michael_kennedy1 Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 My son has made me an offer I can't refuse. If I do the conversion (mostly retired), he will set me up with a Mac system dedicated to converting our libraries of 35mm slides and negatives into digital archives. Within reason, money is not really an issue. Our goal is quality of the results and time for the conversion (ease of use). My questions: How do I pick the best equipment for this process and what is the best way to come up the learning curve on the process? I apologize for not doing an extensive search, but I just found this forum and realistically don't yet have the knowledge for an intelligent search. I am hoping that there is someone who has setup an excellent mac system that can short circuit my learning process. Thanks,Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris1664876655 Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 Mike, do you already have the computer and are looking for scanner help or do you need a computer too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_kennedy1 Posted December 23, 2003 Author Share Posted December 23, 2003 Chris, No, we have not bought the computer yet. My thought is that we will decide on all the s/w and H/W needed and then go buy it all. My son is very computer literate and has a feel for the computer equipment. It's the peripheral stuff (scanners, capture h/w, etc) that is the main concern, but will take suggestions on all. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark houtzager Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 What archival quality are you looking for? Is a photo quality 8x10 print good enough or would you want to have the possibility to do larger jobs on the same equipment? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
testingname Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 How much do you expect to spend, roughly? $4000? That's a ballpark figure. Then how much time will you spend on the project x dollar (yen, mark, peso etc.) per hour (your time is worth something) = the other half of the total cost. So let's say, again, very ballpark, your time comes to another $4000. And the time space is critical too, you say... $8000 can buy a whole lot of professional scanning, and it's much faster too. But then you don't end up with a nice Mac at the end ;-) Pros and cons to this :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
majid Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 First of all, don't underestimate how labor-intensive scanning is. When operating at peak efficiency, it takes me about two hours to scan a 36-exposure roll on my Nikon Coolscan IV ED. Get a light table and loupe, and perform triage on which slides to scan. <p> If you have mostly slides, you may want to pay extra for a model with a batch scanner attachment such as the Nikon Coolscan 5000 ED. You can expect to pay dearly for the privilege - the Nikon 5000 costs $600 more than the Nikon V, and the batch attachment itself costs about $300. <p> I would get a Nikon scanner. They have high-quality electronics that have low levels of electronic noise and yield better shadow detail. The new models are not yet available in the US but you can order gray-market versions from reputable companies like Delta International (I ordered my IV ED from them, the first one was a dud, they replaced it quickly, no questions asked). <p> Get a copy of <a href="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0891348417">this book</a> first to understand the issues and how to get the best out of your scanner. Many people recommend using <a href="http://www.silverfast.com/show/silverfast/en.html">SilverFast Ai</a> instead of the manufacturer-supplied software for better productivity. You will also need a monitor calibration device like the MonacoOPTIX XR or the Colorvision Spyder, otherwise any color corrections you make (necessary to cope with faded color slides or negatives) will be inaccurate.<p> <p> Digital ICE (infrared dust detection and removal) can be a godsend, but it doesn't work with black and white or Kodachrome. Make sure you have it disabled for the latter, otherwise your scan quality will be silently compromised. <p> Don't forget to backup your images religiously as you scan them. You should also inventorize them in a catalog database program like Canto Cumulus or Extensis Portfolio. Making these workflow decisions up-front will save you a lot of wasted time down the road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ellis_vener_photography Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 computer: Either one of the new eMac or iMac machines. max out the RAM Add a 200 to 250Gb external firewire hard drive. scanners: there are several very good to high quality 4000ppi 35mm film scanners on the market today for around $1000.00 or less. If you need a medium & large format film scanner, you could do worsethan with an Epson 3200. This scanner will also let you scan prints. Software; Adobe Photoshop Elements 2.0 and one ofthe cdatabase software packages mentioned above. Education; take a week long introductory Photoshop workshop at the Santa Fe Photoworkshops ( www.santafeworkshops.com ) or atthe MAine Photo workshops in Rockport, Maine. As the saying goes: "plan the work and work the plan." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
