Pentax's customer support - how to reach higher up the ladder

[ted_keller]

<p>Hello all,<br>

I recently purchased a Pentax K200D kit for a few things it offered, one of them being a weather resistant body. Imagine my surprise when I discovered the included lens wasn't weather sealed (the body is, the lens isn't??)! So I checked the Pentax web site and noticed the included lens and the weather sealed lens were the same price, wow. So I called Penax's customer service to ask about swapping the lens...I was told that since I didn't buy the camera from Pentax they couldn't help me! The kit was a Pentax kit. Then I asked who the CEO was and was told Ned Bunnell, and when I asked how to spell his name I was told to google it! Wow I thought, this is customer support? So I emailed what I thought Ned's email address at Pentax would be...no response...a week later I emailed him again...no response again. Since he claims to hang out on forums, I'm hoping he is here somewhere and will respond. I guess I'm old school and view no response as being more rude than being told "no".</p>

<p>Let's see what happens...</p>

[JTG1]

<p>If you look just 4 post down from this post in this forum, you just might find a post from Ned....</p>

<p>~Jack</p>

 

[mc2imaging]

<p>To be fair, the K200D came out about 2 years ago and the WR kit lens didn't start shipping until about 8 months ago (I believe), they can hardly control the age of stock every retailer has. Any changes/improvements made along the way would be tough for Pentax to implement retroactively. <br>

If the retailer you bought the camera from implied that it included a WR lens, your beef is with the retailer, not Pentax.</p>

<p>If I bought an iMac from the local shop then got home and found that the iMac I bought has a slower processor and less RAM the current iMacs that Apple is selling on their website for the same price, I could hardly expect Apple to give me a free upgrade. If the local shop told me the specs were the same as the new machines then the local shop screwed me, not Apple.</p>

<p>If I didn't do my homework and just bought an outdated machine, I don't have anyone to blame but myself.</p>

[jacques c pelletier]

<p>Just goes to show how hard/impossible it is to contact any high roller figure at any large corporation.<br>

JP</p>

[r.t. dowling]

<p>Matthew M. made some good points, although I think the customer service rep's snarky response of "Google it" was perhaps uncalled for.</p>

<p>Also, you said that you e-mailed what you <em>thought</em> Mr. Bunnell's e-mail address would be. Do you know for a fact that you used the correct e-mail address? Normally an incorrect e-mail address would bounce back with an "undeliverable" message, but that is not always the case -- some e-mail servers are configured to accept messages from any address, even invalid ones. Usually these messages will be forwarded to the webmaster or IT person, but who knows what happens after that.</p>

<p>Yes, it's strange that the K200D didn't come with a weather-resistant kit lens, but the K10D was weather-resistant as well, and that camera never came with a weather-resistant kit lens at any time during its production life. It's odd, but it's not unusual. Nikon and Canon's weather-resistant cameras are often bundled with non-weather-resistant lenses.</p>

[mc2imaging]

<p>Pentax has been making sealed bodies since the LX. Anybody know how many LX-era lenses were sealed?</p>

<p>The 18-55 dates back to the original *ist-D (2003?) - were ANY of the *ist bodies sealed?</p>

<p>I'm betting the customer service rep didn't know how to spell it either, thus the internet search recommendation. Not really an excuse, but that rep probably had less of a chance of getting ahold of Ned then you do.</p>

<p> </p>

[r.t. dowling]

<p>We're getting off-topic, but just a minor nit-pick: I don't think the original 18-55 goes as far back as the *istD. I remember shopping for DSLRs when the *istD was on the market, and it came with the FAJ 18-35. I think the 18-55 was introduced with the *istDS or *istDL. The *istD was still in production when the DS and DL were introduced, so it's possible that <em>later </em> *istD kits <em>did </em> come with the 18-55... but I'm 99% certain that the 18-55 wasn't actually introduced until mid-2004 or early 2005.</p>

<p>Anyway, my suggestion to Mr. Keller would be to buy the WR kit lens, and either sell the non-WR lens (to help pay for the WR kit lens), or keep the non-WR as a backup.</p>

[stemked]

<p>Matthew,<br>

The LX was dust sealed, I wouldn't call it water sealed like the K10D. I think (I maybe wrong) but the answer is that no older lenses are truly water-proof sealed.</p>

[ted_keller]

<p>Jack,<br>

Thanks for the pointer to Ned's post. I emailed him asking for business contact information since this is a business issue.<br>

Now I know I have at least contacted him directly. We'll see what happens now...<br>

Thanks again,<br>

Ted</p>

 

[mountainvisions]

<p>Matt M hit it on the head, your K200D was never offered with a WR lens because they don't retro actively part out kits.<br /><br />second, the camera is still weather tight with or without a sealed lens. <br /><br />since the K200d was never offered with a sealed lens, complaining about it is like complaining that your jeep didn't come with all terrain tires from the factory. Its an option you needed to add at time of sale.<br /><br />you could have bought a K200D body only and added the WR Kit lenses individually. </p>

[mzik]

<p>Justin, be careful with "the camera is still weather tight with or without a sealed lens", because a e.g. DA* 16-50 has a rubber ring which mainly seals at the lens mount contact.</p>

