Need Help Shooting Horses

[mark_harrington1]

<p>I have a photoshoot comming up with two female models who want to do some location pictures with horses in a canyon, so off camera lighting will consist of a couple of SB-900 flash units. I don't have pets, I don't shoot pets and never even been around many horses. Are there any suggestions you can pass on? I'm worried that a shallow dof will make the horses seem out of focus but I'm concerned about the background trees, poles etc. How fast do horses move (recommended shutter speed?)? Any help or tips would be appreciated, also any posing ideas? They want the pictures to be country girl sexy...the obvious ones I get, but any more sophisticated pose/shot ideas would be great.</p>

<p>Mark</p>

[Matt Laur]

<p>First and foremost: how well do your two subjects know those two horses? Those are large animals, and they can be either utterly bomb-proof, or amazingly flaky and easily spooked. Just the act of getting low with a camera in hand can bug some horses, and camera flash - especially off-camera, to the side, where they'll see it in their peripheral vision, can be alarming.<br /><br />You'll want to be absolutely sure that you, your subjects, and the horses have all had some time to get to know each other, and that the horses have seen those strobes go off 100 feet away, 75 feet away, 50 feet away... you get the idea. Take no chances.<br /><br />Presumably you're not going to be out in harsh noon-time light, right? The canyon setting suggests that you could be dealing with very brief windows of favorable light, or that you could be in shadows most of the day, and needing those strobes for almost all of the light that matters. Remember that if you're using light modifiers on stands, you're going to be making sails. Have sandbags, or an assistant to keep things rock solid if there's wind. An umbrella blowing over is another horse spooker, big time.<br /><br />Do you have any time to visit with the subjects and their horses BEFORE the shoot? That will help you to size things up (in terms of lens choice) and have the horses remember your voice and manners. Likewise, you might want to scout that location in advance, so that you don't have to actually worry yourself about things like telephone poles.<br /><br />You mention shutter speed... are they posing, or galloping past? This stuff matters!<br /><br />It sounds like a really fun shoot, and one that could produce some great results. Just make sure that you don't get kicked. Assume nothing about the horses' comfort with you, and make sure their handlers have given you a solid introduction.</p>

[mark_harrington1]

<p>Matt, thanks for the advice, I'm pretty up on the lighting basics etc, my concern is that there won't be an opportunity to use stands and modifiers because of the remote location and constantly moving horses. I'm very grateful for the advice of getting the horses used to the flash before hand...Of course I undedrstand the corrolation between subject movement, distance and shutter speed, but I'm concerned about too much dof not blurring the background, and too little dof potentaially blurring the models. One of the shots will be static, and I'm trying to work out the others but I'm thinking Lady Godiva, bareback on the horse with a colorful translucent fabric trailing behind her. Getting the back light on the fabric and keeping the subjects properly illuminated is perplexing me given the environment. Any suggestions? Do you think it would be too dangerous to have the nude model reclined on her back on top of the horse? Kind of like you may see on a pool table with her back arched?</p>

[geoffs1]

<p>Ditto Matt's suggestions on acclimatization. I'd suggest a trial session with the horses you're planning to use before treking into the canyon with the models. That way you'll have some idea of what you can expect behaviorally when you start shooting with flash.</p>

<p>FWIW, I've never even <strong>considered </strong> flash photography around horses... I just did a portrait session yesterday that would have benefited from some fill-flash. (maybe I'll have to try it with one of the tamer ones at the stable)</p>

<p>I'll be (very) interested to hear how things work out!</p>

[mt4x4]

<p>I've owned horses my entire life. I grew up on a ranch and we regularly used them for work.<br /> <br /> I could offer all sorts of advice, but I don't think any of it would make sense to you unless you have experience with horses. I don't mean any offense, but it would be like talking about aperture and f-stops to someone who has never picked up a camera.<br /> <br /> The only solid advice I can really give you is to have someone there to help out who is horse saavy. If the horses belong to the models, then you'll probably not have any problems.<br /> <br /> Just to put the situation into perspective. Some people shoot pistols off of their horses at a full gallop (mounted shooting competitions) and some people can't even get within 30 feet of their horse with a piece of paper in their hand. I've never hit one of my horses with off-camera flash, or any horse for that matter, so I really don't know how any horse would react. My point is, it all really depends on the animal, its training, and the experience of the person handling it.</p>

<blockquote>

<p>Do you think it would be too dangerous to have the nude model reclined on her back on top of the horse?</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Again, it all depends on the horse. I used to take hour long naps on top of one of my horses (bareback). Riding bareback is much safer than riding in a saddle. If the horse jumps sideways your model is probably just going to slide off. Saddles injure more people than horses do.</p>

