Thinking of quitting... What's the point?

[elle_m]

<p>I'm sure a lot of established photographers are feeling this way these days, with a sudden influx of "uncle bobs" taking it "pro."<br /> However, I've only been doing this for a few years, and I'm beginning to wonder if there's even a point in making the effort.<br /> Let me explain why...</p>

<p>First, a bit about myself so you can understand what type of photographer I am since, as I've mentioned in the past, I don't really feel comfortable posting photos of my clients in an online forum.</p>

<p>I'm a professional commercial and editorial photographer, but I enjoy photographing weddings and portraits and, quite frankly, with the magazine industry dying, I kind of saw this as being my final destination in my photography journey. They are also convenient based on my current living situation.</p>

<p>I am not a so-called "Uncle Bob" I have spent a lot of time and money making sure I offer a HIGH END product. If anything, my goal is to offer photography that would be viewed as editorial-quality, and I think I'm at that point, though there is always, ALWAYS room for growth.</p>

<p>I am NOT "The Best" photographer. I know that. I have no delusions of grandeur. But, if I'm going to be honest, and if I'm going to believe my mentors, I am a good photographer. I don't care if that sounds conceited. I'm eager for my next family shoot or wedding to see what new exciting photos I can get... to see how much better I can be. This is my passion.</p>

<p>My photography: I offer clean, emotive docu-style photographs. A few of mentors and/or inspiration include Jose Villa, Kate Headley, Still Motion, Jeff Ascough and Jasmine Star. CREATIVELY, I approach every family shoot or wedding like it was shoot for an editor or art director, but of course with fewer amenities, and of COURSE with the family's desires in mind.</p>

<p>Now onto my discouragement...<br /> Over the past few weeks, I've really started to market my services. Business has been slow. I've had a lot of feedback, but the response is ALWAYS, "your work is amazing, but we don't want to pay that much." This has taken me a bit by surprise. I have raised my prices slightly this season, but only enough so that I can start actually making a decent profit. The last few years I was just breaking even. And I'm even including some CHEAPER options in new areas. I completely re-worked my budget so that I COULD offer less expensive options.</p>

<p>So I did a little sleuthing. I always have my finger on the pulse of the photo industry in my town (it's a pretty small town, capping at about 80,000 I think), and it is bustling. Every week there's a new "professional photographer" advertising their services somehow. There are a handful of good ones -- photographers I admire, whose work I, personally, would be proud off. I would hire them. I view these as my creative competition.</p>

<p>The 70-80 OTHER photographers, are not. They are O.K. (and I'm being generous). Lots of poorly exposed/composed shots, over-editing -- student stuff that mimics pro stuff. Maybe people can't tell the difference?</p>

<p>The thing is, after a bit of this recent research, I've discovered I'm actually considerably CHEAPER than my handful of favs. and only SLIGHTLY more expensive than the O.K. photographers... in some cases, I'm actually cheaper than them in the long run.</p>

<p>So what is the point? I've worked my budget... and re-worked it some more... trying to find ways to make a profit and charge less. I've had some people ask me to shoot their engagement photos for $100. I've done it, since they were friends, of friends, but I didn't tell them that I made about $5 an hour after all was said and done. I shot a few weddings for $500 and made zero dollars (assistant/2nd shooter: $250; travel expenses, extra back-up gear, insurance, gas etc: $300). For reference, my weddings don't go above $3000 and they don't go below $900. My portrait photography is the same type of ratio, but under $300.</p>

<p>I don't know what people are expecting when they email me... "Oh yes, it's only $50 for a 3 hour family shoot, plus countless hours of post work so the images have that style and feel you want to hire me for..."</p>

<p>Sure I could pump out lesser quality work faster, for maybe a bit less, but that's not the kind of photographer I want to be. I want to offer GREAT work. So there is no point. If people want mediocre for a perceivable cheaper price, then...</p>

<p>Well, I'm seriously considering giving up my studio...</p>

[Jerry_]