[mzik]

<p>Btw I have a similar "problem" as Ted.. I created an online petition to convince pentax to put full control over the video mode in the K-7/x firmware.. http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/pentaxk7xfullvideocontrol/</p>

<p>On the one hand, I would like to have the attention of a higher grade manager, because I feel the lack of "support" from the Pentax support itself.</p>

<p>On the other hand, it is quite ridicoulus to think that Ned Bunnel will deal with such an issue himself. E.g. if I am not happy with my pension, I cant blame it on Mrs. Merkel..</p>

[wtlwdwgn]

<p>As far as communicating with Ned goes I've always gotten a response on an issue. However, I can't imagine how many emails he must receive each day. Having said that though it would be nice if there was someone working with him who could at least respond to our messages. As far as exchanging lenses have you contacted the seller to see if it's possible?</p>

[johan_ingles_le_nobel]

<p>I just wish there was a single point of contact for firmware update requests, say by email. Collating those to see what people are really asking for might also provide Pentax with some invaluable information.</p>

[mountainvisions]

<p>Unless you are using the camera in a monsoon, water is NOT coming in from the lens mount.</p>

<p>Water has an extremely high surface tension. It is not sneaking in behind the lens mount or where the lens mounts unless there are some nasty gaps. </p>

<p>I've used all sorts of cameras for 10 years, only one was damaged by water and it was just a digital compact that was submerged in a dry bag under class 3 rapids for 10 minutes, then left in the bag for a day. Again I'm careful, I dry everything off quickly and tend to not shoot in monsoons.</p>

<p>As a note my 50-135mm DA doesn't have a noticable lens gasket on the lens, nor does the 16-50 unless I am mistaken. 50-135mm is the one lens, paired to the K20D, that I have used in a monsoon. No damage to the camera or lens 2 years later.</p>

<p>Water might enter the non sealed lens itself, but even that is unlikely on a well built prime lens, or internal zooming zoom.</p>

<p>Basically, the sealed lens is more for the lenses protection that that of the camera.</p>

<p> </p>

[mzik]

<p>Justin, thanks for pointing this out.<br>

I personally never experienced any damage to my lenses too (altough the only non-sealed lens (Sigma 17-70) I used during heavy rain has been in Machu Picchu, under constant rain for more then 2 hours.. no monsoon though ;).<br>

What I meant is shown in this picture (the right one is a DA* 50-135 where you can see the rubber ring sealing at the outer lens mount contact):<br>

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_o3HmHKlnpPE/ShKjodzmVRI/AAAAAAAAAD8/woxZTBdPaSs/s1600-h/Samyang_Vergleich_DA535_Bajonett.jpg<br>

If this one is missing on your lens, you might want to consider it getting service..</p>

 

[ted_keller]

<p>Well Mr. Bunnell and I have emailed regarding this issue and I must apologize to him here as well (I have already done so via email). I was only attempting to state what happened in my attempts to contact him, my assumption was that someone received my emails since they did not bounce back as undelivered. I applied the same logic to them not coming back as I apply to other email and postal mail, if it doesn't come back...then it must have reached the destination (just to let you know, I have been emailing since way before the world wide web existed).<br>

I am glad that we had the opportunity to email each other; once I was able to reach him with a valid email address, he did respond...<br>

Ted</p>

 

[mountainvisions]

<p>Michael,</p>

<p>There is a small rubber gasket on the 50-135, unless you make it a habbit of touching the lens mount (which I don't) it's easily misable, more so because it's a black rubber gasket, almost flush with a black background, but it is there.</p>

<p>Definitely not as fancy as the bright red gaskets on the DA WR Kit lenses.</p>

<p>Nevertheless, under normal conditions (mist, light rain, and limited exposure, followed by wiping lens down in the field, and then complete drying at home) the difference in a sealed and non sealed lens isn't going to be much.</p>

<p>As a matter of fact, I do not believe the 1 K10D that went on the antarctic cruise with all the sealed Canon and Nikon bodies was NOT accompanied by a single sealed lens. Certainly not a DA* since they followed the K10D by several months (almost a full year). Of note, the K10D had no operation issues but the majority of Canons and Nikons had some problems. My guess is they might have had L series sealed glass too!</p>

<p>And certainly the point of failure isn't going to be the mount gasket, more than likely the lens crevices themselves.</p>

<p>The K10D/K20D are rated splash proof, so sealed lenses definitely do maximize that rating. But splash and normal adverse shooting conditions are two different things.</p>

[mzik]

<p>Hey Justin, thanks for your detailed answer.<br>

The story about the K10D on the antarctic cruise sounds really interessting. Do you remember where you read that and could provide me with a link?<br>

Thanks and Cheers!</p>

[mountainvisions]

<p>Luminous Landscape.</p>

<p>Every brand had a failure but Pentax. Of course Pentax could have been lucky since not every Canon, Nikon, Leica, et al failed. If there had been 10 Pentax, maybe we'd have seen a failure.</p>

<p>However, since it didn't fail I don't think anything should be held against the K10D.</p>

<p>Oh, and the above should should say the K10D was NOT accompanied by a single sealed lens (at least not a DA* sealed).</p>