JOBO CPE-2 / CPA-2 / CPP-2

[abiggs]

Ok, this is a tought one. I idenitifed my source of frustration, which is my lack of counter space, and my anal retentive nature in development - I want consistent, reproducible results.

 

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So, I am looking at the sub-$2,000 JOBO units.

 

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The marketing blah blah blah on Jobo's web site tells me very little. What are most people using out there for developing 4x5 negs only? Which drum unit? This gets kind of confusing, since I have yet to see one of these fine units in person.

 

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I noticed that the CPE-2 is going for $575 on B&H, and there is a $200 rebate, which I could apply toward a lift. So, for something like $625, I would have a decent system. What is the major benefit to going to the CPA / CPP systems? I don't have a need to do large amounts of negs at one time, but I would like as much automation as possible, given that my space is limited, and my only water flow would come from a faucet in the kitchen or bathroom.

[pete_andrews]

Mechanised drum systems are complete overkill for a few B&W negs,

IMHO. Have a look at the 'Combiplan' tank. By the time you've loaded a

drum, and tempered its water bath, you could be on the washing stage

with a simple tank system. I use a 'Dallan' SS tank, but they're no

longer available. The Combiplan is the nearest modern equivalent, and

in any case, takes much less processing solution than the Dallan. If

space is an issue, the footprint is about 1/8th that of a drum unit.

If you don't also have running water and drainage to hand, then I

can't see how a drum unit will help.

[bill_nagel]

I have the CPA unit and I think it's the greatest thing since sliced

bread. You have excellent control over solution temperature which

allows me to dable with chromes. It eliminates fumbling around in

the dark. It eliminates staring at the timer every 30 sec. for

agitation intervals. It just makes the whole process of developing

negatives easier. The CPA/CPP units allow the use of the Expert

drums (CPE does not), I believe the 3010 can handle 10 sheets of 4X5

film at one time. The Expert drums are definitely the way to go for

sheet film in my opinion. The CPP unit allows cooling of the water

bath if the temperature is too high, but that can also be

accomplished with the CPA by inserting frozen water containers in the

water bath.

[harry_pluta3]

I have a CPE-2 and do my own 4x5 and 35mm B&W, and 4x5 E6 processing

in it. I then scan my negatives and print digitally. I love the

CPE, the only problem I had early on was keeping the temperatures

even since the CPE does not have a circulating pump in it. I fixed

that by buying a $10.00 submersable aquarium pump. I can set up the

Jobo, shoot my film, soup it, and have chromes to look at an hour

later, beats the heck out of driving downtown and dropping my film

off! My other suggestion is to purchase a plastic clothes hanging

bag, the square type that hang in the closet. These make great

drying booths which will keep the dust off of your negatives as they

dry.

 

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Hope this helps,

[michael_kadillak3]

I decided on the CPP2 for one fundamental reason - consistency. When

you are trying to use the zone system to its optimal, I feel that

eliminating as many variables as possible (temp and agitation)

improve the results as much as practical. It all spells confidence

with a big C. However, saying that the JOBO is not the system for

highly dilute developers and extended development times. Sexton is a

JOBO user and has a good write up in this website.

 

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Many feel that trays and other tank systems work great for them and

that is fine. You have to determine what works for you. It saves

space and I like the automation. I also wash the negs in the drums.

Best darkroom decision I ever made.

[abiggs]

Thanks for the responses so far. You have all brought up good a good

point. Yes, I do spend a considerable amount on E-6 processing, and I

would love to do them at home, if possible. Even if I splurged on the

CPP-2, is this just crazy?

 

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With B&W development, I am trying to solve a space issue, a

consistency issue, and a pain-in-the-butt issue. Looks like I could

add an entire process (E-6) as well. Wow, that would save me a load

of cash in the long run.

 

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So, a CPA-2 or CPP-2 would allow me the use of their professional

drums. I assume the 3000 series. Other than number of negatives you

can process at one time, what is the benefit? Less chemistry? Less

likelihood of streaks? Just curious.

[michael_kadillak3]

I have never had a problem with streaks on any negatives processed

with the JOBO drums. However, I use a small amount more chemistry

than suggested just to be safe. I feel that the drums are probably

the most innovative design we have seen in some time. Actually allows

a water jacket internally and uses a reasonable amount of chemistry.

