boris_chan1 Posted March 5, 2004 Share Posted March 5, 2004 Marc, what exactly is this "gang mentality" that you find so disturbing? The only "gang" that I see here is the "Marc Williams Appreciation Crew" - ninety per cent plus of the people who post here love your work and treat you with enormous respect. Your reaction to a few strange people on this forum seems utterly bizarre and, contrary to what you assert, utterly Shakesperian in character. Most people here seem to love you, so why are you flouncing off? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skip_williams Posted March 5, 2004 Share Posted March 5, 2004 This place, once a nice friendly forum, has started to look more and more like the ultra-clubby and wacky LUG. When I start behaviors like attacks on good photographer (like Marc), arguments on pointless political topics, attacks on people who aren't eveh here, perceived wwnership of this club and it's "rules" by participants, and general a**hole-ish behavior ---- it's also time to go. This forum has very, very knowlegable and helpful people, but it has begun to disintegrate into a group of crotchety, grumpy, clubby old men; seemingly with nothing better to do than complain and attack. Isn't it amazing how many of the Leica forums tend to get like this? I've seen it several times and it's a bit disturbing. At least it's easy to ignore this forum for a while, which I now plan to do. The noise-to-signal ration has grown way, way too high for me. Skip Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan_brown4 Posted March 5, 2004 Share Posted March 5, 2004 Now there you go again... Another disigenuous good bye. Marc, I've enjoyed you 'content' and I like you as an individual, and, I 'd rather you stay. But if you're leaving, then leave. Why post a dramatic message, and then hang around, and reply, after you've stated your retreat? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doug_schuette Posted March 5, 2004 Share Posted March 5, 2004 Just as I am about to say "hello" so many are leaving, good photographers I have learned much from. My grandfather shot with Leicas, and I spent countless hours at his house viewing his slides. He left several thousand slides, many of the Southwest he loved to visit. I am seriously working on purchasing my own Leica, in part so that I can post on this forum-this forum where I have not only learned much but also have been inspired much. As a part-time professional skydive photographer, I jump with many people I would have little or nothing to do with away from the dropzone. We mostly enjoy each other's company, however, when united by our love of playing in the sky. I have seen that love, of photography and Leicas, on this forum. Stick around! We newbies need your experience and input. Thanks for what I learned already from you, Blue Skies! Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lee_shively Posted March 5, 2004 Share Posted March 5, 2004 Okay, somebody out there who has kept up with this please bring me up do date on what's been happening. I realize there was a lot of people fed up with Jay's attitude (me, too) and I wasn't really surprised to see him given the boot. I also caught the moderator's reigning in of the personal attacks, etc. (I don't have a problem with that.) But I don't have as much time to spend online as I used to and I missed what brought on the exodus. I feel like I've been watching a mini-series and missed a couple of episodes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terry_rory Posted March 5, 2004 Share Posted March 5, 2004 Ta-ta from this here Brit And may you make the best of it Wherever it is that you end up That doesnt tell you to shut up, And be a good boy and buy the party line, Somewhere nice and fair and fine. In Leica user forum heaven (Or with Harvey P in sunny Devon.) Too many heads above the wall, Are being shot for nought at all. A lot of fear is forcing in, The Leica forum's Silent Spring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beau 1664876222 Posted March 5, 2004 Share Posted March 5, 2004 I'm baffled by much of what is written above. I'm not totally clear on everything that's transpired, who insulted whom and how, where exactly the "defectors" are going, etc. Marc's post is very odd, at first I wasn't sure whether he was telling us he was leaving or telling someone else they ought to leave. I can see why it's happening, though. Marc, like a number of people here, has put in the effort to earn a certain amount of goodwill and respect in life, and in the "real world" a person like him is surrounded by people who work hard to nurture the relationship. The bitter, sociopathic losers never pop up in real life -- they're spending 20 hours a day on the Internet!!! After many years of seeing one's efforts to be good, caring, supportive, successful pay off in kind, the Internet can be a real reality-check: there really are some messed-up people out there. After awhile, someone like Marc says, "I like my real life better." Anyway, I'm not going to boycott this forum, but it's important for all of us to keep it in perspective, focus on what's good about it, and try to be constructive with every post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roger_michel Posted March 5, 2004 Share Posted March 5, 2004 marc -- sorry to see you go. i really enjoyed meeting you in nyc for dinner. thanks again for helping me to get started with PS (i guess i should thank you!!! (<;) will miss your posts. as for the general angst, while marc was a great guy, the forum has had lots of great people come and go over the years. you will come to like the new faces as much as you did the old. i remember when marc was a new guy!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
