Nikon d700 + Nikkor 17-35 or D3 ?

[mihail.ursu]

<p>Hello,<br>

I want to buy a FX camera, and I can't decide whether it should be a Nikon D700 + a Nikkor 17-35 2.8 or a Nikon D3.<br>

I currently own a Nikkor 24-70 2.8 and a 80-200 2.8 AF-S and I am not a great fan of extreme wide-angle photography, but in certain photojournalism situations I discovered that an 17-35 2.8 would help.<br>

I intend to use the camera for some event, press, product photography and street photography.<br>

I would like the D3 because of the sheer speed/durability and because my D300 has a lag in focusing and shutter release, which I am afraid will be the same in the D700, also I hope that the resale value would be better than a D700.<br>

I would appreciate any comments and suggestions, please.</p>

<p>With respect,<br>

Mihail Ursu.</p>

 

[Matt Laur]

<p><em>my D300 has a lag in focusing and shutter release<br /></em><br />That doesn't sound right. First, a reminder that the D300, D700, and D3 share the same AF system. The D3 has a faster processor, but that's not what's at play, here, if you're experiencing a tangible lag. How do you have release priority set up on the D300? What sort of light are you shooting in?</p>

[nishnishant]

<p>I doubt if the resale value for a D3 would be better than that of the D700 (using relative costs). If anything what I've heard is that the D700 has seriously brought down D3's resale value.</p>

[wpahnelas]

<p>i always find it a tad unsettling when people think about the end at (or before) the beginning. you're already concerned about resale value before you've bought anything?<br>

as for the difference between a D700 and D3, the specs are easy to decipher. for your intended purposes, however, either would be suitable. for certain types of photography, dual card slots on the D3 can be compelling. on the street the D700 form factor might be advantageous. you're the only one who can sort through these matters for your own priorities.<br>

i agree about the 17-35 focal range. the wide end of the 24-70 seems really wide on FX -- until you need wider. those situations are pretty much inevitable.</p>

 

[james_calron]

<p>Go with the D700, it's a D3 without a battery grip (and small other features that honestly don't count in my book). The D700 is great, nice and light, same IQ and very impressive performance. It's all you'll need for the next 2-4 years.</p>

[mihail.ursu]

<p><a href="http://www.photo.net/photodb/user?user_id=2344388">Matt Laur</a> <br>

I have the shutter release set at focus+release, and I knew it would make it slower but didn't exect it to be tangible. I set it that way because of a bit of paranoia, meaning I prefer fewer sharp images than a lot of unsharp. The light conditions vary<br>

Now when I think about it I experienced it more on the 80-200 2.8 AF-S, maybe because of the slower autofocus?<br>

Also the frame rate never really got to the 6fps advertised even when the D-light was off and shutter was set to release priority, and even when the autofocus was manual. </p>

<p><a href="http://www.photo.net/photodb/user?user_id=4297087">Nish Sivakumar</a><br>

Thank you for the information, I thought that compared to the initial price it would lose less than the d700, but I guess i was wrong.<br>

<br /><br>

<a href="http://www.photo.net/photodb/user?user_id=3888800">William Pahnelas</a> <br /><br>

It just that is a big buy for me, and I can't afford to change cameras as soon as new ones appear unless I can get a good sale price...<br>

I know about the specs, but that doesn't really tell me that much, especially after feeling the real-life differences between the Pro and Semi-Pro equipment. What troubles me is if the D700 will have the same issues as the D300 then I will end up losing even more money by selling it and buying the D3.<br>

I agree that it depends on me, I am just trying to learn from your experience and then take a decision. </p>

<p><br /></p>

<p> </p>

[lex_jenkins]

<p>Mihail, if you're experiencing problems with AF and shutter response I'm betting your D300 is set to focus-priority. While this feature can help ensure more photos in sharp focus, it also can delay getting a shot since the camera won't allow the shutter to release until the object in the sensor is in satisfactory focus.</p>

<p>I rarely use focus-priority with my D2H. I'd rather risk getting an out of focus shot than miss a shot entirely. I use this feature only with handheld closeup photography. It's handy because sometimes I don't want to lug a tripod around for casual photography, or where tripods are prohibited or impractical in some venues such as a conservatory in a botanic garden where it might pose a hazard to others. I can preset focus using the AF-ON button, assign the shutter release to release only, and no matter how much I wobble around the shutter won't fire until the object in the sensor is in sharp focus.</p>

<p>Other AF modes can also influence response times. Multi-pattern AF modes are convenient but tend to be slightly slower than single sensor modes. I tend to use multi-pattern AF modes only in bright light and with erratically moving single subjects. But to pick a single subject from a crowd, a single sensor AF option tends to work better for me. Be sure to experiment with the various AF options before concluding that the D300 overall is slow to respond.</p>

<p>Nish, a bit off topic, but there is no validity to claiming that the D700 will devalue the D3, any more than the F100 devalued the F5. Experienced photographers who understand the features and benefits of the equipment will chose between the flagship models and next tier of pro and serious amateur bodies based on their specific needs.</p>

<p>But if you can provide some specific, credible references indicating a pattern or trend influencing the resale value of the D3, in such a way that is relevant to the D700, D3X or other camera and not merely to the current state of the economy, I'm sure we'll all be interested in seeing such data.</p>

[nishnishant]

<p>Thanks Lex, and yes my statement was not based on factual evidence, but more on forum-speak (which I admit is not always in touch with reality).</p>

<p>I still do think that it'd be very hard for anyone to rationalize that a % of potential D3 users will not go for a D700. Again it's mere theorizing but a very good one in my opinion.</p>

[mihail.ursu]

<p>Still, did anybody at least get close to the 6fps as advertised with the D300?<br>

