new hampshire john Posted October 1, 2003 Share Posted October 1, 2003 Heya, all -<br><br>Just got <a href="http://www.leica-camera.com/produkte/compact/cm/index_e.html">this</a> in the Leica newsletter -- was there a pre-release buzz about this? Will they have demo copies at photoplus? Is it a Contax T3 killer? Is this the compact Leica that supplants M bodies for us us one-body-one-lens M shooters?<br><br>I have a lot of questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
douglas k. Posted October 1, 2003 Share Posted October 1, 2003 From the little info at that site, it appears similar in size and operation to the Hexar AF, albeit with a slower lens. But since it says "Leica" on the front, I'm sure everyong will find it superior to the $500 Hexar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jay_. Posted October 1, 2003 Share Posted October 1, 2003 There's a whole thread about it down below a ways. But I doubt it's going to supplant M bodies for anybody, other than someone who doesn't realize or utilize the potential of what an M body has to offer, or somebody who wants a backup or a camera to carry when he's really strapped for space, and just has to have a Leica name on it. What remains to be seen is the image size in the finder (a major downer with the Minilux), just how accurate or fiddly the LED-type manual focusing indication is, and the shutter lag. It is also going to be interesting to see who *will* buy this camera. By and large people shopping for P&S's are buying digital, and for those who must have the Leica name, there's the Digilux. It would seem that this camera may be targeted more at older Leica users who don't want to go digital but would like something lighter and smaller than their M, with loading and unloading that is more sympathetic to bifocals and arthritic fingers, and most of all AF. After all, HCB himself was using only a Minilux at last count. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrew_lee2 Posted October 1, 2003 Share Posted October 1, 2003 Hmm...pretty! Indeed it does have a built-in flash, which signals to me that it is more a point-and-shoot than anything else. The Hexar AF to me is not a point-and-shoot by any stretch of the imagination. The .7x image magnification in the viewfinder, facility to see beyond the brightline frames, absence of built-in flash, and the very fact that one needs to pre-focus the camera in order to shoot (i.e., can't just press down all the way on the shutter once to take a shot, unless you switch the camera to manual or infinity focus) attest to that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xav Posted October 1, 2003 Share Posted October 1, 2003 It seems to be a very nice upgrade to the minilux. It seems to address most if not all weaknesses of the minilux. Tempting... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
george_shihanian Posted October 1, 2003 Share Posted October 1, 2003 My guess is it'll be considered a P&S that takes great photos. BUT, who will buy it at what I'm guessing will be an astronomic price for a P&S, or, for that matter, an astronomic price for anything that uses FILM. What camera store will steer a walk-in toward a film P&S nowadays anyway? Everyone's headed toward the digital P&Ss. I think it'll be tempting for existing M users who still have some disposable income left after buying into their M systems. (How many does that leave for a potential customer base?!) Maybe it'll take the place of those Leica CLs that are carried along in the bag with the "M' gear, with the 40mm lens attached for when the "M" users want something "fast and smaller". I'd be tempted... but only to buy it used at a discount... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bds1 Posted October 1, 2003 Share Posted October 1, 2003 WHY ISN'T IT A 5-6MP DIGITAL????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derek_stanton2 Posted October 1, 2003 Share Posted October 1, 2003 It's nice looking, to be sure. I wish it were smaller still. It's too large for me to consider 'pocketable.' I have a T3 that's just about the right size, and i can't see the CM having any advantages over the Contax. If it were T3-sized, though, then i'd be interested in a 'results-based' comparison, rather than just specs. It is interesting, though, to see just what the market is for this type of thing. Some of the cameras categorized as P&S are nearly as large as rangefinder cameras, and at nearly the cost. Why a CM when you could have a G2 for roughly the same price? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
