D600 Sensor Spots Appear Again - Any one with same issue

[ShunCheung]

<blockquote>

<p>Shaun almost every comment you post on this issue you downplay it and keep saying it's more than likely just owners looking at files at f/22 and "all DLSRs with have dust."</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Suggesting that I "downplay" the D600 dust issue is very unfair. I always tell people to check new D600 cameras out carefully and especially look for dust issues, but they should use apertures we commonly use rather than f22. If there are problems, do hold Nikon responsible and make sure that they either repair any problems or exchange for a new, trouble-free one.</p>

<p>Of course it is unrealistic to expect every D600 rolling out from the factory is perfect (Nikon could have done that, but at some totally prohibitive cost), but every D600 people own should at least be close to perfect. When it is not, be it the dust problem, AF problem, or whatever that is out of spec, make sure that you get Nikon to correct it.</p>

<blockquote>

<p>So you are on board with a photographer who owns one, maybe two, D600s but not a man you I'm sure handles more D600s in a week than any photographer will ever even see in their lifetime. Very strange.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Mike, have you paid attention to the chronological order of events?</p>

<ul>

<li>On 13th September, 2012, Nikon announced the D600 and started shipping them later on that month: http://www.photo.net/nikon-camera-forum/00aofD</li>

<li>Roger Cicala posted his article about the D600 dust/oil issue on 22nd October, 2012, barely a month since production D600 bodies became available. While Cicala suggests that there seems to be a (small) design flaw on the D600's shutter, at least on the early ones within the first months of availability, he never suggests that the D600 is something people should avoid.</li>

</ul>

<p><br />At least I am not aware of any updated information from Cicala since 10 months ago. Meanwhile, plenty of people have reported that the D600 they purchase in 2013 have no significant dust/oil issues that we need to worry about. (That is why whether Nikon understands the cause of this problem and, if necessary, takes corrective measure is important.) Even <a href="/photodb/user?user_id=3918599">Mike Plavchak</a> yourself has pointed out:</p>

 

<blockquote>

<p>I had my camera cleaned at the shop where I bought it because I had an upcoming wedding and did not have time to send it back to Nikon. So far the problem has not returned but I have not shot a lot of frames since the wedding.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>If all it takes is one cleaning (or even 2, 3 cleanings) at a camera store, and that is something most of us photographers can do ourselves, I indeed wonder what the big fuss is all about?<br>

Don't you see your own contradiction when you simultaneously claim that:</p>

<ul>

<li>would buy a D600 again and recommend it to friends</li>

<li>the D600 has a "design flaw" and "real problems," issues you can't stop talking about</li>

</ul>

[frgregory]

<p>My D600 Story: Purchased D600 with kit lens in May 2013, after 3 weeks spots appeared, after 4 weeks spots were massive. Like so many others, I sent the body to Nikon and received it back 3 weeks later with a new shutter mech and a cleaning. Out of the box, it still had spots, not as many as before, but definitely still there. Back to nikon for a second time, the D600 is returned after a week and half. All they did was repeat the cleaning. Again out of the box - SPOTS ARE STILL THERE! I call Nikon and ask for a supervisor and I ask for a product replacement. She tells me the camera needs to be evaluated, so back it goes a third time. The camera arrived at the service center yesterday and I am waiting to hear from them. <br>

My prior experience tells me not to hold my breath waiting for them to contact me. In the past, when I was promised someone would contact me they never did. Under no circumstances will they give you a direct number with an extension, or even and email address where a single person will help you solve the problem, or even know what the status of your repair is. Dealing with Nikon on this has been the worst customer service experience I have ever had.<br>

I have been a Nikon user since 1991 with a N4004. Since then I have owned a 990, D90, D7000, and now a D600. I wonder if anyone in upper management at Nikon realizes how much chatter there is online about this problem and about how bad their customer service is? Is the person incharge of this product line "older" and out of touch with the power of Social Media and the ability of customers to tell their story? Does Nikon realize - or even care - that they are ruining their reputation?<br>

One last thing - go ahead and try to add a negative review to the NikonUSA site for this product. It will not get through. I have tried three times and received a rejection. I have carefully read the guidelines and my review is well within them - I wrote about my experience with the product and added one photo that shows the problem. </p>

<p>I would not recommend this product to anyone, and I will be very reluctant to buy a nikon anything in the future.<br>

Greg</p>

[ShunCheung]

