Bronica Recomendations

[mark45831]

I have been looking at the Bronica's and was wanting some opinions of what line has the better optics, selections and quality, its been some time since I have used a MF system( mine was stolen about 10 yrs ago) but the prices are very tempting to get another. thx

[mwmcbroom]

Mark, I think it's gonna depend at least somewhat on how you plan to use your MF system and what your preferred output will look like.

 

I've owned two different Bronica systems -- a classic old EC-TL, a square-format camera that uses the old-style focusing helical to which lenses are mounted. The EC, EC-TL, and S2-series all take the same lenses, but the EC and EC-TL's backs are different from the S2-series backs. And the system I currently own is Bronica's 6x4.5 format camera, mine is the last and best of this series, the ETRSi. While I like the EC and EC-TL cameras a lot, they're getting old and long in the tooth now, and I think that, if you prefer square format, you'll be better off with one of the SQ cameras. My favorite SQ-series is the last one made -- the SQAi.

 

I found that even the early lenses for the S2/EC were excellent. But the lenses for the later series, such as the ETR-series and SQ-series are even better. Better coatings, plus they have shutters on board the lens, so you'll have flash sync at all speeds, which is something the old Bronicas lack because of their focal plane shutters.

 

So, my suggestion -- decide which format you prefer -- 6cm square or 6x4.5 and that will determine wether you'll want to go with an ETR series or SQ series. I reccommend the "i" models with each series though because they have two features earlier ones lack: TTL flash with supported units and the correct adapter, and mirror lock up, which is handy for long exposures.

[SCL]

Can't compare systems against each other having only owned only ETRS/ETRSi which were very good.

[mark45831]

I think the 6x4.5 would be more to my liking, What do you think a reasonable price I should be looking at for a Body, WL finder, Film back and I see most of them with the 50mm lens, the ones I am seeing are around $300-400 and look pretty clean, this is for the etrsi. thanks

[ben_hutcherson]

50mm is a wide angle lens. The ETR series cameras had 75mm as their "normal" lens(depending on the system and the format, you'll find that "normal" for medium format is often specified as 75mm for 645, 75mm or 80mm for 6x6, and 90mm for 6x7).

 

$300 sounds a bit steep to me for just that basic kit. When I bought my ETR system, I got an ETR with grip, ETRS, 2x 75, 50mm, 150mm, 4 120 backs, and 90º prisms for both cameras for $400. I generally don't like prisms in MF, but they are tolerable to me in 645 and a waist level can be a bit of a pain.

[SCL]

Do an Ebay advanced search and select sold listings for recent actual prices paid. You can look up the item descriptions to see which ones condition and details come closest to what you are seeking. And don't forget that many listings are open to price negotiation. I've generally found for equipment in good working condition that many sellers are willing to accept a 20-33% discount from their inflated asking price...but you must be willing to walk away if the seller is unrealistic in asking price...and you must be patient for the items you want to become available. If money doesn't matter...just use the buy it now button at full asking price.

[andyfalsetta]

If you are locked into the ETR, then the one to have is the latest version, ETRSi. One reason why is the ETRSi has mirror lock up while the earlier ones do not. Personally, I could never own a medium format SLR without mirror lock up. Additionally the ETRSi had the PE lenses which are more desirable than the earlier ones.

[orsetto]

The ETR all but requires a prism viewfinder (metered or unmetered) + the side grip to be practical. The innate rectangular 645 landscape format make a waist level finder extremely awkward unless your work tends to be strictly landscape compositions (never any vertical portrait shots). The nifty integrated grip is what "made" the Bronica ETR (and later SQ): no other medium format system with removable film magazines had an optional integrated grip with coupled thumb wind and shutter release.

 

It inspired modern followups like Pentax 645 and updated Mamiya M645 Pro, but those traded the removable grip and waist level finder options for permanent motor grips and fixed eye-level prisms. If you don't have need of a motor drive (and really, who would today with a limit of 120 film only?), the ETR and SQ are the most versatile rigs available in their respective formats (WLF or prism, AE or meterless, grip or no grip: your choice). Just watch out for back seals in the magazines, or damaged magazines: these backs tend to be a bit more fragile than other brands like Mamiya or Hasselblad. Run a roll of film thru any Bronica you buy immediately, to verify no problems with the back.

 

Later lenses are usually better and not all that much more expensive: whenever possible, look for PS vs S for the SQ and PE vs MC or E for the ETR. This is more critical with the wide angle (and perhaps standard) lenses, the portrait teles with the same maximum aperture are optically similar across generations. The newer lenses have updated coatings (not terribly significant), half stop aperture detents instead of full stop, and improved shutter cocking mechanics. Chances are any ETR or SQ lens that survives in working order today has good mechanics, but there was an issue with some of the first gen lenses going wonky due to a flawed cocking design that was addressed in the later revisions. The newest wide lenses had some optical updates and filter size changes: not everyone thinks these were desirable alterations, so YMMV. More detailed lens discussions are easily found on forums by running a search like "Bronica PS vs S" or Bronica PE vs MC".

