garry_teeple1 Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 I am looking to purchase a field camera and have narrowed the choice to these possibilities but am open to other sugestions. I am considering either a Horseman FA, Wista VX, or an older Linhof, III or IV. I welcome any sugestions, comments, or other good advice. Weight is not a big concern but I would like to keep it to six pounds or less and it must be metal. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glenn_kroeger Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 Garry: Depends on the lenses you want to use, and other factors. The FA is limited in bellows draw to about 240mm, and the back movements on the Horseman and Linhof consist of 4 sliding posts at each corner of the body. This form of back movement is not conducive to easy separate adjustment of tilt and swing. Wista VX is a nice camera. You should also consider the Toyo 45 series (45A, 45AX, 45AII). These compare nicely to the Wista, but there are differences. Several threads have recently compared these. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ellis_vener_photography Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 Canham DLC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marc p. Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 I had the same dilemna as you about a month ago and ended up getting an Arca-Swiss F-Line. So far, I find it perfect for field use, and don't regret it. It folds small, is quick to set-up, and it has been much easier to use that the metal field cameras I had tried before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jay_lynch Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 Garry, The Linhof Tech IV is the best built, highest quality 4x5 field camera there is, hands down! Because of that it will cost you a little more, but in the end you will not be sorry. good luck... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eugene_singer Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 Gary, consider one of the Toyo 45A cameras. Look at the selection of used ones on the Midwest Photo Exchange website (mpex.com). Call Jim (and only Jim) at the store. Tell him that you got this recommendation from this forum. He can save you money. Especially, if you package a lens with your purchase. The Toyo A's come in three flavors.45 AII: newer model with revolving back. 45 AX: newer model, without revolving back. 45A: older model, with revolving back. All have identical bodies. The newer models have rubberized knobs. There is a picture of a 45A in Adam's book "The Camera" (1980). The design of these cameras has withstood the test of time. Do not consider the Toyo 45CF. It is not in the same league as the 45A's. Look at the Toyo website (toyoview.com). Compare the specs.for the Toyo field cameras with the others that you mentioned. Especially bellows extension and movement capability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian_ellis3 Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 The Horseman has a very short bellows, 10.25," so if your preference in lenses leans towards anything longer than about 210mm I'd forget the Horseman. The Linhof has a 15" bellows so you can use longer lenses but Linhofs aren't very user friendly with lenses shorter than 90mm. So if your preference in lenses leans towards anything shorter than 90mm I'd forget the Linhof. Actually I'd forget the III in any event, it doesn't have forward tilt on the front standard (I know there are workarounds but why bother with a workaround when other cameras have forward front tilt without a workaround?), the lens boards aren't easy to find since they're a different size than the later Technikas, parts are next to impossible to find, etc. etc. So let's see, one camera isn't good for long lenses, the other isn't good for short lenses, that leaves the Wista, about which I know nothing except that the wodden Wistas I've seen have been very nice cameras. Toyo makes a metal camera that many people like though I think it too has a pretty short bellows, the Canham that Ellis mentioned is probably a more flexible camera than any you mentioned if you like its styling (or don't care about styling) and if you can afford it. Not that it's super expensive like say a new Linhof would be, but it's more than the three cameas you mentioned I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ralph_barker Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 Another satisfied Toyo 45AX user here. The reversable back on the AX (instead of revolving) saves almost a pound in weight and several hundred dollars in price. But, the back (and some other parts) is (are) interchangeable with other Toyo models, so I could always steal the revolving back from my 45C monorail if I wanted. The Toyo also uses vertical back-tilt stops on the front and rear tilts, rather than detents, making it easier to make fine adjustments. I'l like a little more back tilt on the rear standard, but I've been pleased with the 45AX overall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul_owen Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 Gary, any reason why you will not consider a wooden camera? Do NOT dismiss wood!! Have you considered (I now duck as readers hurl things at their monitors and shout "change the record"!!) an Ebony? :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garry_teeple1 Posted February 13, 2003 Author Share Posted February 13, 2003 I think for my use and the durability I perfer metal. My main concern with wood is