<p><a href="/photodb/user?user_id=1009195">Gregory Ortiz, </a>as I said, actual user experiences, positive or negative, is at least what I would like to see here. If I were in your situation, I would start pressuring Nikon to replace your D600 with a brand new one.</p>

<p>There is one more thing I can do. I'll bring this thread to Nikon's attention, especially Gregory's experience. Whether Nikon will do anything about it or not is up to them to decide. Again, I don't work for them nor for photo.net. I don't really care whether Nikon sells a lot of cameras or not, although as a customer, I would like to see a healthy Nikon. To me, what is important is that our photo.net members here receive good advices.</p>

[frgregory]

<p>Shun Cheung, any help you could provide bring this to Nikon's attention would be very appreciated. <br /><br />By the way your portfolio is stunning!<br /><br />Best,<br />Greg</p>

[donbright]

<p>Gregory,<br>

Your experience with D-600 issue is gut wrenching, as I continue to keep my eye on this issue because of my interest in the D-600 one can't help just to sit back, and wait for Nikon to get on top of this. It's my understanding with the D-600 that Nikon switched shutter box suppliers intern inheriting a design flaw via the new shutter causing the lubricant to move throughout places like the sensor surface creating a real mess unlike anything I've heard of with precision instruments. I'm wondering though amid the angst that goes with something like this, you would presume the issue is caused by a, ' Older' person. Perhaps its the opposite. Maybe the guys, and gals that made the F-series camera's need to step up, and show the way.</p>

[frgregory]

<p>Don and everyone else,<br>

No offense intended with the "older" reference in my post. At 56 years old and a card carrying AARP member, I consider myself to be "older" My point was sometimes people become unaware of how things have changed and they cannot control the narrative because of the power of the internet. I wrote that because it seems odd to me that a leading edge company like Nikon would allow their reputation to take such a beating over an issue like this. They can suppress the reviews on NikonUSA.com, but take a look at the reviews on Amazon, B&H, Adoroma, Abes of Maine, DPReview.com and, of course here. The cat is out of the bag! The Nikon response of ignoring it makes me wonder if they even know what is happening on-line.<br /><br />I agree about bringing back the F-series team to handle this!</p>

<p>Greg</p>

[ShunCheung]

<p>Ok, I just sent an e-mail to my contacts at Nikon USA. However, please don't expect miracles. I am just another Nikon customer like many of you are.</p>

<p>Again, Greg, if I were you, I would expect nothing less than a trouble-free, perfectly working D600 body. After 2, 3 repair attempts, you should be talking about a complete replacement.</p>

<p>And I hope people know that when the F5 was new back in 1996, it had a serious battery indicator problem. A friend of mine bought two back then, and both F5 required multiple repairs. Eventually Nikon replaced one of them with a brand new one after several repairs over 2, 3 years. I waited a year before I bought my F5 in late 1997, and my has been great. The difference is that the F5 had an 8-year product cycle. Today, electronics are "old" after 2, 3 years.</p>

<p>Between a friend and me, we had several F4 from 1989, 1990 and 1992. He found out that Nikon had made something like 8 minor changes on the F4 from 1989 to 1992, and my 1990 version had like 3 out of the 8. E.g., the 1992 F4 requires two clicks to remove the viewfinder so that it would be much harder to remove it unintentionally. In other words, even back in the Nikon F to F6 era, they gradually improved the cameras. It was not like Nikon just got everything right immediately.</p>

[Hemant Deshmukh]

<p>Hi Fellow photographer/Nikon Lovers,<br>

With respect to every member's comments and views I just want to update status on my D600.<br>

- Just now saw Nikon shipped my camera back ( A nice surprise from last experience where I had to send 12 emails and 10 calls for 3 weeks)<br>

- When I checked status on my Camera yesterday. It was showing status as B2( Moderate repair/ Major parts replacement). I am assuming this means shutter assembly change as last time. If thats is the case the then surely I have problem with this D600. How can part malfunction after 4 weeks of repair.<br>

- I will update all of you once I see my camera on Friday ( I am out of town).<br>

- I love my D600. These issues are just making me jittery and anxious ( $2800 with lens kit on stake that's a big money for me to spent on a hobby)<br>

- Loved Nikon my entire life staring from FM to last D50 I owned.<br>

Shun, please do influence Nikon with these issues and hope to get resolution very soon.<br>

Will keep you posted on progress on coming weeks.</p>

 

[donbright]