<p>Best of luck to you.</p>

[silverdae]

<p>If you've never been around horses, you need to have someone who is there for just the horses. In my experience they sense fear, and it can make an already somewhat jumpy horse quite nervous. Then they will jump a bit, which will scare the crap out of you the first time it happens within 5 feet of where you are standing. This will only make it even worse. Suck up any nervousness you feel and trust them, but be aware. Also, horse see differently than we do. They don't have a single image coming at them, they have split vision. Also, horses get spooked by different things. Once when I was riding on a flood levy, we came to a culvert that went under the levy. My horse spooked because all she could see was water on each side of her and below her. Broke my foot on that fall. Oddly enough, you couldn't keep her out of a lake or a creek, even in the middle of winter. We had many games of "kick the ball" at home when the basketball would roll under the fence... but i digress. Point is, every horse is different. Get someone there who knows the horses well.</p>

<p>And don't walk behind them.</p>

<p>I would recommend interacting with the horses for a bit before you start to shoot. If they've never met them, the strange guy holding the stange thing in his hand following them around can make them nervous. I would schedule some time before the shoot for some "getting to know you" time so you can work your way into the actual session.</p>

<p>Good luck though- it can be done! Post the results (and the inevitable stories) from your shoot.</p>

[nathan_stiles]

<p>I've photographed horses (maybe in my gallery here? I think so), and I've rode horses...</p>

<p>First, forget the little flashes, they are so undersized for a horse, it's not funny. Second, unless you have some good telephoto glass, you'll get crappy action shots. As for the model reclined on the back of the horse, her being nude or clothed will not effect the danger level. This is something the rider will decide upon, not you. I'm assuming the girls are riders, and not just using their cousin's horses-- if so, then you need a handler.</p>

<p>For what it's worth-- in my 33 years of red neck life, I've never heard of a horse getting spooked b/c someone had a camera (or much of anything) in their hand. I've used on camera flash in barns (not specifically shooting a horse) and I've personally never seen a horse, pic, dog, rat, or the snake chasing the rat even acknowledge anything changed-- not saying a bad angle might not do this, but in my experience they've ignored it. I'd be more concerned if the camera man was crouched down and jumping around.</p>

[rick_donnelly]

<p>Lots of good advice already here that I don't need to repeat. For what it's worth, I have used flash around horses on numerous occasions without (serious) incident - around the barn, at shows and in one-on-one portrait sessions. It can be done if the horse(s) is not too spooky and you ease them into it. Start slowly and subtly and from a distance. If they show any signs of unease, stop. A nervous horse will never photograph well. Avoid rapid-fire flash unless the horse is proven to be spook-proof, or you are deliberately trying for shots of a frightened, wild-eyed horse rearing up in self-defense.<br /> Trying any elaborate lighting setup with a horse is likely to be very frustrating unless the horse is an experienced photographic model. An assistant to hold the light is much more effective than stands since unlike a people shoot you usually bring the equipment to the subject, not the other way around. Often the best shots result from following the horse as it moves naturally. Unlike shooting human models, you never want lights too close to the animal - that can be asking for trouble.<br /> I also find that I can keep a safe distance and get more controlled results if I stick with longer lenses. A 70-200/2.8 on full frame is my preferred tool for good horse portraiture, and it's as flattering for the animals as it is for people. And the horse stays calmer if you are further away.<br /> Horses love carrots and apples. Having a bag or two of each can be a useful treat to gain their trust. Ask the owners first, though.<br /> Move slowly. Speak softly. Keep your other eye open when shooting to maintain situational awareness of the whole scene and <strong><em>especially</em> </strong> of other horses.<br>

After having said all that, sometimes you encounter a horse that absolutely cannot be rattled, no matter what you do. They will stay calm and cooperative at all times. For example, some Western trail horses in my experience are much calmer than a competitive dressage or racing horse. I think it is better to presume the opposite, however, until experience with the animal proves otherwise.</p>

[johnw436]

<p>Maybe contact this guy? I'd say he's got it down. His photos don't include human models, but he would likely be a wealth of first hand knowledge.<br>

Wojtek Kwiatkowski<br>

<a href="http://www.photo.net/photodb/member-photos?photo_id=9480474">http://www.photo.net/photodb/member-photos?photo_id=9480474</a></p>

[mark_harrington1]

<p>Did the shoot without any problems. One of the horses was a little too jumpy to use, so we just used the other horse. The SB900 worked very well for what I needed.<br>

Thanks for all the tips and advice.</p>