bag for long backpacking trip

[john_cothron]

I'm going to the Grand Canyon this spring. As I will be taking my

photo equipment, one of the issues I've run into is that.. I can't

take my Nature Trekker! It's just too big and bulky with all the

other equipment I'll be carrying ( I may be in the canyon for as long

as 14 days ). So.. I need something to carry equipment in on

shorter day hikes inside the canyon. I also need this "something" to

be highly compressable, for carrying it in. I could get a waist

pack, but I'll have enought equipment hanging off me as it is on the

way in. I plan to carry the majority of my photo equipment in wraps,

stored in my main pack (with a few exceptions for the trip down photo

ops) I've considered taking a photo vest, or something similar. Has

anyone been in this situation that could give me some ideas? I'm sure

they have.. I'd love to hear how you resolved it. :) Also.. anyone

that has been inside the canyon...and knows of a photo op I shouldn't

miss..feel free to let me know. Thanks for all your input (Bob, I

expect you to have some here!).

[dr._steven_bein]

John,

Lets start with what you are taking, then some answers can be attempted.

[john_cothron]

It's amazing what you don't think of at 1am. I'll be taking (possibly) two SLR bodies, EOS 3 and one other. I'm trying to keep it light as possible, so most likely 3 additional lenses (75-300 zoom, 90mm macro, and a zoom covering ultra-wide - normal), my 3021 tripod, flashes..filters..etc. Film of course. Sorry for the previous lack of info.

[cwphoto]

John, I have been working on this question of yours for 20 years. Here's my best solution to date. Some kind of waist pack. Lowe-pro makes the All-Weather holster that will hold the camera with 75-300 mounted. Add some suitable pouches onto the belt to accept the other equipment. Lowe includes a comfy chest harness if you don't like a belt.

There is also the Galen Rowell waist belt system by Photoflex; it will not hold a camera w/telephoto mounted, but is nice otherwise. I'd enjoy hearing what you come up with and an evaluation after the trip.

[patrick_chase]

Hi John;

 

Why not a set of Kinesis or LowePro Street&Field cases? (my personal choice would be is Kinesis, both because I think they're better bags, and because LowePro appears to have ripped their designs off shamelessly - http://www.kinesisgear.com/)

 

You can lash either to the webbing of your backpack when you're hiking in and out, and then put them on their dedicated harness or belt (which you would presumably carry in your backpack) when you're actually using them.

[john_cothron]

Thanks for you answers so far everyone. I knew this could (and probably will) turn into a large discussion, which will be great! Patrick, I agree with you on the Kinesis system..and I'm considering that. I'm leaning away from the waist pack Curt, mainly due to the bulk of carrying it in, and also because I'm sure I'll be carrying some sort of fanny pack on day hikes for other things (most likely the detachable top pocket on my Bora 95 pack). I realize there is no ONE solution for everyone, so I'm just trying to get a lot of ideas to see if there is anything I HAVEN'T considered. As of right now, my most favorite options are the Kinesis system (which would also eliminate the need for equipment wraps), or a vest of some sort. Keep them coming! Thanks again.

[Hector Javkin]

Read <a href="

http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=000WxT&topic_id=Nature%20Photography&topic=">this</a>, especially the comment, "that tripod will kill you." The weight, added to your camping gear and food, plus the water you need to carry in many parts of the Canyon, will be difficult no matter what you put it in.

[rayn]

How many people are going with you? If the weight of the stove, tent and water can be shouldered by someone else, you can bring a tripod and a couple of lenses, otherwise you just can't bring that much gear and have a good time. On trips with just me and my wife, I must keep things very simple because she cannot carry much. Canon Elan II, 28-135 IS, 25mm extension tube, and some filters is the most I bring now. It is very limiting, but the backpacking part is much more fun (and she loves me for that). I can still do some macro and occasionally some wildlife, but the IS is only good down to about 1/20 or so. I thought about a only bringing a Fuji 645 point & shoot and light tripod, but havn't tried it yet.