<p>As I turn 65 in 2011, my business will likely cease. The maybe-customers who call for a wedding quote do not care about good or bad photography, they are seeking <strong>a garage-sale price</strong> for their wedding. [i do a fair amount of business with the local high school parents -- save a group of cheerleader parents, who are content with one mom's work with whatever camera and lens she has to use. Have you ever seen a tumbling cheerleader image taken with a Panasonic LX-series camera?]</p>

<p>Studio expenses continue for you, and if you do not have a steady flow of income, you may be making the right choice.</p>

<p>Good luck.</p>

 

[MichaelChang]

<p>Elle, a competitive and evolving market place is the challenge for any business. My suggestion is, if you love this line of work more than any alternative, then persevere and think of a better way to be competitive.</p>

<p>Study how others do it even outside your domain: why do people lineup around the block to buy iPads, why are seemingly better cars market failures, etc.</p>

<p>You won't see results immediately because marketing innovation is not forecastable so it'll take some trial and error, but stick with it and you'll see results to learn from.</p>

<p>Just remember that success is a process. Not an event.</p>

[picturesque]

<p>Hi Elle. About the worst place to be right now, if you are an up and coming wedding photographer, is that spot right above the rest of the cheaper offerings, and below the higher ones. This is because the 'going rate' for wedding photography is inching downward. Before the big downturn in the economy, that spot I just mentioned was a good spot to be in because you could 'clean up' on the folks not wanting to spend $3000 but who still wanted good photography. Now, those same folks don't even want to spend $1000 and are willing to look at the photographers in the 'cheap section'.</p>

<p>These prices, of course, are dependent to a degree, on where you are located. In a smaller town, the prices may be less, the competition sharper and more defined, and it is harder to break into the circle of established photographers charging more.</p>

<p>You've already figured out where you are in relation to the other photographers you are competing against in your area, but have you figured out how your photography/offerings stack up against them? If you are turning out photography that is on a level with the higher priced photographers, but not a lot different, you don't have much of a tool to convince customers to choose you. So if you go that route, the time honored advice would be to differentiate--in style, package, product and even one's personal charisma or beliefs, and you have to get that message out to customers. If you've already raised your prices, I'd ask how long it has been since you raised them? These things take time, and your booking rate will suffer before it gets better, although the new wrinkle is the economy.</p>

<p>The latest (and oldest) marketing advice is to network like crazy with vendors. This has always worked in the past and will still work now, but the simple fact is, every would be photographer is doing the same thing. So while you shouldn't skip this, it isn't the one path to success. Another similar piece of advice is to network like crazy on social networks. I'm sure it works to a degree, like vendor networking, but again--everyone and his brother is doing it too.</p>

<p>Otherwise, you might consider marketing outside your immediate area, if you think things are better for you in the nearest big city, for instance.</p>

<p>I hope Marc Williams and William W. will post with the kind of sound and experienced advice they often give on marketing matters. In fact, let me ask them right now... :^)</p>

[starvy]

<p>I think you are making too much effort. These are hard times. Any business that is to survive must provide a better and cost effective service. You need to cut down on that $900 expenditure to cover a wedding. If you are being paid $3000 then there is no need to cut. However, if you are being paid $500, you provide a service that does not cost you above $250. Those who are hiring uncle Bob are not looking for quality. Your aunt Sheila needs to understand that and provide an adequate service that pays for you to be in the profession. Ditch the second shooter for such events.</p>

[theresa_skutt]

<p>If it doesn't pay the bills, supplement it. If it's your passion, you won't be ABLE to quit.<br>

McDonalds doesn't have a great product, but they have marketing that has put their business over the moon. Take a break, if need be, if you're like me, it is in your blood and quitting doesn't work. </p>

[neilambrose]

<blockquote>

<p>...I've discovered I'm actually considerably CHEAPER than my handful of favs. and only SLIGHTLY more expensive than the O.K. photographers... in some cases, I'm actually cheaper than them in the long run.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>I suspect this is the heart of your problem. From what you say you appear to be insufficiently differentiated on product and price.</p>

