john_collier2 Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 My favorite SLR of all time? The SL2MOT. All the nice features of the SL2 and a ground glass focusing screen. Though there are some complaints that 1/2000 is problematic on the SL2s. Second would be the F3. I am surprised that Jay has worn out a couple of them as I have seen pro's F3s with the finish completely rubbed off and still going strong. It was Nikons first AE pro shutter and they overbuilt it. I really liked mine. Yes Doug you can use non-AI lenses on the F2AS (and on the F3 and F4, dunno about the F5); stop down metering only of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mskovacs Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 Douglas the DP-12 prism that makes an F2 the F2AS is AI coupled. You can also buy the DP-3 which is a non-AI version of the same thing giving you what's known as an F2SB. Stay away from the DP-2...I think it also uses LEDs but is a CdS meter not silicon blue like the DP-3/12. Sometimes you can get the DP-3 at a significant discount because its non-AI but there were many less made since it was only made for a year or two at most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williamw Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 Why ? If I'm correct you already have a Canon 10D and some Leica M6 with a few lenses for both. I have more or less the same combination except mine is a D60. I find it to be more than enough. I have 2 lenses for each setup which I find relatively adequate. Spend the money on getting some prints or get yourself a good printer. Or maybe save up for some nice travel or something of that kind. Or why not some great books? Another camera will not give that much in the end as you already have the tools to take pictures, film & digital.Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john_boyle3 Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 I was in your situation earlier this year and bought a Leicaflex SL on eBay. Mine was in excellent condition with the earlier 50mm Summicron and a mint 135mm Elmarit. I would concur with Doug Herr that it's a fine camera and is very solid. In my case I could also use my 65mm and 280mm Visoflex lenses as well as the Bellows II. You should be able to find a good number of R lenses to go with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patricks Posted October 28, 2003 Author Share Posted October 28, 2003 Interestingly enough, no one is promoting a Lecia R4/5/6/7... (then again, I wouldn't spend the money for a film based system). Perhaps a 'simple' EOS 3 or 7 is the answer, especially given that I'm adding some nice EF glass. Frank, yes, I'm debating the MF route as well... It is wonderful to be an aspiring gear head and be in such good company! :-) Keep the suggestions coming - there is no such thing as too much camera info! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
douglas k. Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 Jay wrote: "And as good as Doug is, I don't hear his name uttered in the same breath with Len Rue, Art Wolfe, Frans Lanting, John Shaw, Heather Angel or a long list of others who achieved great fame as nature photographers using Nikon and occasionally Canon equipment. So take their word, not mine."<p> By that logic we'll have to give Doug Herr's opinions more credence than yours, Jay...After all, Doug has at least demonstrated an ability to make pro-caliber nature photos, while we have no evidence that you even make pictures. That seems a strange argument, coming from you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awahlster Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 Caon T90 Manual focus as well as Manual exposure control should you desire it as well as one of the most advanced metering systems ever put in a manual focus camera For great lenses 24mm f2.0 nFD 35mm f2.0 nFD 50mm f1.8 thru 50mm f1.2L ALL GREAT 50's portarit 85mm f1.8 nFd if on a budget if not then the 85mm f1.2L which is fantastic for a zoom the 80-200mm f4.0L at around $450.00 is very very hard to beat. 14 Canon FD bodies and over 45 lenses and counting. OH and the best part is that with an adapter B they will fit on your scew mount leicas and then ad a M adapter and a Canon FD lens can be used on your M with zone focus (not a problem with the wides) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doug herr Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 <I>no one is promoting a Lecia R4/5/6/7 </I><P> R4, 5 and 7 aren't manual, R6.x isn't 'old style' IMHO. I used R4s and R4sP bodies for several years and while they were reliable (my experience) they don't have the Leica 'feel'. Frank, Jay breaks Rolexes too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevin m. Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 Since it seems you don't necessarilly want a true "manual" camera, I'll be weird and recommend the Nikon F4. I used one for a weekend expecting the worst, but came away pleasantly surprised. They're going for a song nowadays and they're a damned nice camera. Nicely sealed against dirt, interchangeable finders, etc. The autofocus is a bit slow, but they take all the old manual focus Nikon lenses, too. Plus it has nice big dials and knobs to set functions. It has one big advantage over the F3, (other than the autofocus) and that's the 1/250th flash sync. The 1/80 on the F3 is a real drag...almost Leica-like! :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ray . Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 Unbelievable that Doug Herr should feel the need to defend his work to Jay, of all people. What a joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve_barnett2 Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 Hmmm, everybody seems to have got in before me! Oh well, here goes, the Nikon F3HP, the best made SLR ever! Otherwise I still yearn for my old Nikkormat. Truly a camera you can knock nails in with and continue shooting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg_smith4 Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 I love my Nikkormat. Very reliable, great lenses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doug herr Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 <I>I still yearn for my old Nikkormat. Truly a camera you can knock nails in with and continue shooting.