What do you do when you know the bride will probably be disapointed in their wedding photos?

[William Michael]

<p>Tina,<br /><br /><br>

I agree with your husband.<br /><br /><em></em><br>

<em>It seems the Client's did not take full advantage of your Services, Talent and Time – you can advise and technically direct and suggest but then bottom line is you are <strong>not the School Ma'm </strong>to hold the strap over them, if they are recalcitrant.</em><em><br /><br />***<br /><br /></em><em>Laurel,</em><em><br /><br /></em><em>In what Country do you work? </em><em><br /><br /></em><em></em><br>

<em>Were those words the result of paid legal advice? </em><em><br /><br /></em><em></em><br>

<em>It is interesting that you intimate you can allocate responsibility of any adult’s actions (a Guest) to a third party (The Client) and then hold the Client responsible for those actions of the Guest, if they cause damage. </em><em></em></p>

<p>WW</p>

[mccosh]

<p>Another way at looking at it, is that they broke the contract first by not given you the allocated time that was required to take the shots that were promised, Therfore you can't be held resposible for the lack of good images. I would do the best you can with what you have and maybe offer to take shots of the Bride in her wedding dress either in your studio if you have one or at the location where the original shots where to be done. You could also include the Groom if he can re-hire the suit.</p>

<p>John</p>

[david_schilling___chicago_]

<p>The easy part about shooting weddings is taking the photos.....it's the people skills that is the most difficult and it's very difficult to explain how to manage a wedding and the bridal party. It takes tact, confidence and experience. Yes, I've taken a bottle of beer out of the bride's hand for the garter and bouquet sequence....she smiled at me and her mother thanked me out loud.</p>

<p>I can't stress how important it is to apprentice with a really good experienced pro, otherwise alot of this stuff is trial and error. It's also easy to cop-out and state that you just shoot what's in front of you....most of my clients look to me to take care of them throughout the day. I carry safety pins & scissors, I put the boutonnieers on most of the guys, the dads, and grandpas, if there's extra flowers I'll let the bride and her mom know so that they can be used by someone, I explain how to cut the cake, I explain to the bridal party to take their obligatory pics right-away so that they can party. If they're lower key then I standby and wait for invitations/requests for help but most of the time we've gone over situations like these during our initial meetings and I've pledged to take care of them throughout the day. It works for me and I've seen it modeled by some of the best in the business. It's important to managed client expectations before, during and after the wedding.</p>

[janet cull]

<p>Pray for them. It doesn't sound like a good start.</p>

[jriherd]

<p>You do what you can do. Reminds me of a job I did a long time ago. Little to no cooperation but I got my all time favorite photo from a wedding as a result. To make a long story short, as soon as possible the groom's family loaded up and headed to the keg party, leaving the bride's family to clean up the mess. Bride was a little snippy with groom. My all time favorite photo?--the bride, in her wedding gown, sleeves pushed up washing dishes from the reception. I sold no reprints and heard later they split up within six months.</p>

[fuccisphotos]

<p>First, I agree, don't right off the bat say or offer anything. If they are extremely displeased by the photos, then you could offer them a discounted short portrait session. Mention that it costs very little to rent a tux again, and she should still have her dress. Say it in a positive light, that often many couples do this type of shoot after since the day never affords enough time to get the beautiful portrait shots. </p>

<p>Second, I'm a firm believer in using the tools available to us. Just because the photos weren't great at first look doesn't mean they can't be helped. I'm not saying you touch up EVERY PHOTO in the batch, but at least the ones that seem most salvageable. If people are frowning you can change that easily into a slight smile. I did this the other day with a MOB who had had a stroke, so she couldn't smile in the photos. What you do is you clone out the frown lines, then at the sides of the mouth take your cloning brush and move it up only a pixel or two, so you have just the slightest upturn of the lips at the edges. Then at the center of the mouth, clone 1 or 2 pixels lower. You'll be amazed at what you can do. For rolling eyes, I'm hoping the same person didn't do that in every shot, clone in his or her eyes from another shot at a similar angle if you have it. For backgrounds that are not great, give it the ol giant aperture blurred background approach, just in post. Using the magnetic lasso or pen tool, trace out the wedding party, then expand your selection by 1 or 2 pixels, then feather about 3-5 pixels. Then go into filters and blur, and then pick lens blur or gausian blur. Play with the blur settings. <br>

Also, another tool in your arsenal should be creative cropping. For the toast, was she double fisting the wine bottles? unless she was drinking from both at the same time, crop one out. It's not that unusual for a bride to be drinking from a bottle at a toast if they are super celebratory.<br>