<p>It's hard to imagine todays electronics are old after 2-3 years, or hard to accept, and I'm not disputing this, If that's true, and I don't have the means to know, that plays right into the built in obsolescence that we all hear about from time to time. I'm not reporting this to rub salt into any wounds here, but as an avid Nikon lover I still own and use my, F3HP, FA, and the later FM3a. I still use these camera's! Laugh if you will, but whats going on here? The F3, and FA have had their CLAs, and the FM3a is ready at this time. They just work! I'm not a heavy shooter, but not light either. I got the F3 in 1984, and the FA in 1985, the FM3a in 2005. I use the camera's, they work never, ever! an issue with mechanical, or electrical break down. I hope I didn't jinx myself now by announcing this. Yes, I think companies everywhere need to re-think what it is their doing with their products. Maybe I've just been lucky.</p>

[chris_lindsey]

<p>So I got into digital photography with a D-40. Moved up to a D-90 and received a D-5000 with the purchase of a 70-200mm lens I bought to shoot a family wedding. None of these had the dust/oil issues that my D-7000 and D-600 have had.<br>

Both of these cameras have increased my love of image making. I have read time and again about sending cameras to the manufacturer to have a sensor cleaning with minimal results. I soon realized that for the cost of sending them both in, I could buy a sensor cleaning kit.<br>

I researched on line, saw all the warnings and the few tutorials of how to do it. Finally I made the leap and spend just a few hundred dollars. I now clean both my camera sensors every month or so. I have no more oil or dust issues with either camera and continue to enjoy the images I make with them.<br>

If you really like the camera and results it you produce with it, this is an easy work around.</p>

[ShunCheung]

<p>As expected, Nikon politely acknowledged that they have received my e-mail, with a link to this thread. How they deal with it (or not deal with it) is up to them to decide. Unfortunately, I don't have any magic wand that I can just wave and all of a sudden, all of our camera problems are fixed; it simply does not work that way.</p>

<p>And I hope that people realize that in some occasions, photographer self sensor cleaning cannot fix some issues. Sometimes even after Nikon replaces the shutter/mirror box, some problem persists. I have no statistic on how many D600 belong to that category, but personally, I wouldn't hesitate to buy a D600 today, although I think Nikon should put a better AF system, more suitable for FX, on it. In case you run into a lemon D600, make sure Nikon fix or replace it properly. There is absolutely no reason that one should accept a defective DSLR, be it a D600 or some Canon ....</p>

<p>To Hermant and Greg, I am afraid that there isn't much more I can do. Just keep in mind that there are plenty of fine D600 cameras out there. The one you currently have may be beyond repair, but there is no reason that you are not using one that is trouble free. It probably will require some more frustration on your part to get there.</p>

[frgregory]

<p>I have an update: yesterday a senior manager for customer service <strong>called me</strong> and apologized that my case had not been properly escalated. She told me that she would would have a Japanese Technician look at my camera. When I asked for a product replacement, she told me that since it is in for dust, it is environmental, and they don't replace products for that. Since I was thrilled just to have her attention, I did not argue the point, and decided to wait to hear what Japanese tech finds. Having said that, Nikon replaced the shutter mechanism - which can't be cheap - which is clearly a defect in workmanship, not environmental. My concern is that the spots that remain on my camera after 2 cleaning are actually damage to the low-pass filter from the "dust"/oil/lubricant from the shutter mechanism. The user manual stresses that the low-pass filter is "delicate and easily damaged"<br>

So dust is their story and they are sticking with it. Thank you Shun Cheung, a day after your email I received this call, perhaps unrelated, but it is nice to finally receive some response for a defective product that costs $2k. </p>

<p> </p>

[ShunCheung]

<blockquote>

<p>Thank you Shun Cheung, a day after your email I received this call, perhaps unrelated, but it is nice to finally receive some response for a defective product that costs $2k.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Please do not thank me. I have no idea whether the call you received from a Nikon senior manager has anything to do with my e-mail to Nikon, bringing this thread to their attention.</p>

<p>However, it is Nikon's responsibility to make sure that their products are not defective. I don't expect every D600 rolling out from the factory to be 100% defect free; otherwise, we could be talking about a $20,000 camera instead of $2000, but Nikon certainly can correct defective ones after sales.</p>

[donbright]