</I><P> The one thing that bugged me about the Nikkormats was the film advance lever. If my thumb had the slightest pressure on the lever the shutter release locks. Grrrr. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ralph_barker Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 I wouldn't. I'd just grab the Nikon F5 and take advantage of the technological advances, as appropriate, for the things that SLRs are good for. The three lenses would be the 28-70mm/f2.8 and 80-200mm/f2.8 AFS zooms and a 60mm/f2.8 Micro Nikkor. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike_scarpitti Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 Leicaflex SL or SL2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patricks Posted October 28, 2003 Author Share Posted October 28, 2003 So what are the diffs between all these early Nikons: F3HP, FM2, FE2, or F2 etc. It seems like one can pick up a good working F3HP for around $300, then add a few lenses and still have money left over from teh 50'lux I just sold... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feli Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 >And as good as Doug is, I don't hear his name uttered in the same >breath with Len Rue, Art Wolfe, Frans Lanting, John Shaw, Heather >Angel or a long list of others who achieved great fame as nature bla >bla bla As far as I know Doug isn't a fulltime shooter. >Wore out 2 F2's and 3 F3's over the years, the F's still keep going. You managed to wear out 5 Nikons? Nikon rates their shutter at about 150,000 exposures. What wore out or did they die due to physical impact or something? Feli Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doug herr Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 <I>what are the diffs between all these early Nikons: F3HP, FM2, FE2, or F2</I><P>The basics: the F2 and F3 are from the tough-as-nails pro line, the FM and FE series are a lot tougher than their lower initial price would suggest. The pro line has 100% viewfinders, so if you shoot slides you should adjust for this. They also have interchangable finders and viewscreens. The original FM does not have an interchangable viewscreen, but later FM variants do. I'm not sure if all FE models have interchangable viewscreens.<P> The F2 and FM-series have mechanically-timed shutters while the F3 and FE-series have electronic shutter timing and aperture-priority exposure automation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john_r._fulton_jr. Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 >And as good as Doug is, I don't hear his name uttered in the same >breath with Len Rue, Art Wolfe, Frans Lanting, John Shaw, Heather >Angel or a long list of others who achieved great fame as nature bla >bla bla ......hating to state the obvious, but perhaps he should be included with the others. BTW, not to stir things up, but in the 1960's you could tell the amateur "Nikon users" from the pros. The pros had the plain pentaprism and the amateurs had the photomic. (They weren't considered accurate and the gizmo that mated the meter and lens was a crap-shoot at best.) Also, I never saw a pro with a Leica meter on top of his M2. Okay, let the bricks fly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lee_shively Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 Nikon F2A is the way to go for a truly manual camera. Although the F/FTn models were stronger, they lacked some of the refinements engineered into the F2 models and the F2A did away with the Achilles heel of the previous Nikons--the meter coupling prong. Or simply an F2 with a standard prism and no meter for a super truly retro-manual experience SLR. The FM's were never up to the high standards of the top-of-the-line Nikons, the FE's and F3's were not really manual (autoexposure). Of course, what you really want is not a manual SLR. And Nikon manual focus works in the opposite direction from Leica rangefinders. That can become frustrating--I've been there. To compliment your Leica, I'd suggest either a current EOS-somethingorother or an older manual Canon like the F1n or FTb. The older Canon bodies were the equivalent of the Nikons of the day and lenses were really outstanding. See Mike Johnston's column in a recent "Black & White Photography" magazine about Canon's old FD lenses. The EOS cameras, on the other hand, are super-modern, electronic, autoouttheass and about as reliable as you can get in wunderplastik. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
albert knapp md Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 Nikkormat, nikkormat, nikkormat..... The F3 is also great but I agree that it is very loud. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jay_. Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 <<By that logic we'll have to give Doug Herr's opinions more credence than yours, Jay...After all, Doug has at least demonstrated an ability to make pro-caliber nature photos, while we have no evidence that you even make pictures. That seems a strange argument, coming from you.>> But it doesn't sound strange at all coming from you, since you purposely snipped and quoted just the last portion of my post deliberately in order to take it out of context and make it seem to fit your convoluted anti-logic. What I said was that if you happen to be so dense as to believe that only someone who has produced great photos has a valid opinion as to which camera is better, then by all means survey all the famous, published nature pros and see what cameras *they* use. But then, you knew that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fred_mueggelhopper Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 I would get an old Leica R4s or R4sP, if for no other reason than to be able to use the leica 100 apo/macro. The images produced by this lens blow me away. Next choice would be an FM2n. I used these for weddings for many years. They stand up to most anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruno_menilli Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 Canon F1n or Leicaflex SL/SL2, probably the Leica as it can use the lastest lenses as well. Regards Bruno Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travis1 Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 leica 6.2 and 35f/2. or fm3a and 24/2.8. now it's Yashica! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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