<p>Your prices are not close enough to the high end of the market to benefit from value association. Your product is too similar to your competitors so that your offering degrades from price comparison. Both work against you, usually by bringing you prospects who are incorrectly targeted for the service you want to offer.</p>

<p>The strategic solution would be to set a wide barrier of differentiation. Consider what you would have to do if you wanted to make your prices three times higher than the average for your area, and your product five times better (or more different) than the average for your area. Then consider the marketing channels you would need to use if you wanted to reach clients looking for a higher than average product and service.</p>

<p>It helps to be different in as many ways as you can. If you offer magazine quality work then make sure your marketing reflects it. Delete the blog and replace it with a magazine, for example. Show your work as you want it to be seen, and you'll attract clients who are interested in what you want to sell.</p>

<p>If you want to offer a high-end service then by definition you should not be targeting the mass market. This means if you're doing the same style work, or offering the same books, or saying the same things as everyone else then you are failing to differentiate. Pretty much all the people you listed as inspiration achieved their success by running in the opposite direction to everyone else. Suggest you need to think where your competitors are going, and what 'opposite' looks like from that place.</p>

<p>I would suggest you don't consider quitting just yet, since it doesn't sound like you're tired of being a photographer. Your situation is easy to fix because it's a simple marketing problem, rather than a case of total disenchantment with photography.</p>

[bobcossar]

<p>Hi Elle......I have found that a 'shotgun" approach to marketing does not work, if you are seeking the higher end clientelle.<br>

My advice is to market to the client base you want to get. Upscale marketing is very different from a general appeal......consider gallery showings, wine and cheese presentations, by invitation only etc. These things will work if you persevere....even in an 80,000 people community.<br>

There is always an eager market for quality.....you want a Porsche 911? There is a <strong>waiting list</strong> to get one. Kias are freely available. So what do you want to produce and sell? Make that desision and martet with focus to that audience.......Regards, Robert</p><div></div>

[david_schilling___chicago_]

<p>You sound as if you're serious about the business but I wonder..... You do not have a bio or a website on your P-net membership page and you don't use your real name and location for your posts. Thus you're losing potential marketing and networking benefits. If you're successful with your commercial & editorial work then you only need to supplement with weddings and portraits seems like it all should work together. The reluctance to promote your work by posting client images online seems more related to your personal feelings rather than a savvy business sense.</p>

<p>As Nadine mentions, pricing yourself in the middle is a difficult place to be. You can't expect potential clients to recognize the differences in quality between you and shooters charging 20-35% less. Marketing requires a different skill set than shooting. Are you networked in PPA and/or WPPI? Have you considered the potential investment in marketing offered by the Marathon folks? My first suggestion is to shave off the "countless hours" that you're spending doing post-work......</p>

<p>I'll agree that the market is tight and that many talented shooters are making a good deal less than most truck drivers which is why I gave up the full time aspirations to return to my primary career and now just do photography at my leisure "on the side".</p>

[paul_armes]

<p>Elle,<br>

I am glad you made this post. You are not alone and the response’s made here, I have personally found very interesting. My 2 cents is in some respect you are right. Client's can’t tell the difference, at least not the client's you are entertaining at the moment. This is exactly the same as me. I came from a franchise portrait company here in the UK which is produces great high end work at high end prices (£1000+ for a 30x20).<br>

In the past 3 years over 30 of the 80 odd studios in the UK have closed (including where I was) and more are following. The main reason is the main bulk of people who use the studios do not have the money nor see the difference between what they produce and what is sold around the corner for a quarter of the price and a tenth of the quality and there just are not enough people that can afford the products in the area each studio is allowed to advertise in. The mass market has a very very poor perception of value for photography, made ever worse by the £200 point and shoot cameras that promise the buyer wonders and the ‘craigslist’ shooters I hear about all the time. Clients just don't get what we do. Unless we all start to educate them.<br>

I battled for 3+ years trying to sell these high end products rambling on about the benefits, the quality of the print, the paper, the processing etc till I was blue in the face. 90% of the time, they just did not care...to them it was a piece of paper, a sheet of glass, four bits of wood, which was a quarter of the price around the corner.<br>

