can't control photos after delivery to client

[william-porter]

<p><a href="http://theonlinephotographer.typepad.com/the_online_photographer/2009/06/a-mom-goes-viral-attracts-haters.html">This article over at The Online Photographer</a> got me thinking. I am careful these days to post low-res images on my web site and usually I watermark 'em as well. IPTC info contains my copyright and other info. But at the end of an event, I give the bride a DVD with all the high-res images and a license to use them non-commercially in any way she likes. I haven't followed up how the images are getting used but I suspect some are appearing on web sites. And some of those are probably (almost certainly) being posted without a credit to me and without being sized down for the web. In other words, while I take reasonable steps to prevent somebody from stealing my photos from my web site, once I give the files to a client, they're out of my hands and it just occurred to me that anything can happen.</p>

<p>Is this just the way it is? Am I being paranoid - or if this isn't paranoia, is it simply pointless to worry about this because there's nothing I can do about it?</p>

<p>Will</p>

[mc2imaging]

<p>You can worry about it all you want, but the only thing you can do to stop it is quit selling DVD's with releases. We put a logo bug in the bottom corner of the images, but it could always be cloned or cropped out...</p>

[craig_gillette]

<p>That's the way it is - but that's always been the way "it is." It's just easier to copy images these days than it used to be. You can put clauses in contracts, "require" credits or limit certain kinds of uses and some people will cooperate, most will. Some won't. I'd suggest that the best thing to do is not create an incentive for the client to infringe by having reasonable print and licensing requirements. </p>

<p>I'd also expect that outside of a very small photographic community, most clients and customers aren't going to know or care about the differences betwen a spectacular supre professional print and a well done scan or budget print from file - especially if stuck in a cheap frame and placed on a wall. A couple of fingerprints on the plastic and a layer of dust and no one is going to care.</p>

[david_schilling___chicago_]

<p><em>"....once I give the files to a client, they're out of my hands and it just occurred to me that anything can happen." -Will</em><br>

<em></em><br>

Yes, I think that's pretty much just the way it is. If you're gonna' sell DVD of your images, might as well make them high-res and edit as nice as possible, cuz, after all you do forfeit control of the images afterwords. People pirating images for commercial use can give you more options but in our image-heavy culture I think it's a pretty uncommon occurrence. I had one of my images from a post here at P-net pirated by a husband-wife photographer team on the west coast who used the image on their website to promote signature guest books of their engagement photos. They really weren't all that bright because they posted here at P-net and a fellow P-net member recognized the image as mine and alerted me. I contacted them, they acted dumb and removed the image from the site quicker than you could say "goofheads".... Funny, had they contacted me, asked to use the image with a small studio credit, I would have gladly allowed it. In fact, I offered them continued use of the image if they would just post a public apology on P-net.....course, they declined.</p>

[bobcossar]

<p>of course the <em><strong>opposite</strong> </em> can happen too. You might get a bill from the bride for how you use what really is <em><strong>her</strong> </em> photograph.......or how you showed an unflattering photo of her....</p>

<p>If you are going to put your nose to the ground to get every last penny you think you're entitled to, perhaps you might give the same ideas to others as well.....</p>

[betty_lowrey]

<p>David, I cannot believe someone would be so brazen!! That's terrible! I'm glad that someone alerted you.</p>

[william-porter]

 

<blockquote>

<p>If you are going to put your nose to the ground to get every last penny you think you're entitled to, perhaps you might give the same ideas to others as well...</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Can't imagine where this response came from. I said nothing about money and in fact, I wasn't thinking about money. My fees are already pretty low, and once I deliver the images to the client, I don't expect to make a penny off them again. I was simply thinking about the possibility of piracy, of someone stealing one of my photos. It's not money I'm concerned about, it's, well, it's really just the violation involved that I would find upsetting. Of course, if somebody did steal a photo and put it to commercial use and made money off it, I guess that would be annoying. But I think it's unlikely. I'm pretty sure that the folks who do have money (say, big magazines) are careful about the provenance of the images they use, so a thief is likely going to be some small-time loser. </p>

<p>David S.: You're comment that, in our image-heavy culture, this kind of theft is probably pretty uncommon, is reassuring, and the idea had occurred to me, too. Life is full of risks and you can't let 'em all keep you up at night.</p>

<p>Until I read the Online Photographer article today, I guess I'd never realized so clearly that, no matter how careful I am about my files, as soon as I give hi-res versions to someone else, the dog is off the leash. Oh, well. Maybe I'll get big and successful and can persuade clients to buy prints and forget about the files. ;-)</p>

<p> </p>

[bobcossar]

<p>William, I meant no offense to you. but I think time is better spent looking at the possibilities of the <em><strong>next</strong> </em> opportunity, rather than digging thru the details of the last one looking for problems.....regards, Bob</p>

[cathy_and_david_bock]

<p>As long as she's not using it for commercial means, don't let it bother you. These are the clients photos and if you're work is awesome more than likely people will ask who took them. Look at it as free advertising. It's not worth getting in a huff over and anyone who does, probably shouldn't be doing non-commercial event photography if they're all upset because a family member wants to post a picture of themselves without leaving a photo credit. It's not like it's a Calvin Kline ad or anything.</p>

[plavchak]

<p>Bob, I'm sure you well know the in the US, the photos are NOT the property of the bride, unless you sign over copyrights to her. The photographer owns the photos he/she took, not the subject. We give them a license to print and use them only. Yes this law is very hard to enforce, but never the less it's still the law.</p>

[bobcossar]

<p>Yes Mike, I knew that.<br>

Yet in another, non-legal sense, it<em><strong> is</strong> </em> her photograph. Our societies do not run on laws alone, there are other considerations which we all make every day to accomodate other people......Only lawyers would prefer it otherwise.....Regards, Bob</p>

[david_schilling___chicago_]

<p><em>"David, I cannot believe someone would be so brazen!! That's terrible! I'm glad that someone alerted you." -Betty</em><br>

<em></em><br>

Thanks Betty, I didn't really see it as "terrible" but I think it was very embarrassing for them.....often "it's a small world after all". Sometimes people don't realize that the photography community can be pretty close at times. We've also had some P-netters that have had their complete website lifted and presented as someone else's over in Europe....now that is brazen.</p>