 

For excursions from camp, I have had success converting the backpack hood to a fanny pack in the field (most good backpacks do this). You could make some compartments to hold your gear in your hood, then it would convert nicely to a waist pack with compartments once in the field. I have tried to carry lots of gear many times, and IMO there really is no substitute to simply reducing what you bring, at least when you will be carrying the tent, food, stove, sleeping bag, water filter, etc. Try it out at home with whatever you know you must carry, and then add the photo gear until the load is maximized.

 

It also depends if you are going for fun or for photography. If you are going for fun, your friends may not appreciate all the photo stops you want to make (it takes time to unpack your gear and set up the tripod) and they may resent having to carry most of the gear. But if the goal is photography and the others in the group are more like assistants, then making them carry everything is ok. For me, I now do all "serious" photography before or after the trip (put everything in the trunk and leave to inside of the car EMPTY, disable the switch that opens the trunk from the inside of car, no problems yet...). I've found that most good spots can be reached on a day hike if you get up early enough and then I can bring all my gear. Happy hiking!

[preston]

I'll try to put some numbers to Hector's and Ray's point about weight.

 

Note that my response has nothing to do with photography and has everything to do with backpacking. You do not mention if you will have a resupply during your trip - I assume not. You do not mention if you will use a beast of burden - I assume not. The weights I give below are on the low side, and you most likely will carry more than this.

 

Camera stuff:

EOS 3 - 27.5 oz (w/o batteries),

lt.wt 2nd body - 12.0 oz (w/o batteries),

75-300 zoom - 16.0 oz,

90 macro - 16.0 oz,

22-55 - 6.2 oz,

3021 tripod - 92.8 oz (w/o head),

tripod head - 32.0 oz (guess),

flash - 4.0 oz (w/o batteries).

 

Total Camera stuff: 206.5 oz ~ 13 lbs ~ 5.9 kg

 

Non-communal gear and consumables:

Food - 336.0 oz (1.5 lbs/day),

Water - 62.0 oz (~weight of 2 quarts/liters),

Pack - 112.0 oz (guess based on my pack),

Rain gear - 32.0 oz,

Clothing - 48.0 oz,

Sleeping bag - 32.0 oz (may be way too little).

 

Total for non-communal gear: 624.0 oz ~ 39 lbs ~ 17.7 kg

 

Communal gear (your share based on sharing with one other person):

Tent/bivy - 32.0 oz,

Stove and pots - 32.0 oz,

Stove fuel - 32.0 oz (too little for 14 days),

Other - 16.0 oz (water filter, maps, first aid).

 

Total communal gear: 112.0 oz ~ 7 lbs ~ 3.18 kg

 

Total of the above, which is not everything you need:

59 lbs ~ 26.76 kg.

This is a LOW estimate.

 

Now add in boots (mine weigh a little more than 4 lbs (1.8 kg)), flash light, batteries, walking stick, gaiters, etc. Then there is all of the little things you need like cord, trash bags, toilet paper, trowel, ...

 

The whole point of this is, is to point out that the more weight I carry backpacking, the less I enjoy the experience. I did a 4 day winter trip about this time last year on the AT in GA, where my pack weighed in at 57 lbs (I over packed for fear of a winter storm), and I bitched the whole trip (most of the time the bitching was in my head and not out loud.) This past summer I did a 9 day trip through the Smokies on the AT (plus some side trails) and my pack weighed in right at 50 lbs, which I still think is too heavy, but I enjoyed the trip. Some of the people I backpack with bitch and moan when their pack weight exceeds 40 lbs, but I don't know of anyone that would enjoy a trip carrying 60+ lbs, which is what I think you are in for based on the little bit of information you have given.

[john_cothron]

Valid information on all your parts, and I'd say your overall estimate on weight is pretty acurrate Preston. I actually did much the same thing and came in around 65 lb. total pack weight, so that's close. Just to clarify some things.. I'm going with one other person, she's the writer of the pair. Yes, we are going to enjoy the outdoors, but one of the main goals of our trip is to document it..and I get the photography end. She (Debra) is also a mountain climber, so I have no worry there as far as her carrying her share.