the effects of extreme temperature and humidity changes. Missouri weather hits the extremes for humidity, especially high and hot. I am also thinking about looking at a Technikardan 45s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rw_hawkins Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 Canham DLC45, lightweight, inovative design and built by a guy worth supporting. I have been shooting with a DLC45 for several years and I love it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott_walton2 Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 My personal camera is a Tec III but I have a IV at work and for field work, I like them both. The IV has a little more movements but the III works fine for what I do personally! I wanted to go with a wood but I really like the Linhof and I don't regret other than the aesthetics of a pretty wood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott_walton2 Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 No problems with the 360mm I use or down to the 90mm with the III. I have also a 75mm at work with the focusing rail (expensive piece) if you like wides, go with the IV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_ellinger2 Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 If you are planning extensive use of wide angle lenses, the Wista "wide angle" lens board is far superior to "recessed" boards. For very long lenses, Wista makes an extension tube board, and/or extended rails and bellows. For portraits, Wista makes a cable that connects the film back to "press" type shutters, that will automatically fully open/close the shutter when the film holder is removed/inserted, without disturbing the preset aperture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tedharris Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 Hi Gary, First, if you check the archives here you will find numerous posts on the pros and cons of all the cameras mentioned. Next, field cameras are all tradeoffs and what you choose will depend on what best suits your own personal style and your goals. Now, on to the Horseman FA since I believe that Armin Seeholzer and I are the only ones here who use these beasts. I use the Horseman FA and have for over a dozen years. It is my mainstay field camera, in fact I also have a Horseman HF as a backup. Yes, it has a relatively short bellows extension and yes sometimes the back adjustments can get a bit fiddly (although I generally don�t find them so). Having said that I believe its positive features far outweigh the negatives. Of all the cameras discussed it is both the lightest and the most compact. In fact, I believe that of all the field cameras available only the Toho and the Gowland are appreciably lighter. I don�t think you will find anything more compact than the Horseman folded up. It is well designed and built like a rock. Mine has fallen and bounced on rocks with no damage. It sets up fast and all the controls operate smoothly. It is part of a vast system (same is true of the Linhof). I use mine, with ample movements, with lenses from 75mm (SA f5.6) to 240mm (Fuji 240 A). In fact the 240 is one of my most used lenses and I have no problem focusing it at infinity and a bit closer. If I had to tell you why I chose this over many other equally excellent cameras the main reasons would be compactness and weight. I can stuff it and a couple of lenses in a briefcase with other stuff. Normally, when I am traveling light I put my entire Horseman kit in a small LL Bean�s haversack and the total weight with the camera, Quickload holder, meter, film, three lenses, etc. is around 6 lbs. I assume that $$ are a factor since you mentioned older Technika�s. You may also want to consider the other models of the Horseman: 1) the HD which is the same as the FA but doesn�t have the rear bellows and hence no rear movements or 2) the HF which is like the FA but doesn�t have the flip-up flap in the front that gets the top out of the way with very short lenses (not needed with the 75mm) and has a non removable graflock back which means that to make vertical shots you need to flip the camera on its side (I do this about as quick as you can remove and flip a back via a second quick release plate on the side of the camera). If the HF interests you they are bargains because they are relatively unknown in this country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david_grandy5 Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 I have one of the older Toyo Field cameras and each day I think how lucky I was to get it. When I lay awake at night dreaming about new toys the only camera that I can think that would surpass all of the Toyo's features would be a Tech V or better. These cameras are really 5x7 cameras, but most will have been factory configured to be 4x5's. They are metal and were made in the early 70's or so. I don't think that they were ever officialy marketed in North America but were probably brought in as sort of grey market imports. I have an an an ad from Olden (I think) Camera from the back of a '71 Popular Photography that is the only bit of North American advertising I've ever seen. In any event the Field Camera is well made. It has about 16" of bellows due I suspect to it being a 5x7. This length is longer than reported in a review elsewhere on this site. Perhaps that review didn't take into account the two back "pistons" that can be released to expand the bellows by at least two inches. It has a rotating back and takes the old Graflex lens boards. Mine came with a Toyo