Tachihara 4x5

[gwebster]

<p>Greetings,<br>

I am also considering my first foray into LF, but unlike another poster who was looking at a Toyo camera, I am very interested in the Tachihara 4x5. I have a number of newbie questions, so I hope you'll bear with me ...<br>

What do people recommend as a couple of starter lenses? I am aiming to shoot mostly landcsapes, but if I could find a pair of (preferably) second hand lenses that would give me some latitude in what I shoot, what would a versatile combination of focal lengths be?<br>

I do not have a darkroom. I have been processing my own 35mm B&W using a light bag and Patterson tanks, but processing 4x5 is obviously a whole other thing. I figure I am almost certainly going to depend on commercial labs for processing (especially for E6) and then I will scan myself. How difficult is 4x5 B&W developing by comparison with 35mm - is it even possible/worthwhile without a darkroom?<br>

Are there any good labs for 4x5 processing in the Boston/New England area?<br>

Are the Quickload pre-packaged sheets worth it? Without a darkroom, it seems like they might be.<br>

Aside from the camera, what else might I need to get that doesn't come with the camera body? (e.g. film holders, lensboards, darkcloths etc.)<br>

Any other advice from experienced 4x5 users (especially Tachihara users) for a newbie to LF woul be very welcome.<br>

With thanks in advance.<br>

Gordon</p>

 

[brucecahn]

<p>I think that is a good choice for a budget 4x5. For landscapes I would suggest 90 and 135, just make sure the camera will handle a 90 with whatever movements you like before buying it. Doing B&W at home in trays is easy. I do sheets one at a time but many people do several together. There is a danger of scratching in the trays or in the wash. You can use a dark shirt or jacket as a darkcloth-one less thing to carry. Of course filmholders, get about 3 boxes which will give you a dozen shots. Ready loads cost much more and the variety of films is more limited . If you can afford ready loads, use film and spend the extra money on a better camera. Also you need a board for each lens and a cable release is a good idea. And don't forget the light meter and tripod.</p>

[leicaglow]

<p>I would get a 150mm lens to start. 135mm is a good length, but it seems all the manufacturers have the 150mm length nailed down for quality, while some 135mm's are not the best. I'd vote for the 90mm and 150mm as my two choices.</p>

<p>4x5 is <em>easy </em> to do at home. Just get a Yankee type square box tank that holds 10-12 sheets at a time. They take a little practice to load, but you don't even have to have a darkroom except to load the film. I process B&W at home, and simply use a dark bathroom to load the film, and then process in my kitchen. I send all my E-6 out, just because some chemicals are pretty nasty on the pipes.</p>

<p>I use nothing but quickloads now days. Even though they're more money, I save as much on not having to take backup shots because of spots, dust, and scratches that occur otherwise. If you use these, you'll need a quickload holder. You'll also need a dark cloth to throw over your head and ground glass (a jacket works fine), a magnifying loupe unless you have exceptional vision to focus on the ground glass, and a tripod.</p>

<p>Both the Tachihara and Toyo are fine cameras. I wouldn't worry about buying either, except that there are many more available accessories for the Toyo.</p>

<p>Finally, you have to figure out what you want to do with your images. If you want to print them, you either need a 4x5 enlarger (but you don't have a darkroom), or a scanner, capable of scanning 4x5 film, like an Epson v700. Large format is a real blast and you won't regret it. When you shoot with smaller formats, then see a large format film, you will always be blown away. You generally don't need sharpening, color correction or any of that. Here's a 4x5 with a crappy old view camera and a Nikkor 135mm lens (very cheap lens, but by no means ever my favorite lens). I stitched this one together from a smaller scanner, but there was no other manipulation (though there definitely could be).</p><div></div>

[paul_wrobel]

<p>I have a 90mm, 127mm, 150mm, 210mm and a 300mm but find I use the 150mm and 210mm the most. It really depends on what the landscape is and how far away you are from it.<br />If you go with a 90mm, you may find you are limited in movements and require a bag bellows. I'm not sure the Tachihara feature exchangable bellows but I may be wrong.<br />As for film, Quickloads are expensive. Around $4.00 per sheet which adds up if your exposures are off more than they are on. I like to use Arista.edu Ultra iso100 from Freestyle Photo shot at iso50. This film costs less than $0.50 per sheet and has always produced great negatives for me. The reciprocity on it isn't the greatest so you need to know how to compensate but I could send you a copy of what I use if you'd like.</p>

[jim_norman2]

<p>If landscape is your subject of choice, I'd start with either a 150 or a 210, depending on your distance. 90 is fine is you want wide angle or plan to do some "cropped panoramas." I use the Quickloads because of the convenience and weight factors. My B&W film of choice is Fuji Neopan Acros. You might also think about the Beyond the Zone System tubes, available from the View Camera Store. Once the tubes are loaded, you can handle processing in subdued daylight. You can also do different development times for each sheet.</p>

[pvp]

<p>I tend to use wide lenses for landscapes, and you'll almost always need a wide angle if you shoot anything architectural, so I'll recommend a 150mm and a 90mm.<br>

