The Battle for the Street

[chris_waller]

<p>A couple of items from this Sunday's Observer newspaper. Photography is getting into the mainstream political debate, it seems.</p>

<p ><a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/apr/18/cameras-in-public-editorial">http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/apr/18/cameras-in-public-editorial</a></p>

<p > <br>

<a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/artanddesign/2010/apr/18/street-photography-privacy-surveillance">http://www.guardian.co.uk/artanddesign/2010/apr/18/street-photography-privacy-surveillance</a></p>

 

[mike_stemberg]

<p>Thanks for that Chris!<br>

...(from a person that has been stopped 9 times so far!)</p>

[thomas_sullivan]

<p>I was sitting in Market East....combination Shopping Mall and Train Station...in Philadelphia, PA, USA yesterday taking a grape eating break from some street photography. My camera was visible, but knowing the rules of that particular building I was not taking any pictures. Across from me were some women, semi elderly, very opiniated, and talking so I could hear them. The one pipes up...."You have to know your rights, they can't just take a picture of you while you're walking around on the streets". Specifially said on the streets. I didn't say anything, as we were in a private building, and didn't really want to start anything.</p>

<p>But, this is the mindset of a lot of people out there. It's their right to not be photographed. But it's not.....of course. I personally have given up explaining that to people. They know they're rights......heh. I just take their pic (the ones in public anyhow) and if they say anything I just keep on doing what I'm doing. Basically I ignore them. Unless they are in my face about it. I then tell them that in public I can take any picture i want to. Then I tell them to go talk to a cop about it. Luckily, for me, everytime I have done this, the cop explained it correctly to them. How do I know they (the cop) did? Well, when they come back to my area after talking to the cop and I ask them what he said.....they refuse to talk to me........heh.....gotta love it!</p>

[mike_stemberg]

<p>PS. Just found this similar, earlier and ongoing thread in the Street & Documentary forum ~ : <a href="../street-documentary-photography-forum/00WGRz?unified_p=1">Why street photography is facing a moment of truth.</a></p>

 

[thomas_sullivan]

<p>just to be sure I'm understood....I realize the situation in England is very bad concerning photography. I feel for you guys. If it was going on to that level here in the states, I'd probably be in the police station about once a week.........and not because I'm beligerent or anything, quite the opposite actually, but it's what I do. I shoot Street, and always will. If I gotta start hiding my cameras because the powers to be won't leave me alone while I'm shooting on public property, then so be it.</p>

<p>At this rate.....the terrorists are already winning. It's become such a paranoid state of affairs with cameras, that out rights are being severly trampled on....and it has to stop. I hope you guys across "the pond" stop it in it's tracks. Good luck!</p>

[xxloverxx]

<p>Thomas — I do exactly what you do when people start asking…ignore them.</p>

<p>Going to London this summer. Not looking forward to it nearly as much now…I've known about the trouble in the UK about street photography for a few months now, but the stories just seem to be building up to an unbelievable level.<br>

I hope, for everyone's sake, that the paranoia about street photography stops; not just in the UK, but around the world. If our rights aren't protected, they'll be taken away…swiftly and without much style.<br>

Thankfully it's not such a big issue in HK (it's getting there, but very slowly). I have had my bag searched on the street by police a few times because “I was carrying a camera and had a big bag”, which I found absolutely pathetic, to put it gently. It also doesn't help that they're bloody slow at copying the ID number and sending it via radio back to the station for verification or something…</p>

[chris_waller]

<p>Thomas,<br>

As you say, " the terrorists are already winning" - aided by our government. Another good read on the more general question of civil liberties is A C Grayling's 'Liberty in the Age of Terror'.</p>

[John Seaman]

<p>Reading some of the responses to this it seems that some people have been given the impression that the UK is practically a "no go" area for street photography. This is <em>most certainly not the case</em>. Over the last few months I have been doing a street photography project for a course I'm doing, and have taken many pictures in the street on around nine separate shoots, , both of buildings and people, with no hostility or restrictions whatsoever. The project involves asking passers-by to pose in a certain situation, and most of the people I approached were quite happy to do it, whilst the ones who didn't want to do it were not nasty or anything - it was a case of being open and polite, and explaining why I was doing it.<br>