You’re aiming at the wrong people; go further, you need a massive area to get enough of the clients you are after. The population you have is not likely to cut it. In this current climate, price is everything to a mass market. Don't rely on just unique products, the majority of the mass market won't see the difference, maybe some will, but it doesn’t mean they can justify the cost between you and a competitor. I know it may seem like you are banging your head against a brick wall right now, as I said I am in the same situation.<br>

I am getting through it by looking at other options of making profits on each wedding I get and past weddings I’ve shot. Call up past clients and mention your portrait services. Push the selling of prints from you weddings to other family members by announcing the online gallery details in small flyers you can leave on tables at the reception. As the saying goes; worker smarter not harder.<br>

Bookings for many will decrease in these current times, while clients go for cheaper options. You need to look at how to make the most out of what you've got. Keep developing your products, that’s good! Just hang in there until people start to have more cash available. If you can survive by digging deep in a recession, imagine the profits that you can attain when the system sorts itself out.<br>

Good luck.</p>

<p> </p>

[peter_kervarec]

<p>Elle , thank you for putting your thoughts down. Unfortunately with the advent of digital cameras and the technology available, anybody thinks that they can do a wedding successfully and thats not true as we know. Your letter could be a template for established photographers worldwide. People want to pay much less ( for what is a huge responsibility ) and are having friends and relatives with a "good camera" photograph their wedding. There is seemingly no answer and I have also noticed here in Australia that there is virtually double the amount of photographers in each annual phone directory but the population may have only increased by 1 or 2 %.<br>

One of the main issues that is a very hard to get across to clients is the time, effort and research required for post production work. People only focus on what they see on the day, a photographer taking photos. Everybody is taking photos everywhere so it cheapens us as professional photographers. Not that long ago, say ten years, I remember being out and about and hardly seeing anyone with a camera. Now walk around anywhere where there are people and notice the amount of photographs being taken, amazing.<br>

Its very hard to be forced into giving up something that you obviously love and are passionate about.<br>

Good Luck<br>

Peter</p>

[stp]

<p>I'm not a pro, just an average photographer and a consumer. Some people want the cheapest, and other people want the best. Both are judged, at least initially by price. The prices you have set have made you the worst choice for those looking for the cheapest, and not among the best (as determined by price). You need to tell those who are looking for the best that you are among the best, and you do this by having prices that compare to theirs. Now that your foot is in the door, you become competitive by having a superb portfolio (and a superb marketing plan).</p>

[Member69643]

<p>The situation used to be that people didn't generally have a "good" camera - if they had one at all it was good enough for snapshots, but when they had an important event come up they'd pop for a pro, knowing he'd be able to get a vastly superior picture. Not any more. Now everyone has a camera that takes pretty good pictures, and more than a few of those know someone with a really great camera who'll do those special event.</p>

<p>Photography as a profession is dying.</p>

[bobcossar]

<p>Speak for yourself, Wolf........</p>

[chris_waller]

<p>I've just come from flicking through the supplement magazine to my Sunday newspaper and there is a portrait in there of a famous singer. The photograph is amateurish and I cannot understand why the editor chose it. I think one of the problems these days is that people can't tell good from bad photography.</p>

[caleb_santos]

<p>At every wedding I shoot, one of those "uncle bob"s comes up to me and ask about my huge white lens. They shoot in fully auto mode with a variable aperture zoom lens and the popup flash. I have to kindly ask, "get out of my way fool." Oh, that wasn't a question. <br>

Photographing weddings and family portraits is very personal. Business isn't "business". This is more like an inter-personal business relationship. Women do exceptionally well at marketing this "business" because they are naturally better at socializing with brides and families. Men are always trying to size each other up for some reason. All of my business has come from a network of women talking to other women, and finally contacting my female business partner. <br>

