Is Leica Still in Business

[bashir_lunat]

"According to the LHSA their average age of members is 61"-

Jay, I always thought that. I have yet to see a young person with a Leica which is just as rare as some Leica items.I think they have completely wrong marketing policy.They have failed to attract people other than elderly citizens.

But hang on,someone sent me this photo which raises some hope!<div></div>

[photojerry]

WOW Thank everyone for there responses to my original comment.

I will try to respond to some of the comments.

 

Film is dead. There may be film available in 10 years but sales will be a very small percentage of what is sold today. Bill Gates has said tha tfilm is all but dead in 10 years. I am not saying that film will not be available but all of the action will be in digital. Look at 8x10 photography 5 to 7 years ago a 8x10 chrome was a very common image for professional market. DEAD DEAD DEAD Professionals are Digital. ALso I would be very surprised if any MEdium Format Equipment is purchased today that can not be digital. What doe this have to do with Leica everything. I am not going to buying any new equipment. If you look at LEica Sales they are down 20%

http://www.leica-camera.com/unternehmen/ir/presse/index_e.html

This is after many other quarters of down sales. LEica is only a camera and binocular company. LEca does not have anyting to do with the Geosystens and the Microsystens.

 

Jerry Freeman you are right film is not dead but in 5 to 7 years who is going to buy it. 20 to 30 % of the current market. Can Leica exist on such a smalll market. They are not making it now. Not many of the future photographers in the market will be able to afford Leica.

 

Chris you are on the money. I can see LEica being bought by Fuji and then Fuji buy HAsselblad. This would allow Fuji to market the LEica name in lenses. Fuji then cold sell create a Leica market to compete with Sigma and Tameron <Bronica>

 

JOhn Bossco I guessed at the 500 units but LEica does not get to keep the 10K remember they first sell to a retailer who has to make his 20 or 30 %. I capitalize the first 2 letter because of my crappy typing.

Sheldon you are correct but don't we have huge boxes of neagitives and slides..

 

J Wittenberg check out the WEb page it is explicit 3 unrelated compaies using the same name. I use LEica also but who is going to buy. Check out the quality ofthe current professional Digital equipment Imacon.dk 22MEg files unbeliable quality with instant results, Try VERY expensive back can cost 15 to 25 K but that is the professional market in years it will be priced for non profesional market.

 

Ralph you are correct. last year the digital sales are more than analog. It only took 5 years for that to happen. What is going to happen next year and teh year after. LEica sales on both the M and R are down. Who is going to be the customer

 

Why does everybody worry about archiving the film. What a mess we have now and amount of room being used to store the negatives.

 

Gary you have Kodachrme film now will be availabe in the furture. They have discontined all sizes except 35MM

 

JAmes they sad that they can not come out with a M digital. Ifthey did I would be /first in line to purchase.

 

Lee Photo East is a littlwe more than a consumer show. They are shwcasing all of the professional equipment from Sinar to HAsselblad Leica Canon Nikon PRofot etc etc. LEica was the ONLY company that did not have a professional digital camera. PERIOD.

SOme companies you had to purchase a digital back but it was avalable. Such as Hasselblad. I asked HAsselblad Rep and they said go to Imacon and Leaf

 

 

Jay Thank You

 

Robert Clark.

In photography there are many variable. Image capture with quality optics and large enough file you got a quality image. The upgrades are going to speed CApture time. I do not see the need for a 20Meg 35MM Raw File. If will be other aspects of the capture.

 

Chris this has nothing to do with AMerica . LEica sales are down in Germany. The Germans are buying the Canon and Nikon Digital.

 

Please excuse my misspellings and gramatical errors. I have to go back to work.

 

Jerald Rosenfeld

[gerald_widen]

From a Kodak press release. Don't know if this has been posted or linked. Also the poll could be biased since Kodak has an interest in keeping film alive and strong as long as possible. But still interesting <p> Kodak Survey Finds Nearly 60 Percent of Advanced Amateur Photographers Capture Majority of Images Using Film

Advanced Amateurs Gradually Entering Digital Photography Realm <p>

NEW YORK, Oct. 30 Despite the photo industry's increasing emphasis on digital photography, nearly six in 10 advanced amateur photographers still capture more than half of their images using film, reveals a "pulse poll" survey conducted by Kodak Consumer & Professional Imaging, a division of Eastman Kodak Company.

 

Though respondents prefer to capture images on film, more than one-third identified digital technology as the primary aspect of photography in which they intend to gain additional knowledge. Seventeen percent said they only shoot digital.