 

I've backpacked a lot, and although I haven't carried much photography equipment with me before, I've carried 60+ lbs. many times, most times actually (I tend to overpack). Granted, this trip will be a little different, and we're using lightweight gear for everything, whittling down weight as much as possible (which is everyone's goal). While I, as much as anyone else, would much rather have my pack weigh 45lbs. as opposed to 65...I don't see that being possible this trip. Granted, I don't expect to have this pack on my back the WHOLE time I'm gone either, we'll be spending some time at a few places, dayhiking..etc., in which I won't need it, so it will stay put. My boots, while a significant weight of the overall package..will never be in the pack. On the occasions I'm not wearing them, I'll be camped...and not using the pack, so I didn't add the weight of those to my "pack" weight. The one thing I have decided, is that I'll only be taking one body, the EOS 3...if something happens, oh well.. but space as well as weight is a concern, so only one is going.

 

Ray, you have a great idea, one that would definitely be useful with the exception that I'll be descending anywhere from 4000 to 6000 inside a canyon...and going BACK down after the trip is definitely not something I would want to do.

 

Preston, as for the resupply drops....we will most likely be getting one drop at a ranger station, to answer that question. We're going to have to coordinate our travels to be in that area at the right time of course, but that's the plan. Also, how did you enjoy the AT? I've never hiked it, but I hear/read it's a great trip, let me know.

 

Thanks again everyone for your info, any more ideas or thoughts, let them fly. Talk to you again soon!

[bobatkins]

I'd dump the 3021 tripod. It's overkill for the lenses you plan to take and you can cut a couple of lbs off your load by substituting a 3001 ($65) or similar. Smaller and easier to pack too, plus $450+ cheaper than a 1227 CF Gitzo. The 3001 is more than enough tripod to haul up and down the canyon. A lightweight 3262 head would be fine with it. Every little helps...

[john_cothron]

good idea Bob.. I'll definitely look into it. Appreciate it.

[craig_gillette]

Other answers have covered the weight isues and the down then up nature of the trip, etc. When I was active at that type of thing, I overpacked as well, being somewhat of a gadget freak but never anything for this long. I guess I'll just throw at you a couple of things to consider. "Spring" can still be winter. My family and I visited the Canyon by rail a couple of years ago in early April, and from that trip experience I'd advise you, you can't necessarily rule out cold and wet. The whole Kaibab plateau area was under a slow moving storm that dumped easily a foot of snow for four straight days, mostly overnight. Road travel was heavily impacted each morning and the plows were very busy. The night/morning/day the storm moved in they never got I40 open from Williams to Winslow. It was the week after Easter so a lot of snowbirds were stuck trying to get back north. It wasn't too snowy actually at the rim when we were there but it was very cold and very windy!! Obviously weather changes as you go down, but! We were there last September as well. There was a lot of trail repair underway. You may want to look at the NPS site for current info. Now the September trip was beautiful, even with rain, great clouds and light,and now I need another Northern Arizona fix. Have a good trip!

[derek_franks2]

This post is semi-off topic, but I though Preston might appreciate this. This summer I did two 4 day backpacking trips with my girlfriend and her aunt and uncle in seattle. We spent 4 days in Wenatchee NP and 4 days in Olympic at Third Beach. I brought a pretty large amount of photo gear with me (3221, N90s, 80-200/2.8, 35-70/2.8, etc). Luckily, my girlfriend's relatives did not mind stopping while I took pictures (they're basically modern day hippies and I think they just looked at bugs and plants and stuff) nor did they mind spreading the weight of my gear around a little bit (her uncle carried the 3221 almost the whole time). This brings me to the amusing part of the story. My girlfriend's uncle is probably one of the strongest guys I've ever met (and he only weighs in at 150 lbs). We weighed the pack he was carrying in Wenatchee, and it came in at about 80 pounds. Not once did he complain, and in fact when his wife got tired, he shouldered her 45 pound pack and balanced it on top of his head for at least a couple of miles. I was in awe. And after all of this, we'd colapse at our campground at night and he'd go off and do a little more hiking on his own! I was asking him how he got in shape and he was telling me that he hikes alot and runs home from work everyday no matter what the weather (it's 5 miles uphill the whole way). He was also telling me that his personal record for a day hike was a 39 mile round trip hike he had take a couple months before. Anyways, I saw him at christmas and told him that I'd be bringing some big glass and maybe a medium format system for him to carry for me this summer, so he'd better get into shape :-)