I tried with every setting I could think off, and still I couldn't squeeze more than 3 ( I estimate) out of the camera.<br>

And did anybody in real life situations get the 5fps/8fps (with booster and AA, EN El-4) with the D700?</p>

<p>Thank you all.</p>

[Two23]

<p>Myself, no way I'd be happy with a lens that goes no wider than 24mm (on FX.) But then, I'm an ultrawide fanatic. As for the camera, my strategy has always been to go with the cheapest body that will do what I want it to. Cameras lose value so fast that I'd rather tie the money up in first class lenses. I'd take a D700 + 14-24mm or even 17-35mm over a D3 with no ultrawide any day.<br>

Kent in SD</p>

[carl_becker2]

<p>I don't think a D700 or D3 will solve your main issues. A 24mm in FX is much wider than DX, you may not need the 17-35mm in FX. You may be better off sorting out your response issue before spending $$$. If all that works out and you still need a wider lens the 17-55mm should be a good event lens. All the camera bodies will go down in value.</p>

[Dieter Schaefer]

<p>Mihail, I just looked at a sequence I took with the D300/MB-D10 grip (EN-EL3e) in CH mode - 5 shots all with the same time stamp in the EXIF data (same second) - seems to work fine.<br>

Regarding your camera question - I know I would go for the D700/17-35 combo - but that is me and it might not work for you. Again, for me, the D3 offers nothing of value over the D700 - but it might well for others.</p>

[ShunCheung]

<p>I use the MB-D10 on the D300 and get 8 frames/second all the time. However, if you use 14-bit capture, the D300 drops to 2.5 frames/second. To get 6 to 8 frames/sec, you must use 12-bit capture. (The same is true for the D3X but at different frame rates.)</p>

[paul_b.1]

<p>" my D300 has a lag in focusing and shutter release , which I am afraid will be the same in the D700"</p>

<p>Why don't you compare and test this cameras at F64 showroom in Bucuresti !?</p>

[james_symington1]

<p>From the sound of it the D700 and the 17-35mm seems more like it - particularly if you are serious about the photojournalism side of it. For the fun of it I got myself embroiled in the G20 protests in London the other day and sometimes even the 17-35mm wasn't wide enough.<br>

Build-wise the D700 is extremely robust - unless you actually want to hit a protester the D3 (which I also used to own and have since sold) might be too much.</p>

[david_ralph1]

<p>There is in fact some tiny extra shutter lag in the D300 <em>IF</em> one sets color bits to 14 rather than 12 bits, 45 ms; 12bits is maybe twice as fast. Also, in dynamic mode any Nikon will slow down the shutter if 51 focus points rather than 1 or some smaller number are selected, or if the focus assist lamp is enabled. Manual focus, manual exposure, is fast. Single servo is longer than continuous, since solid focus is required. So, when you want speed, do you really need 14bits would be the big question. How much automation do you want in focusing and assessing exposure vs asking the processor to do less, and thereby be faster, before the shutter fires.<br /> I believe the D700 is up to the same speed as the D3 on focusing, perhaps see Thom Hogan's review for this. Buffer may be smaller, a factor in high speed shooting. The CF card is a limiting factor here sometimes. Get UDMA cards.<br /> See Thom Hogan's D300 guide.</p>

[dan_brown4]

<p>I had the D700 and 28-70, and then added the 17-35. I'm also kind of like you, in that I don't care for the whacky-wide shots. On the other hand, the 28mm wide end of the 28-70 kust isn't wide enough in many circumstances. That's where the 17-35 comes in, as it gives you 26, 24, 22, 20, well you get the idea. Also, the 17-35 on your D300 is a pretty useful range in its own right.</p>

<p>I don't think you would ever regret the D700/17-35 purchase, it's a great combination.</p>

[mihail.ursu]

<p>I honestly thank you all for the information and time spent offering it.<br>

After your suggestions I reconfigured my D300 and I felt improvements in reaction time and also in frame rate.<br>

Also I met a friend and shot for a short time with a D3 and kind of confirmed my suspicions regarding the speed of it, after each shot I was still waiting to hear the sound of the mirror drop, that's how fast I felt it was. But i found out about some things he didn't appreciate in the D3: the sensor gets dirty very fast and that it is a lot more difficult to clean when compared to Canon 1D Mark IIn, they qualify it as sticky( meaning the dust doesn't go away with a blower). Also he said that the D3 is sometimes too big and draws a lot of attention to it, which is not very useful in news situations.<br>

Did anybody have the same experience with the D3 sensor cleaning?</p>

 

[walterh]

<p>Mihail sensor cleaning and value depreciation ( we all do not predict the future) and some of the other points are all "peanuts" if you talk about your decision. Both cameras are excellent and nobody can tell you if YOU need the wide zoom.</p>

<p>The D700 with the 17-35 will take better images at 17mm to 23mm than the D3 without lens. It is as simple as that.</p>

<p>I am not saying that your worries are not worthwhile considering but really once you got one of the two choices you will just use your gear and everything else will be minor points. Give up my D3 because I have to clean off of dust on the sensor from time to time? ROFL. My D3 with any of the three discussed pro zooms is heavy to carry. Yes I complain about it but it would never stop me from lugging it around as long as I can^^. The results of both cameras will blow all your worries away.</p>

[matt_smith24]

<p><em>"That doesn't sound right. First, a reminder that the D300, D700, and D3 share the same AF system. The D3 has a faster processor, but that's not what's at play, here, if you're experiencing a tangible lag. How do you have release priority set up on the D300? What sort of light are you shooting in?"</em><br>

I was under the impression the D700 and D3 share the same Expeed processor. The D3 has more juice because the battery is gruntier and it has a larger buffer. I have both cameras and yes, the 17-35 in FX is terrific but then so is the 24-70.</p>