing and printing is a sure recipe for disaster. If you don't develop yourself or know a real good dedicated B&W lab, stick to the films above and hand them to a pro lab.

 

Pushing TCN 3 stops to 3200 will yield pretty poor negs with increased grain and poor shadow detail. Not pretty.

[__jon__]

Edwin,

 

Here are some shots I did recently in a nightclub.

 

 

<a href="http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=007DHK">Delta 3200</a>

[roger krueger]

If your lab doesn't have a clue and you can't develop yourself you're really out of luck on

high speed B&W. I'll agree with other posts that sending TMZ or Delta 3200 through most

commercial labs is inviting disaster. The only lab I had any luck with was

<a href=http://www.photofactory.com>Photo Factory</a> who is local to me, but does

do mail order. They use X-TOL, which is excellent with these films. But they are expensive

enough it was well worth it for me to learn to develop my own. Also, the D-76 most B&W

labs use is not great with TMZ and really ugly with Delta 3200.

[bernhard]

I used to live in San diego and I used Photofactory. They deliver very good results, but for less money I can develop myself with more control. I would hand them any B&W film any time and upon request they also use other developers. But unfortunatley not everyone has such a great lab nearby.

 

So I wholeheartedly agree with you.

 

Say hello to San Diego and the beaches for me, at times like these when we emerge from German winter (grey skies, sleet, rain, little snow but still cold) I really miss San Diego.

[etakelly]

Cheers guys, thanks for the responses.

 

Seems I've become a little too dependent on chromogenic b+w and one hour labs!! I've yet to venture into dev/printing: I intend to, but no time at the moment. I have, however, become acutely aware of the importance of a finding a good lab. So, with that in mind, and taking into consideration the films recommended above, does anyone know of a competent lab that I could mail filom to in the UK? I'm in college in Carmarthen, South Wales, but don't know of any decent labs close by...Jessops everywhere!! I'd really appreciate your help on this one. Or could some one direct me to a more suitable forum. I've looked through the recommendations, but was a bit daunted to be honest and couldn't really find something suitable. I've relied on any lab at all in the past and am tired of scratched negs, bad prints, lousy enlargments.

 

Cheers again.

 

Lovely shots Jon, by the way!

 

Edwin

[nicholas_bellamy]

http://www.peak-imaging.com in Sheffield get all my standard B+W and c41

stuff. I'm no expert on print quality by a long way... but IMO they are superb.

7.5" x 5" costs 11.95 std or 15 for pro service. Add £1 for a push. You'll get a

10% discount for 5 (I think) or more films.

 

Alternatively, if you use Ilford films (I am not sure how they get on with non-

Ilford stuff), you could try Ilford mail order processing in Crewe, don't have the

address to hand but prepaid Ilford mailers can be brought from 7dayshop for

peanuts (about 4 quid a go for 6x4). Dunno what their quality is like though

as I have only just sent them my first order.

 

I used to use a Kodak approved lab but I was recommended to Peak by the

pro who shot our wedding after I discovered the joys of arguing on the internet

with people about can you / can't you push process C41. The prints I got back

were IMO superb and as a result I now use Peak for everything.

[etakelly]

Cheers Nicholas, just what I was looking for!!

[EricM]

"...I discovered the joys of arguing on the internet with people about can you / can't you push process C41."

 

:-)

[nicholas_bellamy]

Just as a quick update, I posted Peak Imaging a roll of 36exp NPH on Monday

this week and my wife has just phoned me to tell me that they have arrived (i.e

Friday morning).

 

Bearing in mind I paid by cheque which of course takes 4 days to clear etc.,

that is IMO top service.

[gareth_harper]

Edwin, if you intend to print in the darkroom do make sure that all that those minilab processed negs are scratch free. Most minilabs and budget services scratch em to death. If you get anything other than a very light scratch there is nothing at all you can do in the darkroom to fix it. Even the pro labs often leave light scratches on the film, though nothing like the deep gouges I've had from the minilabs.

XP2 prints very nicely by the way.

[nicholas_bellamy]

Further to my previous posts, I received the black and white prints back from

Ilford on saturday (sent away on Monday). Not bad turnaround time but I

won't be using them again. I'm not going into to much detail at the moment as

I have'nt given Ilford a chance to respond, but needless to say in future I will

prefer to pay the extra which peak imaging charge for the improved quality

which you receive.

[etakelly]

Nicholas,

 

Thats a shame. I've a prepaid mailer ordered and I will probably use it as I have it, but not for this event if they are not relaible. Be sure to let us know what the problems were and ilford's response when you get the chance...should be interesting.

 

Edwin

[pete_doherty]

Hi Edwin,

 

I shoot a few concerts now and then, and through trying quite a

few film types have settled on Fuji Superia 800 colour neg film for

shooting indoors.

At 2.8 with 'average' concert lighting you'd probably get away with

1/60 to 1/125 (ie no incredibly bright spots - mainly the warm

coloured lighting..)

I've found the film to be excellent, very fine grain and great colour.

The great thing is it's available at most high street stores.

 

As for development I've found Boots the chemist (yes beleive it or not!) to have a high

standard of quality control, and they'll put the film on disc for

a couple of pounds.

 

See enclosed link for an example of a recent shot.

 

I used to shoot T-max 400 pushed to 800 which is another good

option (as a previous post mentioned), it too retains fine grain and

has good detail in shadows.

 

One thing about the Superia 800, it doesn't like under exposure,

and grain becomes very pronounced if under-exposed, err on over

exposure which it doesn't mind.

 

Pete

 

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