octavio bustard Posted March 5, 2004 Share Posted March 5, 2004 Personally, I find Marc's reaction to my post VERY ODD. I've been on this forum longer than him but have NEVER, to my knowledge, made any comments about him or his work that could possibly be construed as offensive, impolite or dismissive. The only two people I have ever taken issue with are 1) James Kennedy (he of the recent rascist comments which apparently started this whole brohaha), who introduced himself to me by critiqing some of my photos with the insightful comment that they were "worthless sh*t" (and whom I then responded to in a very civilized manner at which point a friendship developed, and 2) Preston Merchant, who apparently is a psychopath who took a perverse delight in stalking my W/NW threads. I challenge anyone else here to point to any evidence of vindictiveness, impoliteness, rudeness, high-mindedness, dismissiveness or any other trolling behavior I've exhibited since I've entered this forum 3 years ago. Show me. That includes you too Marc. What is your specific problem with my remarks? Instead of attacking me personally as you did, might you have stopped to think that the diatribe you so tastelessly directed at me might be a manifestation of the very impoliteness you attribute to others (e.g. me)? Or is it that I might disagree with you? Or simply not heap you with constant praise as many of the syncophants on this board apparently do? Tell me please. From the posts of yours I've read over the years, you seem like a reasonable person and a competent wedding photographer. Bravo to you. However, your meltdown to open this thread seems just plain WEIRD. Bad day perhaps? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
victor_cruz1 Posted March 5, 2004 Share Posted March 5, 2004 In all fairness to Tim, I don't see anything wrong with what he said in his posting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricM Posted March 5, 2004 Share Posted March 5, 2004 Tim, I remember both of these posts you mention. The �worthless sh*t� comment was the first time my attention was drawn to you. I find you correct here, you have never been rude, sarcastic, or lacking in respect since I�ve been paying attention. I�m not sure how Marc inferred your comments as derogatory or insulting, but you�re both valuable contributors here, and hope that after Marc decides to stay, you two will get along! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karl_knize Posted March 5, 2004 Share Posted March 5, 2004 Marc, You're a talented art director / photographer / gearhead, and extremely generous in sharing your knowledge and purchases with others on the LF. You will be missed. "Great! Thanks! Goodbye!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
douglas k. Posted March 5, 2004 Share Posted March 5, 2004 What is it with these long goodbyes? I've broken up with women in fewer words. Some of you take this waaay too seriously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notraces Posted March 5, 2004 Share Posted March 5, 2004 Let's get on with it... Enough of the drama -- can't we all just get along??? Seriously -- I'd really like to get back to seeing great images -- the critiques -- and friendly advice.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerry_pfile Posted March 6, 2004 Share Posted March 6, 2004 Marc is one of the few people I've met who is exactly the same in person as what you "see" on the net. I'll not engage in extolling all his virtues and contributions here. To anyone who has read and taken the time to absorb his postings and images, it would be needless duplication. Best (especially to you Marc), Jerry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bart feliciano Posted March 6, 2004 Share Posted March 6, 2004 Arg, It's hard to learn when generous people leave... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david k. Posted March 6, 2004 Share Posted March 6, 2004 Marc, very sorry to see you moving on. I found your great in depth knowledge of photography and the business of photography, very informative. Your inputs were always well thought out and well presented, you have been the "model" Leica Forum Hero. Good luck in your ongoing photographic business, I trust you will always have the enthusiasm you have demonstrated here over the years. Regards David K. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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