For glassy eyes go in and clone over the spots at a low opacity. For kind of blank looks, add a tiny bit of color to the cheeks just to liven her up. For all this, the trick is making it look natural, not fake. <br>

Lastly, don't give them shots that just look terrible. Hopefully you got some nice detail shots of the cake, the setting, her getting ready, etc. My theory is giving people bad shots of something is worse than no shot at all.<br>

For the album, see if you can make the images in it smaller than say 8x10s. Make it more like photo collages. When the photos are smaller, it makes it harder to pick out frowns and eye rolling etc.<br>

Hope these tips helped!<br>

Good luck!</p>

[surfidaho]

<p>Howdy!</p>

<p>I know I'm in for a really bad time when I show up at the Bride's dressing room to shoot the final preparations, and the place is littered with empty champagne bottles.</p>

<p>If they are not happy, and you feel like throwing in something extra to placate them, be careful. They may never stop asking for freebies. Make it clear that anything extra is a one time thing, and otherwise stick to the contract.</p>

<p>Later,</p>

<p>Paulsky</p>

 

[dean_schreuder]

<p>To me it sounds like the bride and groom have everyone, EXCEPT the photographer, to blame for the poor photos... Including themselves.</p>

[tina___cliff_t]

<p>I think David nailed why I feel bad. Because during the wedding (especially like this where it seemed like everyone was a little touchy and grouchy), I wish I had the guts to say something. But didn't because at least at this point everyone seemed to be enjoying themselves, not fighting, etc...and didn't want to stir up anymore conflict. I think it the long run it would have been more appreciated. Instead of just letting them unfold and do whatever while I capture it, I think back and wish I would have said things like, hey lets move the chair to the dance floor for the garter toss, not in the middle of the tables (yes they just sat down at a random chair and decided that was time to take off the garter, the DJ didn't even know they were doing it). <br>

I will have to try some of the ticks that Vail said, I might not be able to save the rolling eyes, but I might able to get some of the others that weren't smiling to look like they were. </p>

[picturesque]

<p>There is a fine line between meddling and being overbearing, and just letting things happen with absolutely no intervention. Obviously, people have different opinions about this, and you will have to figure out where on that scale you are. Clients can complain no matter what you do. To one couple, you may be a busybody who should have just photographed what they did. To another couple, your attempts to 'improve' things would be appreciated. So again--use your judgement. But definitely don't blame yourself or feel sorry for people. You are not responsible for their behavior--they are, and they must 'own' the consequences of their behavior. I would not even fix up the formals unless the couple asks about it.</p>

[sherijohnson]

<p>I haven't read all of the responses here, but you cannot be responsible for other people's actions, cooperation or lack thereof, or any of the junk that happened. You might however want to do an "after wedding" session with them so they could get some nice pictures of themselves sober.</p>

[rt_jones]

<p><strong><em>COOPERATION: The parties agree to cooperation and positive communication for the best possible result within the definition of this contract.</em></strong></p>

<p>I don't understand. How can you force the people that are paying you to "cooperate" and communicate? If they don't jump when you say "jump" do you walk out? <br>

<br /></p>

[william-porter]

<p><strong><em>"I don't understand. How can you force the people that are paying you to "cooperate" and communicate? If they don't jump when you say "jump" do you walk out?"</em></strong></p>

<p>No, of course not. But that's not what's at issue here. The cooperation clause of the contract has a fairly standard legal meaning. A client can be fairly hard to work with and still be "cooperating" within the understanding of the law. But the cooperation clause does provide a little protection to the photographer if, say, the groom passes out and simply can't participate in the photos (to make up a somewhat extreme example).</p>

<p>Will</p>

[rt_jones]

<p><strong><em>No, of course not. But that's not what's at issue here.</em></strong><br>

<strong><em><br /></em></strong><br>

William, the issue is what I chose to take issue with. :)</p>

<p><em>"the parties agree to cooperation and positive communication for the best possible result within the definition of this contract."</em><br>

There is no fairly "standard legal meaning" in this statement and the tone of this demand sounds ludicrous.</p>

<p>And if the groom passes out, I will still take photos and live up to my end of the agreement. He just won't be in too many of them. (Except for "one" showing him flat on his back should anyone wonder why).</p>

<p>I don't know about the rest of you, but I take peoples' money to shoot photos at their pleasure - not judge their behavior.</p>

[francie_baltazar]