[john_cothron]

I made an error earlier.. it's actually the 3221W I had planned on taking, not the 3021...I'm not sure why I had the 3021 on my mind, but it's the same basic tripod.. so it doesn't change the scenario

[john_cothron]

Great story Derek.. does your uncle rent himself out as a pack mule by any chance? I have a job for him this spring..lol :)

[jason_elsworth3]

I have done this a couple of times now and would definitley recommned some kind of modular waist pack system. I have a Lowe pro off trail 1 with a body pouch and two lenses pouches, plus a smaller pouch that I attach for filters and stuff. I carry this all inside my large pack when I am hiking, havng a modular system means you can take it apart to fit in your pack but still have an all in one system for when you stop. I have found carrying any camera gear on my body whilst carrying a big pack uncomfortable and hot. It is also very difficult to take a good photo handheld with 40-50lbs on your back anyway. If a UFO lands and out steps bigfoot then you will miss the opportunity but this has only happened to me once :). For day trips away from camp I have used my hipsac from the top of my big sac plus the camera waist belt but to be honest I prefer to just take my big pack with a light load if I am going any real distance from camp and conditions warrant carryng full waterproofs, plus food etc. Hope this helps.

[bryan_weckmann]

Hi John, I was out to the Canyon last April, as the last leg of a 32 day trip to a bunch of Nat'l Parks in the area.I spent two weeks at the Canyon doing mostly day hikes into the Canyon, with one trip to the bottom, to overnight at Phantom Ranch.I carried a Tamrac 752 backpack loaded to 35lbs(camera equipt,no camping stuff),with a Gitzo 321. I used a photo vest which I found to be quite useful to keep lots of things imediately accessible. While you received lots of good equiptment info from the other posts, let me give some insights to the Canyon. I'm making no claims at being an expert in the Grand Canyon, I've only gone to the bottom ONCE! But let me say it is quite a STRENUOUS endevour! It sounds like you have done quite a lot of serious hiking and are well prepared. But do not take the Canyon for granted. She kills several people each year!Bring LOTS of food and water as there is very little to be found down there.The N.P.service has a great website for the G.C.as well as all of the parks they control.You will find a ton of info there, check it out.Most of all, enjoy yourself, the Canyon is a truly beautiful place!Bryan

[luffy]

I did a Glacier NP trip last summer with my 52 yr. old father. I'm 23 and in (or was then) great shape. My pack (a Mountain smith Frostfire) was over 60lbs with a N90s (no vert grip), 300 f/4, 24-120, 105, 2X tele, filters, flash, CF tripod w/ gripball, and 50 rolls of film. I carried my camera w/ 300 or 24-120 and 105 (depending on what I expected to shoot) in a LowePro Topload Zoom case on my chest. There was also room for a filter pouch (4 filters) and around 4 rolls of film. I wore pants with large thigh pockets where kept a larger supply of film (10+ rolls). If I was packing I generally kept the 24-120, 105 combo in the zoom case on my chest and the 300 in a Kinesis case (type?) that would clip right into my Frostfire�s existing lashing system, metal button/hole setup, on the hip belt (nice coincidence!). That put the 300 in the perfect spot so that if I needed it quickly it was as easy to grab as reaching into my pocket. If I had the 300 in the zoom case I placed the 24-120 and the 105 in separate soft-sided lens cases (Tamron) and clipped them to my waist belt or side of the pack with beeeners. The Tripod was always clipped (compression straps) into the side of my pack with the legs in the water bottle pocket at the bottom. This worked but was slow (I had to take the huge pack off to get to the tripod).

