Good starter rangefinder?

[jean_taeza]

<p>I've been wanting to move into the rangefinder game; I've been shooting with SLRs + point and shoots and would love to experience shooting with a rangefinder. I've done some research and there are a lot of opinions and I would like some solid facts on finding a great, functional (and budget) rangefinder. I'm fine with 3rd body lenses and bodies, as I've seen that Leica can get very expensive.</p>

<p>Thanks!</p>

[henryp]

<p><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minolta_CLE">Minolta CLE</a><br>

Henry Posner<br /><strong>B&H Photo-Video</strong></p>

[Greg M]

<p>Any classic rangefinder system has some amount of added collectability value to it, so even systems such as Canon and Nikon are not cheap in any sense of the word.</p>

<p>Finding a nice, clean second hand Cosina Voigtlander R or R2 and a lens or two might be a good way to get your feet wet and see if it's anything you might have a real interest in exploring further.</p>

<p>There are fixed lens rangefinder options, such as those listed in the article link below that are good quality and relatively inexpensive compared to any interchangeable lens system..</p>

<p>https://cameraquest.com/com35s.htm</p>

[Greg M]

<p>This Olympus 35RD looks particularly nice..</p>

<p>http://www.ebay.com/itm/Olympus-35RD-35mm-Rangefinder-Camera-EX-Great-lens-/222075525662?hash=item33b4bb9a1e:g:zqgAAOSwgApXAwwY</p>

[woolly1]

How much do you want to spend?

 

How about a Voigtlander R2,3 or 4, or a Zeiss Ikon ZM (?), the R bodies come with auto or manual.

I had the ZM once and was delighted with it. Big bright vf and modern auto exposure. Only thing I was not keen on was

the sound of the shutter release - a bit "ringy". Only sold it due to the siren call of an M7.

[JDMvW]

<p>Film or digital?</p>

<p>For film there are classic 35mm RFs that do not have the inflated collector-based prices of the Leica.<br>

Leica thread-mount possibility: Canon VL, VL2, and P<br>

Contax bayonet mount (sort of): Contax IIa, Nikon S2, Kiev. The ex-Soviet Kievs are generally serviceable at least, and excellent at best. Some of the ex-Soviet lenses are superb and still bargains so long as more people don't find out about them. :|</p>

<p>Some of the simpler RFs can also be excellent: Canonets, Ricohs, and many others.</p>

<p>For digital, another story. Anything taking Leica bayonet-mount is not likely to be a bargain, for example.</p>

 

[Uhooru]

<p>One of Cosina Voigtlander Bessa R's are simple and very good at reasonable prices. Or for the funky RF experience, one of the Screw Mount Leicas, a IIIF comes to mind.</p>

[Lou_Meluso]

<blockquote>

<p>Cosina Voigtlander Bessa R's are simple and very good at reasonable prices.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>+1</p>

<p>or....</p>

<p>If you just want something good (brilliant, really) but inexpensive ($25-45) to see if RF's are your cup of tea try this one. You may never need another.</p><div></div>

[knut_schwinzer]

<p>Also quite a nice deal because of the ding:<br>

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Canon-P-Populaire-50mm-f-1-8-L39-LTM-Leica-Mount-Rangefinder-/162030916316?hash=item25b9cb92dc:g:7CEAAOSwoudW8TWO</p>

[SCL]

<p>Do you want one which has metering or barebones viewfinder, shutter speed selector, and aperture selection? Interchangeable lenses? Lots of goodies out there - and cheap! I just sold this one from my bursting at the seams collection last week.</p><div></div>

[aplumpton]

<blockquote>

<p>I'm fine with 3rd body lenses and bodies, as I've seen that Leica can get very expensive.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>This seems to suggest you want a system rangefinder camera. Older Canon or Leica bodies can adapt to several lenses. The III series Leicas are not expensive and fun to work with but their viewfinders are quite small and squinty without accessory VF (normally required in either case). Some 1950s and 60s Canons (Google them and their optics) are good. More modern reasonably priced RF cameras include the Minolta CLE and its lenses, the Konica RF interchangeable lens body and lenses, although both can be problematic for servicing/parts. The V-C rangefinders are a good experience, and some of their lenses are good Q/P ratio choices, like the classic 35mm f2.5 lens. The cameras may be a bit clunky but very good quality for the price. Check Cameraquest if new equipment interests you. An M4-2 or M4-P Leica is perhaps the most reasonable entry into relatively modern Leica RF cameras and excellent quality and these can be used with inexpensive (relatively) V-C lenses. A mint M4-2 with the V-C lens I mentioned should be available in mint condition at considerably less than 1500$ (still a lot, but not for Leica).</p>

[User_502260]

<p>Louis beat me to it. If you are just getting your feet wet then an RF camera with a fixed lens is a good start. These haven't been made for a while so not all of them are in good working order. For Konica I would recommend the Auto S2 which Louis showed. There was a later model called the Auto S1.6 with a slightly faster lens. Greg Weber (gweber@webercamera.com 402-721-3873) can supply you with a fully functioning model. Other nice fixed lens RFs? Canonet QL17/GIII or QL19/GIII, an Olympus 35RC or 35SP/35SPN, Minolta Hi-Matic 7SII, Hi-Matic 7S, Hi-Matic 9. These all have very sharp lenses. I would try Greg Weber for a Konica first. This way you know it will be working properly and you can concentrate on just taking pictures. </p>

[james_elwing]