Starting out I wanted to keep my prices low. I was realistically charging a price I thought my work was worth, which was not much. I was never trying to under-cut some big professional's higher prices. I was just charging what was fair. Also, I view photography as a very sincere service. It's one thing to mess up someone's haircut as a barber, or leave spilled trash on the sidewalk as a garbage-man, but taking someone's photo is precious and sincere. I wanted anyone to afford high quality photos. That's why I have an unlisted bottom of the barrel price bracket. If the given date is not booked within a month or 2 of the event, I make sincere efforts to meet my client's budget. I don't care how small their budget is. I'll take $200 to spend 2 hours at the ceremony so they can get at least SOME nice photos. <br>

Where to market yourself.... low, mid, high, untouchable... Well, as I said, I started out low to mid. To increase profits I simply increased my prices and offer now much fancier and costlier products. wow, it's not rocket science. 1700, 2400, 3200, 4500. No one has ordered the 4500 dollar package yet. Will anyone ever? I don't care. I just did a wedding today for $500. It was a dear friend of mine and between her and her new husband they are quite popular. She and her man are extreeeemely beautiful people. What I gained in marketing, advertisement, and networking far outweighed the "work" I did today. Oh wait, I finished the night drinking champagne, eating cake, and flirting with very hot eligible bachelorettes. Regardless this being my friend's wedding, I usually get very close and personable with the B&G and have alot of fun at their wedding festival. Free food, free cake, free alcohol.... and you're getting paid to have fun. <br>

I don't know if you started this thread looking for pity or encouragement or something other. But from what I gather you probably should let it go. <br>

I will offer a short story. I was in the grocery store last spring and an older gentlemen had a small table set up in a busy corner of the store. He had some framed portraits on display and was asking folks passing by if they would like to sign up for family portraits for the easter holiday. He must have been associated with the store manager somehow and had set up his studio in the management office in the 2nd story of the grocery store. So, I stopped by to take a look at his display. From a quick glance I noticed 1 photo of 3 children sitting 1 behind the other and the child sitting in front was outside the field of focus. It was easy to notice being an 11x14 print. Well, I was polite to the guy and spoke to him a little bit, but suddenly he started to haggle me! I agreed to put my name down on his contact sheet, but without realizing it I had somehow guaranteed myself to be his customer and he promptly asked me for my credit card number. I was quite shocked. I had to find a way out of the situation without being rude, but the man became very agitated and grumbled, "If you sign up you have to pay the deposit!" I said, I couldn't commit to the date for which he slotted me and I quickly walked away after a brief nod or hand wave. Later that week my business partner and I bought several bunny rabbits and had a fabulous live bunny easter portrait session. Clients were showing up who we had no idea even KNEW about our bunny portrait session. I guess some lady at the local women's exercise club loved the idea of having her kids photographed with real bunny rabbits and told all her friends about it. It was a lot more fun than being haggled at the grocery store for out of focus portraits with outdated backgrounds from the 1980's. Some folks don't understand the meaning of the word "classic". <br>

I agree with Robert Cossar. If so many photographers are cropping up so quickly, then the profession of photography is flourishing like never before. The trick is being that "someone with a really great camera who'll do those special [events]." That's called marketing :D I rest my case. </p>

[fotografz]

<p>Elle, <em>"if you can't beat them ... quit."</em> isn't the idiom ... It's <em>"join them."</em></p>

<p>If you're thinking of quitting, then join the higher-end shooters ... or surpass them in price. Become very selective as to what you show on-line, be very self-confident in your presentation and not overly enthusiastic like a star struck beginner willing to do anything to get the job. invest in a killer high-end album sample.</p>

<p>If you are thinking of quitting, what do you have to lose? It's no different if a clients says they love your work but can't afford $1,500. or can't afford $4,000. However, you only have to sign a few high end weddings to make $, and it gets you out of the $500. rat race. If it doesn't work, so what? ... you were going to quit anyway.</p>

<p>Never say never. </p>

[mike_hitchen]

<p>Ella - a town of 80,000 is not huge in my estimation and while I don't know the demographic how many people are getting married who would spend $1,500 on a photographer alone? Have you looked at how the spend on the wedding day has changed over the last 2-3 years? If that has dropped significantly then it shows how tight things have become; and on top of that the photograph will suffer disproportionately. I agree with those who have talked about differentiation: your product suggests high-end but the cost suggests average and this can confuse the customer.<br>