 

The pulse poll distributed nationally in the U.S. via the Internet to more than 10,000 photographers who classify themselves as advanced amateurs is an initiative to gain a better understanding of the photographic needs of advanced amateurs, as well as insights into how digital technologies are changing the art and business of photography.

 

Kodak defines an advanced amateur as a photography enthusiast who uses photography as a creative outlet while enjoying both the technical and artistic elements of the process. They will dedicate their time and money to build their skills in order to achieve pro-like images that gain the respect of their peers through sharing, attending workshops and entering competitions. For the advanced amateur, it is the experience and quality of the results that matter most.

 

The survey results, which achieved a seven-percent response rate, were released today in conjunction with the PhotoPlus Expo trade show.

 

The survey found that nearly two-thirds of respondents spend more than $1,500 annually on photography-related pursuits, and more than 25 percent spend more than $2,500 a year. A solid 82 percent indicated that peers, photography magazines/books and Internet photo news sites account for the majority of their self-taught photography education. Only eight percent of respondents listed photography courses as their primary source of information to enhance their photography skills.

 

"Advanced amateurs are true students of photography, and while they recognize the excitement that surrounds digital capture, they're still interested in gaining a strong understanding of photography fundamentals, especially using film," said Paula Balik, Worldwide Marketing Director, Professional Films, Kodak Consumer & Professional Imaging. "Film use is pervasive with advanced amateurs, and they're not afraid to experiment with new technologies and techniques just like the pros they emulate."

 

Nearly half of the respondents 48 percent favor color negative film, with those who favor color transparency film a distant second at 20 percent. Forty-six percent indicated they take their film to consumer labs/retail photofinishers for processing.

 

Nearly a quarter of respondents print images at home. This suggests that images are being digitized, either from digital camera files or by scanning negatives for image manipulation or storage. This reinforces that advanced amateurs are interested in the whole photographic process of capturing, manipulating and outputting images.

[kevin m.]

A prediction of doom based on a trade-show visit?

 

Have you ever been to a trade show of any kind and had a vendor tell you, "You know what, the car/boat/computer/camera you have now is pretty good. I'd keep it if I were you and work on your driving/skippering/typing/shooting skills instead of spending more money."

 

Kind of defeats the purpose of setting up a booth to hawk your wares, doesn't it?

[photojerry]

Gerald, Thank you Kodak confirms my belief with actual survey.

digital is coming fast and furious. My stats are from my head but you confirm the trend. In 5 years 40% advanced amatuers are3 going digital. WOW. I love the folks who say it ain't going to happen. The issue is the quality capture and output is here with digital. PRicw is still high but it will drop. What was it a LEaf Back for a HAsselblad was 35K with 5 Meg File 6 years ago. You can buy a 5 meg camera today for a few hundred dollars. ?

 

Again How many people are going to buy a LEica without digital option. I say VERY FEW AND FAR BETWEEN.

 

I think LEica is the best but they missed the boat. I do not think they can survive in there current configuration.

 

I heard they are trying to sell there cameras though boutiques inside camerastores in major metropolitian areas.

 

What is it there retailers can not sell it.

 

Jerald Rosenfeld

[Richard Williams]

<html>

<head>

<meta http-equiv="content-type"

content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1">

<title>txt</title>

</head>

<body>

Curiously enough <a href="http://www.frugalphotographer.com/cat02.htm">127

film</a>, <a

href="http://www.frugalphotographer.com/Solaris_enlarged.htm">126 film</a>,<a

href="http://www.kodak.com/US/en/motion/super8/film.shtml">Super 8

movie film</a>, <a href="http://processc22.stormpages.com/">C22 D&P</a>,

and for that matter <a

href="http://www.stanleysonline.co.uk/product-455.htm">Betamax tape</a>,<a

href="http://www.searchsupplies.com/Paper_Envelopes___Mailers/Paper/Carbon/">carbon

paper</a>, <a

href="http://www.heasterlawson.com/machine-supplies-typewriter.html">typewriter

ribbons</a>, and <a href="http://www.mrpen.co.uk/mrpenrefills.html">fountain

pen ink</a> are all still available, generally decades after their

technologies became 'obsolete'. It's a pretty safe bet that 35mm film

will continue to be sold for many years to come, at least as a niche

product. If I were to wager the price of a Hermes MP that 35mm will

still be available for (say) the centenary of the Leica, how many of

our Prophets of Digital Doom would line up to take my money..? I

suspect that film will retain a significant, profitable market share

for a long time, particularly amongst (e.g.) middle-aged casual

snapshooters who shoot a single roll on their summer holidays and have

no other interest in photography (there must be tens or hundreds of

millions of these worldwide), photographic artists who want the unique

'look' of film (especially B&W), and (of course) camera enthusiasts

(don't forget all the Japanese classic camera fans who make the VC

products viable). It isn't as if 35mm film is particularly difficult to

make (it's a 19th century invention, after all) and as long as a market

exists for it, someone will be there to fill it. <br>

</body>

</html>

[photojerry]