<p>In my pre wedding consult I describe myself has the photo director of the wedding... and what they think might look funny now they might not like post wedding. So will be letting them know if I think they should shift or change - so yes, I have taken bottles of champagne away from the groom and I have said nicely and kindly in the brides ear... you won't like that photo... please do blank... The couple has told me the vision of their wedding and album... I am there to help them create that so sometimes it means telling the bridal party "I know you want to drink and as a guest of the bride and groom you are requested for 10 minutes for photos" That has gotten all of my bridal party where I want them when I want them there. Now all that said, if they B/G want pure photojournalism - well - they woudn't hire me... but I would shoot what ever they did with no direction or intervention what so ever... sorry this happened... keep a postive outlook...</p>

[fotografz]

<p>We deal with people. Most people are fine subjects, and a few are not. Do wedding photography long enough and you will run into an issue like this to some degree or another. </p>

<p>In extreme situations there is little you can do ... yes, you can try to take command if you are so inclined ... but to imply that experience as a wedding photographer can mitigate atrocious behavior is a bit unfair IMO. Personally, I never feel responsible for the attitude or actions of others. All I feel we can do is guide and suggest while providing reasoning for the suggestions ... then it is up to the subjects.</p>

<p>Last year we shot a pretty high end wedding ... the bride's parents were wealthy ... the Groom was ... well ... "from the other side of the tracks" in the worst way possible. Alcohol and drugs were abused early on and it showed in some of the worst treatment of a bride I had ever witnessed ... including the groom's 12 year old son throwing rocks at the bride while I was doing her bridal portrait ... <em>I kid you not</em>. During the Bridal couple's photos, the groom was staggering drunk, loud and abusive and wasn't interested in photos at all ... kept licking the bride's face and squeezing her ample breasts.</p>

<p>Despite that, we managed a very nice package of images ... to which the Bride never acknowledged ANY of the great shots we got, and told me that her "husband" was very disappointed that there were no loving formal posed shots of them at the reception (by which time he was really inebriated and obnoxious).</p>

<p>That kind of blind denial was enough to tell me this was a no win situation. I photoshopped the one decent shot of them I had into the reception background, and waived the additional fees they owed me ... never once mentioning any of the poor behavior ... and let it go at that.</p>

<p>TIP: shooting "empty plate" shots of the ceremony location and reception areas is something I frequently do in just in case. It is standard procedure for most commercial location photography ... and has come to the rescue more than once.</p>

<p>I also know this is a public forum, but I don't care who reads this ... it is a cautionary tale, and sometimes there is no turning lemons into lemon-aid, or no winning no matter what. </p>

[daverhaas]

<p>@Mark T - </p>

<p>I've seen some of the most wealthy people around behave like complete jerks and some of the poorest behave like saints. Completely unfair to judge by income / pricing level. </p>

<p>Tina - </p>

<p>Best thing you can do is to sit down with the bride and groom (if possible) and go through the shots. Let him and her pick their favorites for the album. </p>

<p>You're a photographer, not a psychologist or behavior specialist, so as far as people making faces, frowning, or just being plain drunk - not much you can do. </p>

<p>Marc W hit the nail on the head - best you can do sometimes is to use the tools we have to put the couple in places that they weren't - I also do the "empty plate" shots - JUST IN CASE. One time the DJ asked me what I was doing - I replied - these are my emergency backgrounds - just in case I have to work some magic with photoshop later. He looked at me, thought about it for a second and said - "you're honestly the first photographer I've seen do that!" </p>

<p>Good luck.</p>

<p>Dave</p>

[dave_wilson1]

<p>Good point David Haas. Money has absolutely nothing to weigh in here. You have to do enough weddings in various markets to realize how this plays out.</p>

[william-porter]

<p>Marc Williams writes:</p>

<p><em><strong>"TIP: shooting "empty plate" shots of the ceremony location and reception areas is something I frequently do in just in case. It is standard procedure for most commercial location photography ... and has come to the rescue more than once."</strong></em></p>

<p>What's the point of this? I gather from David Haas's follow-up post that you do this so you can Photoshop people into blank backgrounds. But I don't understand how this solves a problem. Obviously, this is something that I have never done nor ever thought of doing...</p>

[fotografz]

<p>The point William is to enable use of backgrounds for a number of purposes ... extending backgrounds, shooting at different exposure and blending with a posed shot, or creatively as a full bleed background in a coffee-table type album with reception or ceremony insets. Takes 2 seconds and provides lots of creative options later if you wish.</p>