The best value in 90mm lenses, IMO, is the 90mm f/8 Super Angulon. (And the Caltar W-II 90/8, which is the same lens only cheaper.)</p>

[friedemann_pistorius]

<p>The Tachihara is a good and lightweight camera and will handle 90mm lenses with ease. Other options include Shen Hao (heavier) and Ebony RW45 (better, more expensive) cameras, to mention a few.</p>

<p>You'll need a STURDY tripod, a long and flexible cable release, a light meter, a loupe (!), film holders (I use Quickload, very convenient!), and a dark cloth. A 30 year old black T-shirt from Tokyo still serves me well for this purpose (yeah, it has been washed several times since then...)<br /> Well, and some film.</p>

<p>My first lens was 180mm, years later I added 90 and 300. After more years of buying, trying and selling I settled on two different camera/lens sets, one for long distance/overnight hiking/kayaking etc, the other one for "regular" use. The light kit has 80, 150, 270mm lenses, the regular kit has 58, 90, 135, 200, 300 and 450mm lenses.</p>

<p>My lenses with "normal" focal lenghts get by far the most use (135/200 and 150), followed by medium tele lenses (270/300), followed by wide angle lenses (80/90). Extreme w/a (58) and long tele (450) lenses are seldom used, but I carry them for some rare occasions.</p>

<p>The lenses I'd never ever give away for whatever reason are 90, 150 and 300.<br /> I'd rather sell my wife...</p>

[john_galuszka]

<p>The 90mm SK Super-Angulon recommended be several of the above is an excellent lens, but you will not be able to get much movement with a standard bellows--they just don't have the room to bend that much. (I am using a short rail--half of standard--Calumet 4X5 with a 90mm lens.) So I got a 210mm SK Symmar. You can shoot the lens with both elements to get 210mm, or you can remove either the front or rear element to get 370 or 475mm----3 lens lengths for the price of one!<br /> <br /> <br /> Here's a tip:<br /> <br /> <br /> To use this lens on a compact camera, I mounted it in a recessed lens board, but modified the board to be able to mount it backwards. This mean that I can keep the short camera, but still use a longish lens. (This only works with the 210mm in my case.) However, the 370mm option also works well for 8X10, so I built another lens board to use it there. So, the lens can be used on any format between 4X5 and 8X10. <br /> <br /> <br /> If you don't have a lot of money, then the Symmar can serve a lot of different situations for one cost! The Symmar comes in several focal lengths; there is a 180mm version, maybe more. It's worth looking into. (It is a 70 degree angle of view lens, so it doesn't "see" as wide as the super-angulons, but I think that having those two lenses give me the most flexibility for the least dollars.)</p>

<p> </p>

[profhlynnjones]

<p>The Tahchihara if a first class flat bed view camera and perfect for landscapes.</p>

<p>Lynn</p>

[dan_south]

<p>Hi Gordon! Welcome to the club!</p>

<p>Starter lenses: 135mm or a good used 120mm for wide angle; 180mm or 210mm for short telephoto. For me, the 180 seems to work out more often.<br>

Later add: 90mm and 240mm.<br>

It's better to avoid extremes at the beginning. Get a little experience under your belt before you attempt to focus a wide lens like the 90mm.</p>

<p>I don't know of any labs in Boston, but if you need a long distance alternative, Manhattan Color Labs is the best E-6 lab in NYC: reasonable prices, CLEAN chromes (unlike most other places), fast service.</p>

<p>I don't use Quickloads. They have one very nice advantage - you can write notes on each sheet - but they're almost twice the price. I prefer to load my own sheets. The effort makes me think twice and double-check everything before I trip the shutter. I load my holders with an easily portable Harrison changing bag (the Small size).</p>

<p>You'll need:<br>

- a focusing loupe (very important!)<br>

- a cable release (long ones are better)<br>

- a dark cloth (a dark bath towel will suffice for your first try). I like the BTZS dark cloth (available from Badger Graphic)<br>

- a lens board for each lens. Make sure to buy boards that fit YOUR camera. Not all camera use the same style/size.<br>

- a light meter or a camera with a built-in light meter<br>

- a lint-free lens-cleaning cloth (available at better camera stores)<br>

- film<br>

- rubber bands, post-it notes, and a couple of empty film boxes for managing your exposed film<br>

- three or four film holders (to start). Each holder holds two sheets.<br>

- OR a Quickload holder and a box or two of Quickload film.<br>

- If you're forty or older you're going to need a pair of reading glasses and a flashlight in order to be able to read/set the shutter and aperture. LF shutters are designed for use by the young and the visually flawless.<br>

- Instructions on how to use a view camera (search the web, consider a class)<br>

- A small light box for viewing chromes<br>

- Development materials (optional - better to use a lab at least the first few times to make sure that everything is working properly)<br>

- A strong, solid tripod.<br>

- A tripod head for the tripod that attaches to your camera with a bolt or (optional) a tripod head with a quick release system and a QR plate that will fit your camera.<br>

