question about 'new' found lens

[titus_bear]

<p>stumbled across a large format camera -- on spring-loaded platform (w wheels) this AM in a 'used stuff' shop. The camera is a large format Ansco (no model #) but around 50 lbs or more - I didn't have a flashlight. The bellows seems fine.<br>

the lense is mounted on a wooden panel, and has the following inscribed on it:</p>

<p>Doppel-Anastigmat F: 7.7 D.R.P. No. 74437.<br>

C.P. Goerz Berlin<br>

No. 26355<br>

Serie III No. 6. F = 300 m/m<br>

Any ideas on just what the lens is? info?</p>

<p>e/tb<br>

neflatlander@gmail.com</p>

<p> </p>

[erie_patsellis]

<p>Google 12" Goerz Dagor, should give you plenty of answers, what part of the country/world is it in if you don't mind my asking.</p>

[titus_bear]

<p>middle of no-where's Northern Vermont, USA... where the number of road-kill - squashed porcupines per mile of I-91 far exceeds the number of cars. sorry.<br>

I found it in a shop in Vt - owner was more impressed on how the spring-loaded table worked than the camera. There was a pile of glass plates, a box with a shutter mechanism /rubber squeeze bulb. Didn't look like there was a back end on the camera (i.e. a focusing surface?). Will probably get it if I can figure out what parts are there /missing. <br>

Thanks for your info re: 12" Goerz</p>

<p> </p>

[titus_bear]

<p>looked at the google info. Those lenses are different /flat /with shutters. This lens (see enclosed images) is more like a brass hose fitting. No shutter - a 15 segment/leaf aperture / apeture scale reads: 6, 12, 24, 48, 96, 192, 384, 768.<br>

Looks like it's been sitting for a while - good thing the attic is bird proof. Bought it, but won't do anything to it (cleaning /et.al.) until I understand more just what it is. Will photo the camera mid week when we can drag it out of the attic and move it back home.<br>

<img src="http://contemplativeeye.com/goerz berlin" alt="" /><br>

I've posed some images at:<br>

http://contemplativeeye.com/goerz berlin with a SPACE between goerz<br>

and Berlin.</p>

[titus_bear]

<p>a 'corrected' web address for the lens images (without spaces in title) is:<br>

http://contemplativeeye.com/Goerzberlin.htm</p>

<p>thanks, in advance, for any info /suggestions you might offer</p>

<p>e/TB</p>

[erie_patsellis]

<p>Titus, make sure you get the shutter with rubber bulb (likely a Packard Shutter, still made) if it's just the ground glass, easily made, if you're missing the entire back, only slightly more difficult.</p>

<p>Northern, as in St. Albans/Burlington? I grew up in W. Mass and dated a lady in Burlington/Colchester area, though I spent most of my time in the lower part of the state and the Cape. Nice country, I miss mountains, people who know how to drive in snow, and I will never miss the tornadoes here in Illinois.</p>

[titus_bear]

<p>I look forward to learning more about the camera set up. I've been reading some about the 'Better Light' digital scanning backs (limited to 4 X 5), but am intrigued by the description of the 'direct to unique print' technique used by Richard Learoyd.<br>

re: 'northern' VT - I live on the other side of the state (think near St. Johnsbury /North East Kingdom - i.e. 'vermont's best kept secret' according to one U.S. Senator. The least populated /poorest part of VT. Not a lot of people / lots of deer, moose, bears, and other critters /I live 8 miles to the nearest paved road / LONG winters (late October to April) - so dismal that the movie "Ethan Frome" was filmed here... but it's a great place to do my art /images. <br>

Once I get all of the pieces of the camera /stand I'll post some images here so you can see just what is and what is not included. I'm pretty clueless about large format cameras. Thanks for your comments /interest.</p>

<p> </p>

[thirteenthumbs]

<p><br /><br />From <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F-number">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F-number</a>, bottom of page: Goertz aperture number- current f stop number<br /><br />6=f7.7; 12=f11.13; 24=f16; 48=f22.6; 96=f31.62; 192=f44.72; 384=f63.25;768-not listed, assumed to be close to f90.<br>

Your lens is in a brass barrel and is from around the late 1800's to early 1900's.<br />I have limited experence with Plate cameras but their backs are hinged and I do not remember if the ground glass in made in or if it is in a seperate frame that is removed after focusing/composing.</p>

<p>Some info on Goertz lens from the Vade Mecum:<br /><strong>C.P.Goerz A.G, </strong>Berlin -Friedenau, Germany.<br />(<em>Note Goerz spelled his name on lenses with an E, not an umlaut.</em><br />One of the old established (from 1886) German makers, responsible for several <strong>Landmark </strong>lenses such as the Dagor, Hypergon and possibly the Syntor/Dogmar group. Goerz were able to make the transition from high quality RR's such as the Lynkeiskop series to anastigmats due to accepting von Hoegh's offer of the Dagor design, and he went on to design the air-spaced Celor and the Hypergon.<br>

By the 1920's the firm was less innovative and Goerz died in about 1923, and the firm became part of Zeiss Ikon</p>

<p><strong>Double Anastigmat Series 111 Dagor</strong><br />This was the most important product for some years and today is probably still the most traded. It is worth<br />noting however that it comes in a number of ways and each has its value- and price.<br /><strong>Original Double Anastigmat </strong>f7.7 This was made in 3.5-35in, and was made from 1892. Later it was made<br />as 1.625-4.74-16.5in. The Layout is Dagor Q9, or Goe001. It was suggested to use 18cm for 13x18 at f6.8 but it would cover 21x27cm closed down, and in general it covers 70-90°, and the f7.7 series was continued after 1900 in longer focus versions when the shorter versions were redesigned to work at f6.8- though there may have been some redesign optically.<br>

<br />These were also made under license by Ross in London, the brass lenses being marked 'Goerz patent'. These seem all to be f7.7 versions. Later the Series 111 was renamed Dagor and when the patent ran out, was exploited by many firms. The initial design was by E. von Hoegh (1865-1915) who worked for Goerz 1892-1902, and Series 111 was Patented (German Pat. 74,437/1892 or 1893; Brit.Pat. 23,378/1892). It was covered in all countries except France where the prior import of one lens prevented cover. The patent describes a lens of f7.7 for 70°, or in a slower version, for up to 90°. The angle covered really rates it as a wide angle (see W.Rice in B.J.A. 1900,p763) and 10x8 users can use 12in as a normal lens and 7in(180mm) as a wide angle at f32.</p>

 

[cdewen]

Titus:

 

Welcome to the club.

 

Charley

[cdewen]

<p>OK, let's try this again....I'm trying to insert a photo, but the forum software seems to be a bit reluctant.</p>

<p>Charley</p>

<div></div>

[cdewen]

<p>Well, that's better, isn't it?</p>

<p>You might note the difference in heights of the barrels. Confuses the crap out of me.</p>

<p>Charley</p>

 

[thirteenthumbs]

<p>The <strong>Original Double Anastigmat </strong>f7.7 was renamed Dagor when the original patents ran out. </p>