z_z1 Posted October 21, 2002 Share Posted October 21, 2002 I live in a VERY dry climate and I have noticed that my sheets of 4x5 film are buckling and some times causing the dark slide to not want to go back in after I take a shot. Any suggestions? Actually I have noticed that Ilford HP5 to be the worst so far. Is there somekind of film that works better in our Alberta winter dry climate? Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
george_jiri_loun Posted October 21, 2002 Share Posted October 21, 2002 My first answer got lost... Again, I would be very surprised if the buckling were due to the dry climat as you say. The film should lie under rails in the film holder. The only buckling possible would then be along the longer side of the film but if you don't pull the dark slide completely out of the film holder you shouldn't have problems to slide it back. I would rather check your film holders or your loading technique. Do you have problems with sharpness on your negatives? Does it only occur in winter time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcrisp Posted October 21, 2002 Share Posted October 21, 2002 Eric: I've never had this problem, even in Death Valley in July. It doesn't get much drier than that. What puzzles me is that, even with the film buckled outward, the dark slide should easily slip past it when you put it back in. The dark slide should just push the bulge out of the way, if that is what is going on. I don't mean to insult you but my best guess is that the film isn't properly under the grooves top and bottom of the film holder. We have all done that before and it is the only thing I can think of which can cause interference with the dark slide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daniel flather Posted October 21, 2002 Share Posted October 21, 2002 Eric,<P> Are you using old worn out film holders? I have a few that a in bad shape and have the same problem. I'm in Manitoba and at -35c it's dry. I <B>never</B> have problems with my new film holders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
z_z1 Posted October 21, 2002 Author Share Posted October 21, 2002 I'll double check my loading technique. I certainly don't feel offended! the main problem seems that the film doesn't stay under the rails at the top (closest to where slide comes out)and drops down into where you load the film end. Boy now if that isn't a poorly constructed sentence!! It may be due to the way I put my holders in the camera bag. I put them in dark slide end up. Maybe they are working themselves down so when I pull the dark slide out and then try and push it back in, it catches the notched end of the film. Someone mentioned not pulling the dark slide out all the way. Is this the normal manner? I usually end up using my dark slide as an additional lens shade. Any advise is appreciated. Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcrisp Posted October 21, 2002 Share Posted October 21, 2002 Eric: I think we're getting warmer here. The edge of the film, with the notches in it, should be completely under the fold-over flap. It should be impossible to snag it under any conditions. Either you have a mismatch of film size to holder or you're sliding the film in on top of the grooves it is supposed to be under. But even if you didn't slide the film into the holder all the way, I'm having a hard time seeing how you could snag an end -- you shouldn't be able to fold the flap over. Try putting a developed negative or scrap piece of film in the holder(s). Does it fit properly in the slots on either long edge? Does it go all the way into the holder so that the flap folds over properly? If you snag the edge of the film putting the slide back in, I think the film isn't installed in the slot it is supposed to be in. The end of the film with the notches in it should be on the far end from the end of the holder you put the dark slide into. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
george_jiri_loun Posted October 22, 2002 Share Posted October 22, 2002 There are no rules for pulling the dark slide out of the film holder or not. If the film holder is worn out it can be a kind of precaution. If you leave it there you have one item less to think about where to put it and less possibility to open accidentally the the back standard when putting the thing back. It's also quicker to close it. On the other hand when windy the dark slide in the open film holder can function as a sail and cause vibrations... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eugene_singer Posted October 22, 2002 Share Posted October 22, 2002 Eric, hold the sheet of film with the notches between your right thumb and forefinger. It will then be in the proper loading position. After sliding the film into the holder, under the rails on both sides, slide your fingernail under the bottom edge (there is a small circular depression cut into the holder for this purpose) and try to flick the film upward. If the film is mis-loaded, it will pop out of the rails. If it does, reload the film again. The bottom flap should go all the way into place and cover the notches. The darkslide should slide in easily, if the holder is loaded correctly. I have heard of large sheets of film bowing outward, slightly, inside of a holder when the camera is aimed straight down, but it would be un-likely that a properly loaded sheet of film would buckle inside of a holder from temperature or humidity enough to to stop the slide from goihg back in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john_luke Posted October 24, 2002 Share Posted October 24, 2002 The "only" way the dark slide could catch the film is if it's loaded incorrectly. When loaded properly, the top of the film sits above the point in the holder where the film frame opening is. This is why there is an unexposed border around all 4 edges of the film on a properly loaded, processed sheet film (known as the rebate edge). I don't believe the bottom flap of the holder could even close if the film wasn't inserted far enough and it was sitting on the 2 tabs on either side of the recessed disc. The film as you describe it has been loaded in the channel meant for the darkslide only. Also, the code notch always stays on the flap end so if you need to check a holder for fim type, you can open it in the dark, open the slide halfway, open the flap and check the notch. I've even seen people who load film with the black side of the slide facing out and flip it white after exposed. Although you may feel it is your "system" please consider observing the universal standards. You never know when a freelancer will be with you or when a lab may misinterpret your custom doings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tim_atherton2 Posted October 24, 2002 Share Posted October 24, 2002 "Although you may feel it is your "system" please consider observing the universal standards. You never know when a freelancer will be with you or when a lab may misinterpret your custom doings." I've lost you on this? What are you saying? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john_luke Posted October 24, 2002 Share Posted October 24, 2002 The universal standard being #1) Code notches on the flap end of the holder. #2) White side of the slide facing out to indicate unexposed film. The latter is not an issue with Eric's problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tim_atherton2 Posted October 24, 2002 Share Posted October 24, 2002 okay - I was just wondering why #2 had suddenly come up... of course it could also be silver side out And it's also interesting when you get a holder where notes have actually been writtne on the slide itself - like the itnriguing Fetish #6 and Fetish - red #2 on some recent ones. Unfortunatley, no film left in them... BTW Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tim_atherton2 Posted October 24, 2002 Share Posted October 24, 2002 Eric, I just noted you are in Alberta. I'm north of you in the NWT, where it's as dry or dryer a lot of the time - I've not had this problem with HP5 (I've had it warp due to the cold and shatter when I put the darkslide back in). I think you've got enough answers that it sounds like it might be loading/holder problems. I've only had problems similar to yours with 8x10 holders, which I find easier to misload - especially older slightly "looser" ones. It's possible to get the film in the slide channel - at least on one side, and then push the darkslide easily over it. But I've never had that problem in 4x5. tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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