julien_bec Posted October 1, 2003 Share Posted October 1, 2003 "who *will* buy this camera ?"... Me... The point is I travel a lot, I want something wich allows me to take picks equal ot better in quality than the ones of a reflex or a rangefinder, something small and light. Besides so far (but I'm changing) for me taking photos was a way to immortalize good moment of my life, I was trying to compose my pictures but as a good amator photographer more than an "artist" who is always trying to create something new or original. Why I don't by a "M"? just because is to expensive. I'd like to have one for its mechanical feeling, and also because of the leica myths. So, Jay, why I don't by a Digilux ? Because digital is definitely not the same than films, not the same feeling, not the same results. About the point of the people that want a Leica name : I'm sure than 70% of the "M" user could take the same picks with a voigtlander but with a quarter of the price of a M. I don't blame them, for me the myth, the feeling that you have with a tool is also important for your pleasure. Some people are happy with swatchs some others prefer Rolex, but both are just giving you time. Just a word to my previous camera... A Minilux and... An hexar RF, you can see what I like. BUT what I don't like with the minilux : the rangefinder, what I don't like with the hexar : top speed at 250, 35 mm lenses. What I'd like : everything like the hexar but top speed at 1000, and a 50mm lense (better for panorama)... Almost the CM... Please leica put a 50 mm summicron on the CM ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bert_keuken2 Posted October 1, 2003 Share Posted October 1, 2003 The Leica CM pdf can be found here: http://www.leica-camera.com/imperia/md/content/pdf/compact/17.pdf I was curious about the SF24D flash but as you can see it appears to be an SF20 on steroids, with a guide number of 24 instead of 20. I had hoped it would offer bounce flash together with the higher output. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
george_shihanian Posted October 1, 2003 Share Posted October 1, 2003 Too bad the vast majority of worldwide P&S folks went digital in the past 2 years. No one, and I mean NO ONE who's out shopping for a P&S is going to consider a FILM version, they're probably not even going to SEE a film camera offered by the camera store salesman... Well, Leica IS improving in their market research department. THIS camera comes out only about 5 years too late. Most everything else Leica did was about 15 years out of date when it hit the market. I propose we also refer to Leica's new offering not as a P&S, but create a new category just for Leica- the P$S... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccrevasse Posted October 1, 2003 Share Posted October 1, 2003 Well, it's tempting to me, if you consider it a compact camera with an M-quality lens, autofocus, autoexposure, and built-in flash. Of course, my granddad squandered the family fortune on buggy whips in the 1930s, so my financial sense may be innately flawed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luisarguelles Posted October 1, 2003 Share Posted October 1, 2003 It is an improvement over the Minilux, reaching a shutter speed of 1/1000s and offering a viewfinder where you can see exposure data. I'm happy to see it uses the fantastic Leitz Summarit 40mm f/2.4, in my opinion a "Summicron class" lens. My wife owns a Minilux and when I put her negatives in the enlarger I'm always impressed about this lens. She uses the Minilx for familiar shots, but also for B&W landscape photography. Some of her work with the small Leica can be seen here: http://www.photo.net/photodb/folder?folder_id=314055 I suspect the street price will be about 1,000 Euros. What a pity it does not have manual exposure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
film rules Posted October 1, 2003 Share Posted October 1, 2003 I wonder whether the 1/1000 shutter speed is available at all apertures. On some other cameras, such as the Rollei AFM35, the top shutter speed is not available wide open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yongfei Posted October 1, 2003 Share Posted October 1, 2003 I have a Minilux, wonderful camera! I will definitely get this one after a few years, when the price goes down a little bit. This is a dream camera for taking travel slides. With 40mm, there is no need for 35mm AND 50mm. Simply stunning design for a P&S... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrew_hall1 Posted October 1, 2003 Share Posted October 1, 2003 Looks like it got a normal-sized finder: http://www.leica-camera.com/produkte/compact/cm/bildansichten/index_e.html It's funny how Leica avoids mentioning the type of shutter it has. Most likely to be a focal plane type (with slow maximum flash sync speed) instead of the usual all-syncing leaf shutter. I'd prefer the latter, even with a slower 1/500 top speed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