HOw many quality camera manufacturers are notaround any more bcause tehy did not keep up with the times..

Still my question is who is going to buy Leica Film Cameras.

 

Jerald Rosenfeld

[blakley]

There's an easy way to test your confidence in your predictions, regardless of which side of the debate you're on. You can simply go to your local brokerage and buy options on Leica stock. If you think film is dead, and Leica is too, buy a bunch of "put" options - they cost a small fraction of the current Leica stock price, and when the price of Leica stock goes down (for argument's sake, to zero), you get to (essentially) buy Leica shares at the market price (zero, remember, so they're cheap) and then turn around and sell them to some poor sucker who bet the other way - at today's (i.e. Nov 3 2003) stock price!! What a deal!!

 

If you think digital is a fad, buy call options. When the price goes way up, you can buy the stock from the techno-suckers at today's price (a fraction of the future price, since Leica has buried all the digital poseurs), and turn around and sell the shares at the market price and make a killing.

 

Or, you could just sit around and prognosticate here...

[photojerry]

Where can I buy puts on Leica

 

Jerald Rosenfeld

[bashir_lunat]

Jerald...enough is enough here, I know that Leica will carry on---there will be ups and downs----you just dont worry about them,they have been doind their business for longer than you and I have been here so leave it to them how they want to conduct their affairs, is that OK? No w move on.

Let them come with that back for R8 and R9 and all those who have been under estimating Leica will bite their fingers. My advice to all those is to keep their fingers washed!

[photojerry]

Bashir,

 

I would love to have Leica continue. They manufacture the best lenses in the world. I believe in there story of the quality of the glass. As I said earlier I would be first in line for a digital M camera. How can Leica stay in business if they have nothing but a 10K vanity camera. The folks on this BB are all users and love their LEicas. But there is NOTHING new.Call me wrong but the sales are DOWN> 20% just in the quarter. I have not tracked Leica in the last few years but I would guess their sales are down on a year to over 50% the last 5 years.

 

Jerald Rosenfeld

[bashir_lunat]

Jerald, I apptriciate what you say but sales figures are not too good for our Rolls-Royce but they are surviving, these companyies have no guts in introducing fresh enterprize, I can only say that they are victims of their own narrow marketing policy to carter for the few only.

Lets here from everybody in this room...Answer my question to best of your abiliy and forward your constructive criticism to Leica---SAee if they will listen.

What changes would you introduce at Leica, in terms of new ideas-(in light of say digital imaging as an added flexibility),product policy,marketing and sustaining what you will say?

Please think carefully and write your views. Thank you.

[bashir_lunat]

Excuse my spelling errors..please read sustainability instead if sustaining. sorry.

[photojerry]

Speelling and grammer I ge tthe A. AS for what can Leica do. How about a AutoFocus R9A. Use the lens with the R9DAF. How about a AF M7AF. True the purist will roll over in there graves but AF was the future 10 years ago. But at least try to catch up with the Far East.

 

Jerald Rosenfeld

[Spearhead]

<i>Is Leica Still in Business</i><p>

 

I did a search on the web and it appears that they still are in business.

[michael_marsh1]

Im 35 and use my leica m6 for two reasons.IM SERIOUS ABOUT MY WORK and it wont be a paperweight in 10 years when all those lcd panels bleed to death.i work in 100' rolls and i have humidity control so i bet you my srt 101 will be going strong then as well.do you guys like to work in the darkroom?

MJ MARSH

[charles_carpio]

I'm 21 yrs old and have a Leica R8, hopefully some us young folks (the new generation) keep Leica in business. The idea of going digital or the idea of have the "R9A" (autofocus) does not grab my attention. If Leica wants a change, why not go medium format? Might sales go up? Sure the camera will be heavy, bulky but would this change for the better (market wise)?

 

Carpio