Edited July 29, 2019 by orsetto

[mark45831]

No im not in a hurry, I need to dig all my Darkroom stuff out and get back set up, so I will wait for the right one, I had a RB67proSd once that was stolen and with Digital getting popular I kinda got away from doing my own film. The draw back with the RB it was so big and heavy, From what I can tell is the Bronica's are not as large or heavy but equally optical? thanks for all the response

[mwmcbroom]

I touched on this in my first post, but I have a bit more information now that I've jogged my memory some. It's the ETRSi ans SQAi's TTL flash capability. A favorite flash to use with this cameras is the old handle mount Metz 45-CT4, a quite powerful unit that should work great for virtually any application. They're pretty reasonably priced these days, too. I bought mine for $50. The module necessary to interface the flash with either of the above two cameras is the SCA 386 module. I keep the Speed Grip attached when I use my 45 CT-4 because I like having the wind lever. Plus, I can mount the SCA 386 module to it. It takes a bit of thoughtful routing for all the cables for this to work well, but it can be done.

 

About the available finders. My ETRSi came with a non-metered prism finder. I had no interest in buying a waist-level finder for it because I knew I'd be holding the camera up to eye level most of the time. The non-metered prism finder is rather large, but pales in size to the Action Prism Finder E that Bronica also made for that camera. I bought one of these things -- mostly because it was selling for cheap and I was curious. So now I have the Action Prism, but I'll likely never use the huge thing. The metered prisms are about the same size as the non-metered prism finder. Bronica made three different AE Finders, the AE Prism, AE II Prism, and AE III Prism. I don't know anything about the AE model. I bought an AE II for mine. I wanted the AE III but it was selling for twice as much as the AE II and I just couldn't justify spending that amount then. However, one of these days, I'm gonna get the AE III for it. The AE II has three settings: Aperture priority auto, manual, and off. It's metering pattern is just a simple averaging pattern. It also has an exposure compensation dial. The AE III adds a spot meter to the metering patterns, plust it also has built-in dioptric adjustment.

 

If you're looking to buy an outfit, pay attention to the back(s) being offered with it. Make sure you're getting at least one 120 back, cuz unless you have a stash of 220 film in your freezer, you're not gonna be able to use 220 backs anymore. There are LOTS of 220 backs for sale for the ETR series on places like eBay, but relatively few 120 backs. I guess those folks who have them are hanging onto them. Also, there have been a few different versions of ETR-series backs. The best design is the latest design -- the Ei back. It has twin latches on top and a locking dark slide. Expect to pay a premium for Ei backs, but I think it's worth it.

[orsetto]

The draw back with the RB it was so big and heavy, From what I can tell is the Bronica's are not as large or heavy but equally optical? thanks for all the response

 

The ETR or SQ with prism and grip is significantly smaller/lighter than an RB67 (esp an RB with prism and grip). Handling is much more nimble and quick: the speed grip makes it thumb advance/cock like a 35mm SLR, and with an AE prism you'll be totally modern short of no AF feature.

 

The Bronica lenses are overall roughly equal in quality to the later RB Type C and/or K/L lenses. A couple of the RB K/L lenses are exceptional, with no real Bronica equivalent, but broadly speaking sharpness/contrast is about the same across both systems (the larger 67 film format requires less enlargement, so lens performance isn't directly comparable, but similar). The later Bronica PS wide angles will be the closest match to the finer RB wides. The normals 75-80mm don't have anything critical to distinguish between them. For portrait 150mm consult dedicated Bronica lens discussion threads for recommendations before buying: I believe the f/3.5 variations are considered noticeably different to f/4. Depending on lens aspects you prioritize, you might prefer the older or newer version.The 180mm is a popular compromise, since it can get you a tighter close focus shot than either 150mm without having to stop and add an extension tube or closeup lens.

Edited July 29, 2019 by orsetto

[peter_fowler]

If you ever develop an interest in taking pictures of flowers and use a tripod you may find the wlf a bonus . Also , when searching

for an Etrsi , I found paying close attention to the photos of where the backs mounted to the bodies gave a good indication of their

use ,significant paint loss around the back mounting slots was the clue . Love those durable cameras . Peter

[jamesevidon]

I have been looking at the Bronica's and was wanting some opinions of what line has the better optics, selections and quality, its been some time since I have used a MF system( mine was stolen about 10 yrs ago) but the prices are very tempting to get another. thx

 

I decided to get back into medium format film after I scanned some of my old negs and transparencies I shot with my long gone Bronica S2A. I picked up a Bronica ETRS with the side grip that has the shutter button and film advance and the AEII prism finder for under $400. The seller was a camera dealer in the midwest.

 

I just went out and shot at anything in order to make sure everything worked. My first roll was very acceptable. Sometimes Ebay is worthwhile.