Also think of it in these terms. If you sell one $3,000 package, how many $900 do you need to sell to make the same gross profit? Probably several. So in some respects the size of the order book is not necessarily the only indicator.</p>

 

<blockquote>

<p>1700, 2400, 3200, 4500. No one has ordered the 4500 dollar package yet. Will anyone ever? I don't care.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>That is a recognised marketing ploy as it is. Put a very high-end product on your list and its main purpose is to make the others look good value. No-one is immune from it, even if they choose not to buy anything at all.</p>

<p> </p>

[jim_ducey]

<p>Sometimes a breakdown of charges help the couple understand and agree with the charges, travel time assistant photographer, etc. If they are completely hung up on cheap tell them to use a disposable camera and walmart, you don't want that wedding. Those people are the ones that are going to complain and fault find and try to beat down the price after the wedding and the work is completed.<br>

Jim</p>

[alex macphee]

<p>I can't offer advice on marketing, but I can re-tell an anecdote I've had occasion to relate in another photo forum, when I came to choosing a wedding photographer.</p>

<p>When my daughter was married about seven years ago, there were flickerings of suggestions that I should undertake the photography, suggestions that I quashed rather quickly. I wanted it done professionally, and given that it was about the only area where I was competent to make a decision (or perhaps allowed to make a decision), I had my way. I insisted, too, that I wanted the wedding recorded on medium format film. I interviewed a range of photographers and looked at portfolios, then settled on one I thought had the approach I liked, a portfolio I liked, and used Hass/Zeiss for his work. <br /><br />When you're an amateur, like me, you're used to thinking in terms of the marginal costs of photography, not the professional costs, so the quote was a bit of an eyebrow raiser (though there were others that raised them off my forehead entirely). When I commented that the photography costs were of the order of the catering budget, he said to me, "In five or ten years time, you won't even remember what was on your plate, but you'll remember how your daughter looked on her wedding day." <br /><br />I don't remember what was on my plate that day, but today I look at the pictures of my daughter on her wedding day, and I know that his answer was perfect.</p>

[MichaelChang]

<blockquote>

<p><em>"your work is amazing, but we don't want to pay that much." This has taken me a bit by surprise."</em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>And</p>

 

<blockquote>

<p><em>"I always have my finger on the pulse of the photo industry in my town (it's a pretty small town, capping at about 80,000 I think), and it is bustling."</em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>Many great suggestions have been offered but how to implement them? </p>

<p>It might be fruitful to begin by examining the general business climate in your town: restaurants, car dealers, retailers, etc. - Are businesses offering high end products and services profitable? What types of businesses are making money seemingly effortlessly? Figure this out, then slot your services in the scale of gradation that's most favorable to you.</p>

<p>Don't underestimate the power (and need) of selling. Your job becomes that of a salesman if you encounter objections to the services you offer.</p>

<p>Quick tip on overcoming objections: Use positive tiedowns - questions and phrase where only positive acknowledgements are possible. Example: "The small incremental investment in great pictures offers far better value over the life of a marriage, doesn't it?" How can the answer be No? Throw out enough of these, and you would have gotten your prospect to sell themselves.</p>

[greg_peterson3]

<p>[Disclaimer: I know nothing about the wedding photography business. Having had an unfortunate, trauma inducing encounter with marriage, I'd only shoot a wedding if the alternative involved water-boarding. That said, I think the following principal still applies.]</p>

<p><strong>Differentiate your service!</strong></p>

<p>Some ideas:</p>

<p>Go beyond "day of the wedding" shooting. Spend a couple of hours shooting journalistic-style pix of the bride and her mom choosing dress / cake / band etc.</p>

<p>Have a beer with the groom and the best man a week before the wedding. Shoot buddy pictures, tux fitting, etc.</p>

<p>Carry a recorder so you can get quotes from the principals that you can use as captions. (More on this in a moment)</p>