 

For day trips I threw everything in my empty pack and headed off. That was a bit of overkill even with two people�s worth of supplies (rain gear, fleeces, food, water, etc.)

 

We did 13+ miles a day with large elevation changes. I would have been much happier with a lighter pack but I would not have gotten the great shots of the grizzly or the Moose (not to mention all the scenics I took). Because of the aggressive mileage I did not take as many shots as I had planned so I would suggest keeping it slower than that.

 

If I had to do it now I would get the Kinesis chest case (the new smaller one) as it seems to be built better than the LowePro with less bulk and weight.

 

Have FUN!

[dan_kusko]

Chestpack!!! I've backpacked many times (week-long trips) with an Elan, two lenses, film, and a couple of filters stuffed into a Lowepro TopLoad Zoom AW chestpack ($45-$50). It doesn't interfere with your backpack and provides easy access to camera gear. Plus, when you're ready to scramble for some photo ops you can remove your backpack without removing the chestpack. It's the best setup I've found.

[josh1]

John, one solution to your problem might be to use a small or medium sized camera bag that will slip over the waist belt of your pack. I personally don't like having something strapped to my chest--limits mobility (looks kind of geeky too). Tamrac makes several "convertable" camera bags that have a tuck-away waist belt. I don't use the belt much but the sleeve that it tucks into is just the right size to slip around the waist belt of my gregory backpack. As long as you don't have too many nalgene bottle holders already hanging from your waist belt this seems to work pretty well. You can get at your camera quickly and as long as the bag is not too big it doesn't get in the way. One thing you have to be careful of is not smashing your camera gear into a rock when you take your pack off. This is the best solution that I have been able to come up with so far.

[kinesisphotogear]

Several people have suggested chest packs. We (Kinesis) have a simple solution for this old problem...how to attach your camera holster case to a non-camera type backpack. We have an <A HREF="http://www.kinesisgear.com/y.html#y303"> $6 Adapter Kit</A> that will enable you to attach a Kinesis, Tamrac or a Lowepro zoom case to the shoulder straps of most mountaineering backpacks.

[cisko]

I'll echo Aaron and Dan's answer -- I've also settled on the chest pack option, specifically the Topload Zoom A/W. Last summer I carried Elan II w/ BP50, EF 28-105, EF 17-35, and some film in it. I jury-rigged an attachment system, similar to the Kinesis deal Richard suggests (which I couldn't get in time). I also had a EF 300 f/4 in a Lowe Street & Field case attached to my hipbelt, and a Bogen 3221 tripod strapped to my pack. This is in addition to 55 - 60 lbs of gear.

 

With this system, it did take a lot longer to "saddle up". It does balance well -- I didn't feel that it reduced my mobility at all (given that I was carrying a ton of gear). Everything was close to hand, except the tripod. I do agree with Josh that it looks pretty geeky...

 

It is a big load. It meant that I did a lot less mileage during the day. OTOH, that meant that I had more time for photography before and after the day's hike -- ie, around sunset and sunrise. It matched well with what my hiking partners wanted too.

 

Cheers,

Dave

[timothy_breihan1]

The belt systems are great, not only for their comfort, but also due to the fact that, being modular, they can adapt to a wide variety situations. I use LowePro when doing photojouranlism work. Looking at what equipment you are planning on taking, probably a pair of topload camera/lens cases to carry your bodies, each with a lens attached, as well as a lens pouch for the third and some sort of utility case for film, filters, tools, etc. I would assume that you will also have a pack to which the tripod can be lahshed. This setup should be fairly comfortable and afford the freedom of movement for climbing and whatnot.

[marco_anglesio]

A short comment on carrying a tripod. You can get walking sticks (which now are more like shock-absorbing ski poles than sticks) which will convert to a monopod. I believe Mountain Equipment Co-op (www.mec.ca) carries them.

 

Now, this isn't an anodyne to your problem, but it may well cover 90% of the problem with no growth in equipment, and you may be able to improvise the rest with materials at hand. No doubt you'll appreciate the stick as a stick as well.