- A way to carry your camera, lenses, and other equipment (it doesn't have to all fit in the same huge bag).<br>

- Patience, a positive attitude, and a willingness to learn from your mistakes. Because you WILL make mistakes.</p>

 

[gwebster]

<p>Thank you everybody for the generous amounts of information you have shared. I purchased and read large chunks of Steve Simmons' book "Using The View Camera" and this has also helped me a great deal. A few follower questions if nobody minds ...<br>

How do you send your 4x5 sheets to the lab without exposing them to the light? I assume that you don't send them in the film holder and that you must have to take them out in a light bag and put them into something else. If so, what is the "something else"?<br>

What lens boards are compatible with the Tachihara ? I don't seem to be able to find this information anywhere.<br>

What backs do I need for regular film I load myself and for QuickLoads. It seems that the QuickLoad backs are different from the regular ones. Will the Tachihara work with all 4x5 backs?<br>

I like to develop my own 35mm even though I don't have a darkroom (I use a light bag, Patterson tanks and then scan). For somebody like me who is relatively experienced developing film, but new to LF, what is the best way to develop 4x5 (without a darkroom)? I obviously like to save money where possible, but I care more about consistent results than cost since I figure that the time and effort that goes into each exposure makes a similar degree of care/cost worthwhile in the developing. What is the most consistent method for even, predictable development with a minimum of risk for dust, scratches etc.? I will probably use a lab in the beginning as Dan advises and for all my E6, but it seems from what I'm hearing, that it definitely is worth developing your own 4x5 B&W at home. Is this the case?<br>

Again - many thanks for the generosity of everybody on this forum.<br>

Gordon</p>

 

[paul_kent2]

<p>Hi Gordon<br /> <br /> To send film to the lab you need to unload your film holders and put them in a lightproof box like the one unexposed film ships in. These cardboard boxes are basically three overlapping "lids" that when put together are completely lightproof. There is an illustrated guide by Paul Butzi that I recommend http://www.butzi.net/articles/filmload.htm<br /> <br /> You can get an empty box from any lab - they will be glad for the business. Since all this loading and unloading of film takes time, the Fuji quickload system might become attractive to you. Paul Butzi's site has other articles including one on the different film holders. When traveling I tend to use quickload but closer to the office I use film holders. You can get quite fast at loading and unloading the holders in a changing bag or darkened bathroom, but it is definitely a pain at the end of a long work day.<br /> <br /> The Tachihara takes Linhof Technika compatible boards. Any generic clone board will do, just make sure it has the right size hole for the shutter in your lens. A starter 150mm lens is probably in a size 0 shutter, but do check.<br /> <br /> I use a color lab for most of my work, so can't really advise on the best home developing method. I think a big issue to think through is how much time you want to spend working with the film yourself. You can gain control and save money doing all the B&W yourself but it will cost you time.<br /> <br /> Good luck!<br /></p>

[wmwhee]

<p>I use a tachi 4x5 camera, 150mm lens, and 90mm lens, all purchased as used equipment. I process b&w film in a unicolor drum, two sheets at a time, on a beseler motor base. Works great for me.</p>

[gwebster]

<p>Can I use a Fuji QuickLoad film holder on the Tachihara?<br>

Is film flatness really not as good as with conventional holders?<br>

Gordon</p>

 

[paul_kent2]

<p>Yes you can use a QL holder on a Tachihara.</p>

<p>I think film flatness issues are mostly found on the internet. I've never had a shot obviously damaged by flatness problems. Perhaps I've lost a little resolution here and there, but it really is minor.</p>

 

[dan_south]

<p>Film flatness probably isn't much of an issue with 4x5 holders, whether conventional or Quickload. It's a problem with larger formats.</p>

<p>The Quickload holder is manufactured by Fujifilm. The current price at B&H is about $135 US.</p>

<p>There are many brands of traditional 4x5 holders, some of them even made from wood. I've used metal/plastic holders from Fidelity and Toyo with excellent results.</p>

<p>Just keep some empty film boxes around for dropping your film off at the lab. Be sure to close the box properly (the same way that it opens when it's brand new). Each lid's opening should face the opposite direction of the previous lid. Be sure to secure the lid(s) with a few rubber bands at all times. If that box comes open even for a split-second, your fill will be ruined. And don't forget to label the box so you know what's inside, what type of film, how many sheets. Office supply stores carry "extra-sticky" post-it notes that are ideal for this purpose.</p>

<p>Even if you use a changing bag, avoid handling film in direct sunlight (i.e. coming in through a window). Set yourself up in the shadowy part of the room/vehicle. Don't try to load/unload too many pieces at the same time. Your hands will start to sweat after several minutes in a changing bag. Never pull your arms out of a changing bag until all film is securely sealed in boxes and/or holders.</p>

<p>Never mix print film and slide film in one box. Never mix normally exposed film with film that must be pushed or pulled in one box. Never mix B&W and color film in one box. Simplify and LABEL EVERYTHING. Don't trust your memory.</p>