todd_phillips1 Posted October 1, 2003 Share Posted October 1, 2003 This does, indeed, look interesting. The question I ask again is that is it possible to turn the flash off and that it STAYS off without having to reset it all the time? I didn't see a flash switch on the photos, so I'm assuming that you have to do the "push this tiny button numerous times thing". IF you can leave the flash off and the viewfinder is good (1:1 I hope) then they may have a winner again assuming that the price is not prohibitive (and, yes, I'M looking for a film P&S to replace a Nikon 35Ti that I'm trying to sell simply because of the flash button). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luke_dunlap Posted October 1, 2003 Share Posted October 1, 2003 The viewfinder is .40x. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrew_hall1 Posted October 1, 2003 Share Posted October 1, 2003 The finder is bigger in magnification (vs 0.35x for the Minilux) AND eyepiece size, the older camera having a squinty little hole instead: http://www.leica-camera.com/produkte/compact/minilux/bildansichten/index_e.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terry_rory Posted October 2, 2003 Share Posted October 2, 2003 Just a little earlier George S informed us all that.... " No one, and I mean NO ONE who's out shopping for a P&S is going to consider a FILM version, they're probably not even going to SEE a film camera offered by the camera store salesman...." So I ask who is buying all those Contax T3's at £699 UK or whatever they cost in the USA? Dont assume the whole planet has gone digital just because you have. Digital has garnered just over 50 percent of the marketplace here in the UK and Europe so that means that just under half of the camera buying market here ARE still buying into film cameras even if the USA / Japan is'nt. That is a big market and these people are'nt all going to get their new film cameras home and immediately throw them away! They will buy film and use film and have film processed for a long long time to come as much as it may offend you, George. They may even like to have digital and film on the go together. Should we all stop because you are disappointed that Leica's new boutique P&S is not digital? Did'nt you know that Leica make digital cameras like the Digilux? Here is the link.... http://www.leica-camera.com/digitalekameras/index_e.html I am enthused about the fact that another premium brand has launched another premium film P&S. I hope they have got it right and I am very interested in getting one. I shall watching for users reports on the Leica CM here and other forums with great interest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
george_shihanian Posted October 2, 2003 Share Posted October 2, 2003 Trevor, Calm down! Where did I say the Leica CM offends me? Where did I say that I "went digital"? You think I'm anti-Leica? Nothing could be further from the truth. It sounds like your're almost hysterical over the film vs. digital battle. I do own a digital, but I most enjoy my 3 Leicas and 1 Canon rangefinders. Of course I know Leica offers a digital camera, or, is that a Panasonic? <g>. Perhaps I was speaking from my knowledge of the USA's habits, because most all the people buying film P&S cameras here are buying cheap ones, not looking for a high-end product. I'm speaking of the masses, not afcionados such as we, who do buy the T3's and will buy the CM. If they are looking high-end, they're certainly looking and buying digital. Even the low-to-middle level buyers are being steered to a digital camera. Wal-Mart even sells a digital for $30! It's never been easier because you don't even need a computer any longer, you just attach your digital camera or the media card directly to a dedicated printer. People on my street who aren't computer-savvy and are in their 70s have even gone digital. You admit the UK's digital sales figures at just over 50%. Well, by the time survey figures are published, the data is typically one year old, and digital is moving fast. Look at Japan and the US. In most electronics categories trends,cameras, cell phones, IMO, Japan leads the US by about 18 months, and the US in turn, leads the U.K. by a similar margin. Film is a rapidly shrinking market everywhere. I do admire Leica's introduction of the CM, but just how many will be sold? Maybe they kept the guts of the Minilux along with the lens, which will lower their development and production costs enough to make a profit even if it is a slow seller. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icuneko Posted November 3, 2003 Share Posted November 3, 2003 As Douglas K. said tongue-in-cheek I'm sure, "everyong (sic) will find it superior to the $500 Hexar." Probably so, except for those who have/use the Hexar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now