<p>Gregory,<br>

So they replaced the shutter that caused the oil, and dirt issue that contaminated the low pass filter, but now you are stuck with a damaged low pass filter? Is there any indication they would also fix the damaged filter in spite of what the user manual says, I don't think the user manual was written anticipating that there was a built in flaw to the shutter that inadvertently caused the end result issue, which is degradated images. This just seems so awful to me, although like you, I'm glad to see Nikon respond, still its on them to provide a product you paid for that does what its supposed to do. I don't see that happening.</p>

[ShunCheung]

<blockquote>

<p>So they replaced the shutter that caused the oil, and dirt issue that contaminated the low pass filter, but now you are stuck with a damaged low pass filter?</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Don, Gregory only mentions that he has concerns that there may be damage on his D600's low pass filter. That is very different from he is actually "stuck with a damaged low pass filter." Of course I haven't seen his D600, but I kind of doubt that his low pass filter is indeed damaged, but in case it is, I am sure he can get Nikon to fix that (or better yet, get Nikon to replace it with a new one). One way or another, he won't be stuck with any damage.</p>

<p>Let's not get carried away.</p>

<p>I have cleaned quite a few DSLRs' sensors/low pass filters. As long as you clean it with care, it is not easy to damage them at all. The language Nikon uses (on their web site) is typical lawyer disclaimers. Whether you like it or not, sensor cleaning is part of DSLR ownership. You can do that yourself or pay someone else to clean it for you. Therefore, those low pass filters are designed to take a fair amount of reasonable cleaning.</p>

[donbright]

<p>Shun,<br>

That's encouraging, Thank you. It does make sense that the sensor would, or should withstand proper technique in cleaning, using the proper materials.<br>

I hope that my mere insistence in trying to understand the precise issues pertaining to the D-600 isn't creating more confusion, as I am actually on the precipice of purchasing a D-600, and I'm vigorously assessing the issue to discern its realities. I'm hoping, if the oil issue is a real one, that it is constrained to the first run production, which intern indicates the problem is confined.</p>

[Hemant Deshmukh]

<p>Hi All,<br>

Wanted to update you all. My camera was back from service with sensor and low pass filter cleaned. Images did not show any issues. To my surprise camera was never checked for hot shoe issue. On top of that Nikon sent me an estimate to repair my flash ( USD102 for SB 400, flash) for perfectly fine working flash. I used my camera for local NPS CLS work shop and the instructor was also acknowledged some issue with command control system and hotshoe.<br>

With great disappointment I called up Nikon and Costco. Nikon as usual wants my camera back ( 3rd time) with replacement request letter. Costco had taken up my issue with Nikon warranty dept. I am hoping to have this resolved soon.<br>

D600 is a great disappointment for me.</p>

[ShunCheung]

<blockquote>

<p>Wanted to update you all. My camera was back from service with sensor and low pass filter cleaned. Images did not show any issues. To my surprise camera was never checked for hot shoe issue. On top of that Nikon sent me an estimate to repair my flash ( USD102 for SB 400, flash) for perfectly fine working flash. I used my camera for local NPS CLS work shop and the instructor was also acknowledged some issue with command control system and hotshoe.<br /> With great disappointment I called up Nikon and Costco. Nikon as usual wants my camera back ( 3rd time) with replacement request letter. Costco had taken up my issue with Nikon warranty dept. I am hoping to have this resolved soon.<br /> D600 is a great disappointment for me.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Hemant, your story suggests that Nikon's repair department is doing a very poor job (not merely bad job), i.e. not fixing a hot shoe problem that was apparently fine before their first repair, and they want to charge you to fix a working SB-400 .... Your D600 purchase may have led to some very bad experience; however, the current problem is not really the D600 per se.</p>

[frgregory]

<p>Update to my D600 saga: I received my D600 back today after the third visit to the Nikon service center, I'm pleased to say that my camera is as good as new!<br>

So to recap, I experienced massive spots after six weeks and about 3,000 clicks on a new D600. The first time the body was sent in for warranty service the shutter mechanism was replaced, and the camera was cleaned. When it was returned to me there were still about a dozen spots visible on the sensor/low-pass filter. I called Nikon and sent it to them a second time, and when I received it back it was no different then when I sent it in. The service order indicated that they cleaned it a second time - though now I wonder if that is true. After having my camera returned to me twice with significant spots present, I asked to speak with a supervisor and I asked for a product replacement.<br>

I was issued a THIRD return authorization for the same problem. Last week the senior custom service manager called me and promised the camera would be looked at by "a Japanese tech" and the problem would be resolved. She was insistent that I was experiencing an environmental issue, for which they do not issue product replacements, and the camera would be satisfactory when returned, which it is.<br>