<p>'... finding a great, functional (and budget) rangefinder. I'm fine with 3rd body lenses and bodies, as I've seen that Leica can get very expensive.'<br>

You can't get a system RF with ability to be built on too cheap. If you buy something that can sell at roughly the same price or better, that's the best you can do.<br>

Thus:<br>

What is called a 'beater' M3 or M2 in good working condition is reasonably priced. A 50mm or 35mm Leitz lens may cost more, though older 90 or 135 lenses are quite cheap. Older Leicas are working antiques, really; fun maybe & if you want that, A IIIa with clean 50mm Summar or Elmar can be economical. </p>

[dhbebb]

<p>all recommendations here are good but for maximum value it's "call me comrade"! a fed or zorki, model to choice, more modern or traditional, plus lens can be had for £40 and you can use the lens with your first leica later.</p>

[knut_schwinzer]

<p>Jean, still and forever "lots of opinions"!<br /> I don't know if anybody made the effort of looking at the link I posted beforehand:<br /> The Canon P is legendary, elegant, sturdy, comfortable, 1:1 finder, has useful framelines (35, 50, 100mm) And the 50mm 1.8 lens in LTM is great, too. You can mount virtually hundreds of different LTM lenses and have parallax comp. At under 200$ with shipping from Japan, hard to beat. Not shure about your import tax stuff, as I am in Europe. Don't have any relation with the seller, who for shure could make a donation to welfare as he reads this;)</p>

[dhbebb]

<p>knut, i saw your link but felt the camera was rather poor, especially the lens, with not only a dent but also internal haze and extensive balsam deterioration. a lens of this type in good condition is well worth having.</p>

[mukul_dube]

<p>To narrow down the options you must decide if you want interchangeable lenses and if you want a camera with a built-in meter.</p>

[mwmcbroom]

<p>Jean Taeza wrote:</p>

<blockquote>

<p>I'm fine with 3rd body lenses and bodies, as I've seen that Leica can get very expensive.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>I'm assuming that "3rd body" should read "3rd party." Perhaps, simply "makes other than Leica" would be more accurate.</p>

<p>I'm a bit surprised no-one here has mentioned the Contax G1/G2 system. I don't have any experience with it, but I've heard the lenses are great and that the G2 at least is a decent camera. Prices are good when compared to Leica.</p>

<p>There's another series of rangefinders I don't see mentioned here, and that is the Kodak Retina models, such as the IIc and IIIc. The selection of lenses is limited, with 35mm, 50mm, and 80mm the only available focal lengths. But they're cracking good lenses. And then there's the bigger Kodak rangefinder, the IIIS, which has a fairly large variety of lenses that were made for it, from 28mm to 200mm. Well, actually, the 200mm was made for the Retina Reflex, but it will mount on the IIIS, although scale focusing must be used. The IIIC/c and IIIS also have selenium cell meters, which may or may not still work.</p>

<p>Personally, I'm rather fond of the Canon rangefinder cameras, like the IIIa and IVSb, and even the later ones, especially the VI-T and the P. The lenses can be pricey, but they're usually quite a bit cheaper than their Leitz equivalents, although they are very respectable optics, in my experience.</p>

[knut_schwinzer]

<p>Lots of misunderstandings and good advice @ once.<br /> Some did not really read the OP before answering, but jumped for their own favorite.<br /> Let's see how Jean sees it...<br>

Jean? Hello - hello!!! Anybody out there? <br>

David-might be, but at that price?! To me it looks quite clean.<br /> Send it back if it doesn't appeal, no? Riskin'20 bucks.</p>

[wendell_kelly]

<p>Consider a Canon P with 50mm f1.8 Canon lens (or a Serenar, the earlier lens name).</p>

<p>You'll find a nice discussion of the camera and lens on both the Cameraquest website and on Dante Stella's site.</p>

[raghu_kuvempunagar]

Any of the fixed lens Fujica rangefinders (V2, 35ML, 35EE, 35SE, Compact Deluxe) should be a fine choice. They're quite cheap, easy to repair (that's what my local camera repair technician says), have good lens and well built.

[knut_schwinzer]

<p>Wendell, yes.</p>

[Lou_Meluso]

 

 

<blockquote>

<p>You'll find a nice discussion of the camera and lens on both the Cameraquest website and on Dante Stella's site.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Or stay right here on photo.net<a href="/classic-cameras-forum/00ZjJv"> HERE</a></p>

 

 

 

 

<p > </p>

 

[Wouter Willemse]

<p>Some time ago, the same curiosity struck me, and I got a Kiev-4a from eBay. It's far from perfect, but it's been a very cheap way to discover whether spending more on a serious rangefinder would suit me. So, as suggested before, the Russian cameras are worth exploring. Not the ultimate in reliability (my Kiev has a fair share of issues), but dirt cheap. And the Jupiter-8M I've got is actually a pretty good lens too.</p>

[rajmohan.]

<p>Some great advice/recommendations here.<br>

Speaking for myself, I've tried (in the $100 or below budget, which is where I was as a beginner RF user) Auto S2, Olympus RC35, Kiev 4A, Canonet QL17, Olympus XA - of these, my favorite for its combination of speed and ease of use, small size and good results is the RC35. Above $100, when I knew that RF-style shooting was for me, it became a different ballgame ...<br>

<strong>Louis</strong> - thank you for sharing the link to your detailed posts on the Canon P. I'm very tempted to take the plunge on one of these. Do you feel that the viewfinder and framelines in the P are better than those in the Canon 7 series? </p>