I've also been doing some street photography on my own account, in busy streets and markets, both posed and candid, and again have had no problems. OK over the years I have had a few "run-ins" with hostile people, who I usually ask if they go on holiday and if so, take pictures of the locals etc, but that doesn't seem to count. Double standards?<br>

Just to re-iterate, street photography is quite possible in the UK if you behave considerately and openly and use normal common sense.</p>

<div></div>

[scott_koring1]

<p>I have been following such developments very closely for the last couple of years. I have enjoyed street photography since 1988, when I purchased my first Leica M. I do feel that those of you across the Atlantic have had a harder time of it, but I have seen changes here in America as well. For the first time in all those years I was detained and questioned by a policeman in my own hometown on the public square about 2 years ago. A young woman prtotested my photographic activity to him and he demanded my ID and ran my name. He further then stated that if he recieved any further complaints he would charge me with distubing the peace. To top things off he even left and went around the block to see if he could catch me continuing to photograph! Before he finally left he advised me to always get someone's permission before photographing them. Keep in mind that this is on the public square in Lancaster Pa, a major tourist town. For a long time I was afraid to even carry my camera in my hometown. I have as of late taken to traveling to larger cities to indulge my street photography itch. </p>

[xxloverxx]

<blockquote>

<p>…he would charge me with distubing the peace.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Did you call the police station to inquire about that? If I were in that situation, I'd get his police number (whatever that's called) and call the police station to ask about it.</p>

[walter_strong5]

<p>Go to http//:carlosmiller.com for the Photography is Not a Crime website.</p>

[steve m smith]

<blockquote>

<p>I realize the situation in England is very bad concerning photography.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Do you really? I live in England and it is not that bad.</p>

<p>We hear of a few cases of harrassment both here and in the US which are negligible compared to the number of photographs taken without incident. All cases of police harrassment of photographers which I have heard about have ended up with an apology being issued by the police.</p>

[steve m smith]

<blockquote>

<p>Did you call the police station to inquire about that? If I were in that situation, I'd get his police number (whatever that's called) and call the police station to ask about it.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Not sure about the US but in the UK even whilst you are being detained and questioned you can ask the officer to call his station to clarify the actual law if you think the officer is wrong.</p>

[xxloverxx]

<blockquote>

<p>Not sure about the US but in the UK even whilst you are being detained and questioned you can ask the officer to call his station to clarify the actual law if you think the officer is wrong.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Thanks Steve — I'll be sure to remember that for this summer, when I go to London.</p>

[fld]

<p>I spent an hour this afternoon shooting downtown buildings in Nampa, Idaho. I had no sooner gotten my cam out than a local police car drove by. I was profoundly ignored.</p>

 

[walter_strong5]

<p>Well doggone Lawrence, a guy can't have any excitment that way!</p>

[mike_hitchen]

<blockquote>

<p>I realize the situation in England is very bad concerning photography</p>

</blockquote>

<p>And how many tens of thousands of people write to their local paper to say "I spent 5 hours photographing people and no-one hassled me".<br>

Unfortunately tabloid newsapapers love making a story out of the few cases of a law enforcement officer throwing their weight around.</p>

[rickbarbosa]

<p>I miss the good old days when we just argued over film vs digital</p>

[leigh_youdale]

<p>Last June/July I spent eight weeks in Paris, Ireland and the UK as a tourist and carried two RF cameras with me all the time and used them constantly. (I don't carry a big DSLR with a long zoom!) Not once was any comment or even a stare directed at me. I did not always have my wife with me. I think the incidents we hear about are isolated and, unless you're behaving in a pushy or eccentric manner there's no reason to be concerned. Carry your ID, research the rights appropriate to where you will be and have your firm but friendly response prepared. I didn't need any of that, but it's best to be ready in case you come across one of the paranoid ones.</p>