My observations: Nikon is hurting their reputation in this VERY competitive market by sticking with the environmental dust story. Clearly, you do not replace a shutter mechanism (at great expense) for environmental dust. The source of the problem, be it oil, lubricant, or some other material, is hard to remove. The self-cleaning function of the camera does nothing to help this issue. To those who have proposed that we should accept that DSLR owners should accept that cleaning the sensor is part of ownership, I say the pros at Nikon had a hard time cleaning mine of whatever this is; what are the chances that an untrained consumer could successfully master this? <br>

Having said this, I love this camera. The D600 is a GREAT design and concept! The execution and manufacture is the issue. I was thinking about what would happen if my camera was not successfully cleaned. I looked at the Canon 6D and was not pleased with how it measured up to the specs of my D600, and the thought of changing all of my gear, six lenses and two speed lights, to Canon was not appealing.<br>

If anyone at Nikon is listening: we love your cameras and lenses; we have been loyal customers. It's not the "crime", it's the cover-up that brings people (and companies) down. We already know there is problem. Do the right thing. Take care of the people who have spent their hard earned money on your products. Most of us have spent this money for a hobby we love, and we are loyal to YOUR brand. We are not pros, and we don't have a lot of leverage, we're just the men and women who buy your stuff and keep you in business. We would like you to care about us as much as we care about cameras, lens, speed lights and our passion for this art.</p>

 

[Hemant Deshmukh]

<p>Hi All,<br>

Update on My D600 saga.<br>

A very good news for me. Nikon has finally replaced my D600 with new body. Really appreciate this gesture from Nikon. Finally it ends with a good note.<br>

I was very happy with the way case was handled by last supervisor at Nikon Service. I had great help from Costco Concierge on followup with Nikon and weekly updates to me. <br>

Shun: Thanks to you for forwarding thread to Nikon. I am sure this played some part in the whole episode.<br>

I am hoping to do the test run this weekend.<br>

Thanks all for your support and suggestions. It helps and system works.<br>

Hemant</p>

<p> </p>

[ShunCheung]

<blockquote>

<p>Shun: Thanks to you for forwarding thread to Nikon. I am sure this played some part in the whole episode.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Again, all I did was sending an e-mail to my contacts with Nikon and their PR firm, providing them a link to this very thread. And as expected, they politely acknowledged that they got my e-mail. For one thing it wasn't all that much work from my part, and it is not clear to me whether that actually helped either Memant or Gregory. Therefore, I don't want to take any credit when none is due. However, I would only send such e-mail to Nikon when there is a serious problem and especially somewhat wide spread. (So far I might have done so once a year or maybe once every two years, on the average.) If I sent such e-mail 2, 3 times a month, eventually they would ignore me.</p>

<p>It is very much in Nikon's own interest to resolve your issue fairly quickly. After 2, 3 warranty repairs, their cost on that particular unit is going to pile up. It is much easier for them to give you a new unit without any issues, and let them figure out how the refurbish ones that have difficult issues.</p>

[frgregory]

<p>So here is the final update to my D600 saga:<br>

In September, after returning my D600 to Nikon three times, I received it in good working order.<br>

That was short lived. In November a large number of spots reappeared. I called the service center and requested to speak to a supervisor, I asked for product replacement again since this is the fourth service call for the same problem. I was told "a new camera would not be possible and my D600 can and will be repaired". Nikon replaced the shutter for the second time, cleaned the camera for the fourth time, and return the camera to me in mid-November. <br>

In February significant spots appeared, making this the fifth problem. I called and escalated yet again. This time Nikon replaced the D600 with a D610.<br>

I also opened a complaint against Nikon with the New York State Consumer Protection Agency and the New York Better Business Bureau, and upload the complaints to the Nikon Service center website. Did that help get a replacement or did Nikon just finally decide to do the right thing for a customer? <br>

Call me a skeptic, but I wonder if Nikon knows the lawyers are circling, and that is the reason for replacing cameras now. At least two law firms are currently collecting information and potential clients for a class action against Nikon. (Morgan & Morgan and Lieff Cabraser Heimann & Bernstein). I have a friend who is an attorney and has defended companies in class action law suits; he told me the law firm that can certify a class in the D600 defect may well collect 7 figures in legal fees in addition to whatever they recover for D600 owners. That is much better incentive for Nikon than customer satisfaction. <br>

</p>