<p>Build a web site that goes on-line a week or so before the wedding. Use the pre-wedding pix and include directions to the ceremony, details about who needs to be where-when, etc.</p>

<p>I guess lots of people now do books via Blurb, MyPublisher, and such, but you should go beyond just a picture book. Transcribe your recordings and include selected quotes as text that you mix in with the pictures. In short: Tell the story with both words<strong> and </strong>pictures.</p>

<p>In the context of the wedding business, these may not be such great ideas, but you can come up with better I'm sure. The point is to offer something that the other guys don't.</p>

<p>A variation on the above approach has done wonders for my architectural / aerial business. (Please don't tell other architectural photographers.) </p>

<p>Good luck.</p>

[scott_murphy_photography]

<p>I have never understood how someone will splurge on things for a wedding that will be gone the next day, yet they hire some Craig's List yahoo GWC for $150 with a Canon EOC Rebel a kit lens and a cheap flash to record their wedding for posterity.</p>

<p>No one will deny that with the downturn in the economy, that people are going to be looking for ways to stretch their dollar, but going on the cheap for wedding photos from someone who probably has probably never taken a photography course in their life, but they have a consumer level camera, kit lens and a flash so that makes them a "photographer" is a perfect example of the penny wise and pound foolish mentality. You will always get what you pay for. You pay for cheap, you will get cheap. And you only have one wedding day. If they hose up the photos, you're screwed, there are no re-shoots.</p>

<p>High end photography has always been a bit of a niche market. You have studios like Olan Mills who crank out mediocre, cookie cutter photography for bargain prices, it becomes encumbent on professional photographers to emphasize value. They will never be able to compete dollar for dollar with the chains, nor should the try to.<br>

</p>

[William Michael]

<blockquote>

<p>“So what is the point? I've worked my budget... and re-worked it some more... <strong>trying to find ways to make a profit and charge less.”</strong></p>

</blockquote>

<p><strong> </strong><br>

<strong> </strong><br>

Clearly there is no point. Maths is Maths – it cannot be argued.<br>

<strong>You need to define exactly what business you are in. </strong><br>

On the one hand you say you want to align yourself with folk who predicate their business on an “artiste” style performance, but on the other hand you are running around a population of 80,000 sleuthing to find out what “the going rate” is . . .<br>

There is massive incongruence with these two actions.<br>

Also there is incongruence with other actions and thought processes described in this and also in your previous posts – as two little “for examples”:<br>

> there might be good reason not to post your Wedding Work here or for you not to link with any website, I can think of two off the top of my head: you might work in a country where the Licence and/or Copyright Laws are different to the USA or alternatively you might be servicing a niche market and selling Privacy, as part of what you do. But I think neither is the case, but I am only guessing . . .<br>

> also I suggest you look at how you communicate and what message is recieved when you do communicate: it could be you think you are saying one thing - but the audience recieves another, different message.<br>

So I cite these little examples to suggest you need to go back to tors and define what it is you are selling and who the customer(s), really are.<br>

And you need to canvas the whole length and breadth of possibilities to find the answer, as it might be that you merely want an outlet for your artistic desire and you are happy to break even, in a fiscal sense, because you really do not want to follow a marketing path, to suit otherwise.<br>

In this regard, your journey should be thorough and whilst travelling it you need to be honest with yourself.<br>

Once you have established what you truly want, then you can address the nuts and bolts of marketing and advertising that business.<br>

On the nuts and bolts of it: if you indeed want to be an “high flyer” you will retreat from sleuthing the prices of the locals in a town of 80,000 and you will have your name in lights, and on a multiplicity of levels, I would think.</p>

<p>WW</p>

<p> </p>

[davidjames]

<p>Everyone here talks of differentiating a service etc etc. But really if your passionate about photography, then you have your answer. If your considering giving up your studio, maybe it was never the right choice to begin with. Maybe think of another career.<br>

"Do it for the money, and your mojo will come and go. Do it for the passion and the same might happen, but you'll have a reason to keep going." -David duChemin<br>

Take it how you will.</p>