sliding medium format back which looks just like the current models although I couldn't say for sure that the new ones would fit. It has front tilt and swing and good rise and fall, but no front shift. It has no back movements except for back tilt which is really a function of how the camera opens. Because I use this camera only for field work (duh) I've never found the lack of back movements to be be a problem. I use lenses from a 65 mm f8 SA to a 300 mm Nikkor M and all on conventional lens boards. I will admit that the bellows is pretty squished with the 65 aboard but the lack of image circle with that lens has made movements moot anyway. I can release the front bed to make it drop so it getout of the way when I'm using the 65. With the 300 I've been able to do portraits and not have any bellows concerns at all. The Graflex lens board isn't very big, and while I haven't had any problems with mounting lenses, mine are all relatively small. If you had a really big lens like a 300 f5.6 it might not mount. All in all this is a great camera. Everytime a manufacturer reduces the number of movements I think it makes a more rigid camera. If you are thinking about gettting a metal field camera and can live without the missing movements then there is none better than this one, and they turn up regularly on eBay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dee_seegers Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 Garry, I've had a Horseman 45/FA for about a year and a half. It's my first and only view camera. It's well built, Stout, and I find the vertical to horizontal change to be easy. The only bad things I can think of about this camera is that the lens boards are expencesive, small, and limit the lenses that can be used on the camera. The detents for the movements are strong and make it difficult to achieve a slight amount of movement. The bellows is short, making it difficult to focus longer lenses to a closer distance. My longest lens is a 180mm and works fine. My next lens will be around 250mm and most likely a tele. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ed_candland1 Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 Garry,I started in LF last year and bought the Toyo AX. I have been very happy with it and would buy the same camera again. I also thought about the Wista VX but picked the Toyo because it had a tad more bellows and the lens sits a little higher off the deck so I fiqured it would be less likely to need the bed dropped on short lenses. BTW I live in Missouri half the time, (other half in Oklahoma because of work) on the south/west corner right next to Arkansas. If you'd like to get together sometime and go shooting just e-mail me. I've yet to find anyone here that shoots LF. Good luck, Ed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wayne_crider4 Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 After pouring over every spec and accessory on my quest to buy another 4x5 field I'd side with the Toyo A series or a Linhof V. The only thing that I have read that puts me off the older Tech's IV and III are the cams supposedly aren't interchangeable between cameras whereas with the V's they are. If you want to shoot by rangefinder you might consider this. I found this info at www.cameraquest.com under camera profiles; Scroll to the Tech area. Outside of those two, the Arca Discovery is probably the nicest monorail with the ability to upgrade to larger formats later. I use to live in Missery, I mean Missouri so I know the weather. If "metal" would swell it would be there as in Florida. If you need some more back movements you might ask those who own the woodies and see what they say. The Canham is nice but I'd go for the 5x7 with a 4x5 back if going that way. In the end most everyone I read raves about the Toyo, so what the heck. You can find them used at a pretty good price nowdays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
william_blunt Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 Garry,I live in MO and use wood cameras with no problem, Canham 5x7 wood, Wisner 4x10 tech, Zone VI and old Burke and James cameras thru the years and no problems with respect to temp changes or the humidity here.William Blunt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ed_candland1 Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 Willlam, Your in MO also. That makes 3 of us. Maybe we could get together sometime... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garry_teeple1 Posted February 13, 2003 Author Share Posted February 13, 2003 I want to thank everyone that comment. I had read all the previous post about field cameras and after reading these post, searching the internet, and looking at past photos I've taken I decided that the Wista VX is probably the best camera for my needs. On a side note, it looks like there are several people from the Missouri area. If there is any interest in a get together I would be willing to find a suitable location. I'm in the middle of the state so it could be about equal distances from any direction and neighboring states. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ed_candland1 Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 <<On a side note, it looks like there are several people from the Missouri area. If there is any interest in a get together I would be willing to find a suitable location.>> Sounds great Garry, I got your e-mail and I'd be up for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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