william_chiu2 Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 Try and wait until January 6th, that is the day Steve Jobs gives the keynote address to the annual MacWorld San Francisco expo. It's been the primary platform at which Jobs has announced major products, hardware and software, pro and consumer level. I know I am. If you have a flexible budget and can get G5-based machines, I would go that route. In fact, that is what I intend to do January 7th. Having used Windows for the last few years and some Mac, I am gravitating back to the clean, no-nonsense interface of the Macintosh OS and the general uniformity in computing experience that the platform gives you. Starting from scratch, you will need a computer, monitor, printer, software and scanner but if your son will provide that, then go with the following: Power Mac G5 2.0GHz Dual Processor (or faster if/when they are announced), 2.5GB RAM (tests show this to be the point of diminishing returns for file sizes in the 110MB range with layers/filters), 2 160GB internal hard drives, one external firewire 800 250GB hard drive as file backup, the 23" Cinema display (or its replacement, or a Sony Artisan CRT monitor. I find LCDs to be easier to use/read for the palettes and tools while the CRTs have better shadow detail at the expense of glare from uncontrolled room lighting), Adobe Creative Suite Standard edition with Photoshop, Illustrator, CS versions...unless you will publish to the web then get the Premium edition which has GoLive and Acrobat...InDesign is in one or both as well. Since you are mostly retired, this may be better than having nothing to do while a lab spends your $2000-8000. That's what retirement is for, no, to have fun, be creative and make with your life that which you have been unable to do all these years? Also, three books: Bruce Fraser et al.'s Real World Photoshop, Scotty Kelby's Photoshop for Digital Photographers, and Martin Evening's book for digital photographers. And try to understand color management pronto as it is the thing that drives people new to their wonderful digital darkroom batty soonest, fastests, most. If you can get to an Apple store, chances are you can talk to some guru or make an appointment to talk to one. Good luck. Oh, I'd recommend the Minolta Multi Scan Pro scanner; it's fast, very good, and has sturdy carriers that let you scan a multitude of things beyond 35mm (say, XPAN panorama, 6x9 etc.). This system puts you in the high side of 4 digits but since your son is willing... Regards, ~William Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerry_freeman1 Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 If you are looking for new, an iMac 17" or 20" SuperDrive with 1G max RAM, Minolta Dimage 5400 scanner, Vuescan scanning software, and Photoshop Elements will economically satisfy all of your requirements The monitor quality of the eMac is unsatisfactory for photographic use and the G5 is far more computer than you need. A used late model PowerMac G4 tower and 17' LCD would fit as well. I do it all on a laptop, another consideration. I expect no significant hardware announcements at MWSF...jf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_macman Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 >>>>> How do I pick the best equipment for this process Ask precisely here. >>>>> and what is the best way to come up the learning curve on the process? The whole fun of using MacOS X will grip you and take you along the learning curve, don't worry :-) I sold Macs who 70-yr old ppl who ended up changing hard drives by themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_macman Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 However, take a look at the Switch section from apple.com. It's a great Mac primer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_kennedy1 Posted December 24, 2003 Author Share Posted December 24, 2003 WOW! you guys are responsive. My plan was to find and register for a bunch of forums. By chance, this forum was my first and probably the only one I need. You gave me everything I need to get started: books to read, hardware recommendations, and time expectations. Next Monday (can't play golf on Monday), I will go to Dallas to find recommended books, visit an Apple dealer, and to some dealer that will have the scanners y'all mentioned to get a feel for the hardware. Prior to that, I will review the Apple site and read up on the scanners. After this first round of research, I'll be back with a strawman system and plan for your review. Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays to all, Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom_burke3 Posted December 24, 2003 Share Posted December 24, 2003 This is a bit late perhaps, but I would say - don't underestimate the difficulty of getting good scans from amateur equipment scanners. I would suggest that you should investigate the possibility of getting the negatives or slides professionally scanned. There's still a job of work to do after that, moving the scans onto a hard disk and cataloguing them, so you won't be left with nothing to do! With the volume of scans you're talking about, don't rely on supplied mac tools such as iPhoto - I would think that you'd do better with something like Extensis Portfolio. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beepy Posted December 24, 2003 Share Posted December 24, 2003 The key words here to me are "digital archives". I think in the end it is not the process to generate the images but how you preserve the digital output. <p> <a href="http://www.wilhelm-research.com/pdf/ Family_Tree_MagazineSept_03.pdf"> Read this article </a> - for a sidebar that will help consider the issues of long term digital storage. <p> 35 mm slides and negs you have are probably more dynamic range than digital cam, and capable of 10 - 16 megapixels of output. Think 70+MB uncompressed 16 bit TIFF images? I didn't see - how many slides are you talking about? <p> Anyway - long term archival storage of digital images is an interesting puzzle. Short term reliable storage is a problem - think RAID or disk mirrors. Secondary back-up. <p> I work on designing reliable storage systems in real life - I find the durability issues in storage interesting. A 91 year old aunt died recently. My cousin brought down some family pictures - and there was my mom and aunt when kids in a family portrait in a beautiful black and white print - exquisite. 80 year old print. As someone who has worked on computers I can't even imagine you would be able to read any media you wrote to 80 years from now - never mind 30 years from now - even if the media actually remained intact. I would be worried about getting, say, a DVD-R reader say. <p> Don't discard the slides after scanning. Consider archival storage of the slides also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beepy Posted December 24, 2003 Share Posted December 24, 2003 <a href="http://www.digitalpreservation.gov/repor/ NSF_LC_Final_Report.pdf"> Another report </a> from our friends at the Library of Congress. I know this is going a bit far from "Mac recommendations" - but it was the task you described that intrigued me, not the tools. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_kennedy1 Posted January 1, 2004 Author Share Posted January 1, 2004 Based on your responses, some google research on your recommendations, more reading on this forum, and a visit to an Apple dealer. Here are my tentative decisions and current thinking. I would appreciate any comments or redirection. Computer: i-mac, 1 gig RAM, 20" Monitor, 2-160G internal storage, 250G external HD, DVD burner. Rationale for i-mac over G5 is primarily space to fit where I want to set it all up. Scanner: One of Nikon Coolscan 4000ED (and batch feeder)(~$1700 - OUCH), Minolta scan 5400 (~800-900), or Minolta Dimage Scan Dual III ($400). I am planning on visiting several Dallas are Photo stores tomorrow hopefully to see and play with them. Speed of scanning is very important - any big differences between these? At this point, I doubt whether I will be doing prints larger than 8X10 but who knows. My plan is to get the basics and then start playing with it all before deciding on different software or more accessories. Flaws in my thinking or new suggestions? Thanks, Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelly_flanigan1 Posted January 1, 2004 Share Posted January 1, 2004 Slight OT; If you digital,Regular prints or negatives/images survive the ages; will they people in them be known? Here in my family we have a 100 + year old photo album; in which shome of the images are poor; and others are perfect. Some must have been well washed; and free of any fixer staining. <BR><BR>Thus in the century old images; only sometimes only a few of the people are known; and alot are unknown. I wished we had asked my grandmother decades ago who all these people were. Having a typed printout with the occasion; location; rough date; and peoples names would have been cool; plus a digital form also. Today some of this can also be included in Metadata; included with each image.<BR><BR> In a saved CD or DVD; it would be nice to include a smaller version of each image; and an overview of the CD/DVD's contents. In the old days; many folks placed old photos in albums; and marked the backs with info; or next to the photos. Ancient albums sometimes fall apart; and this info gets jumbled.<BR><BR>While ones elders are still alive; one should try to have them help you identify who is who on old photos. Once they pass away; the identity of people in old stacks of images gets to be almost impossible. You should let them have fun while helping with marking the old albums. Here we used postit notes; and placed question marks where there is some questions still at had. Many times ones elders can remember alot more; by letting them review the old albums days or weeks later. We did this and helped identify alot more people and places on the second go around.<BR><BR>Here are my great aunts in Norway; from a print in the 1920's. <IMG SRC=http://www.ezshots.com/members/tripods/images/tripods-266.jpg> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelly_flanigan1 Posted January 1, 2004 Share Posted January 1, 2004 If your digital Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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