 

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Do these use less chemistry than other systems? Probably not. Many I

know to me at least, seem to run more film than they should through

their tanks and trays whereas I use them one shot. The relationship

between sq inches of film and development chemistry should be

consistent and JOBO has done a considerable amount of testing to

ascertain safe recommendations. I have never had a problem with 4x5,

5x7 and 8x10 over the last three years and I use different drums for

each. You can easily justify the cost of a processing unit by doing

the math based upon farming out all of your processing (B&W and

color). The lift is useless with the larger format drums and you will

quickly develop the technique to raise the lift system with your

fingers and let the gears engage at the pause for rotation.

 

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Another very important variable I look for no matter what I am

considering to purchase - customer support. Call JOBO and chat with a

representative and ask them some of your questions. Should you ever

have a problem, it is nice to know that they will be there for you.

[jay_wolfe]

While I use a Jobo CPP, if you're just getting started in LF and not

sure you want to continue, tray development doesn't take that much

space for 4x5. The Jobo takes about 40" of counter space. Using

8x10 trays, you're talking about the same geography.

 

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If you do decide to buy a Jobo, try to find a good used one. I've

seen a number for sale that are in like-new condition. The primary

thing to wear out on these is the motor, especially if there

overdriven with too heavy a load of chemicals. These are frequently

on eBay, as well as in used photo stores and camera shows.

 

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Good luck.

[scott_jones4]

I use the JOBO CPP-2 for B&W 4x5 negs and all my printing. I am very

happy with it. I highly suggest the extra expense for the CPP-2

because of the cold water solenoid. My darkroom often goes well above

68 degrees and the machine automatically lets in cold tap water to

adjust. Much nicer than ice bricks in the water which will then keep

the heater constantly running. By the way these machines average 500

watts power consumption which is a lot! You do not have to have

special plumbing. I have just run a garden hose to the back of the

machine for this purpose. I have a PVC small pipe that runs through

the wall of my space to bring the water in. When I am done, I just put

the hose away...

 

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Comments on service support are true; it is great. If you use Tri-X

and HC110 you need to talk to the service guys about the 3010 drum

because there is a slight manufacturing defect in the grooves that

makes this particular film only have some slight marks of non removed

anti-halation coating at one end of the negative. They are very small.

They have told me that this is being corrected, but current stock has

to be sold off. All other films seem to be OK.

 

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Comments about dilute developers are correct. My HC110 has to be very

diluted to get all my zone system numbers correct on testing and

therefore because of the one liter limit on fluid in the 3010 drum and

because of capacity limitations, I can only develop 4 4x5 negs at a

time despite there being slots for 10 negs in the tank. All in all I

am happy especially with being able to work in the light and no

smelling fumes at all. My wife who has the good nose in the family

says that it is odorless...

 

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Email me if any other questions.

 

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Scott

[david_willis]

I've been tempted to pick up a used CPE-2 at my local shop every time

they have them, but I haven't done it yet. I can't justify the more

expensive processors. However, I do use a Jobo 4x5 tank and reel and

use it to develop manually. It's great. I find it to be reproducible

and easy. The fact that it produces such good results manually makes

me want to try one of the processors.

 

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Dave

[wil_hinds]

There is no simpler and consistent way to process film and paper than

the Jobo systems.I got mine on Ebay and I love it.IF you are only

doing a few negatives at a time then the CPE2 Plus with lift is the

way to go.Just make sure you get a "Plus" model as it has a beefier

motor.

 

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I have processed 35mm, 120 and 4x5 film, color and B/W and have made

B/W and color prints up to 16x20, with my unit and it's fast, easy

and repeatble. No Fumes and working with the lights on are also a

major plus.

[mark_lindsey]

"There is no simpler and consistent way to process film and paper than

the Jobo systems"

 

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you've got to be kidding

[scott_jones4]

We JOBO users are VERY serious; Can't ya tell? :)

[wil_hinds]

Hi Mark ,

I'm very serious. I can process my film, do some laundry, play a few

licks on one of my basses,or play with my one year old baby while

processing 4x5 E6. What else can you do while processing? Ever drop

sheet film in the dark?

Really the Jobo is " about" as easy as it gets.

[dk_thompson]

Well there's always a Model 5 Wing Lynch, a 4, or a 4E...an ATL Jobo

unit....or how about sending the film out to the lab or having your

assistant run it through a deep tank?

[dk_thompson]

Almost forgot, for prints: Ilford 2150 processor, or maybe an Omnipro

for both cibas & b&w. An automatic processor is nice because you just

load the film, push the button & walk away...the chem is always up to

temperature, and with gallons of E6 chem. in the tanks, it's not

like you're mixing small amounts for every session... Or

with the 2150, you get 2 weeks, or 1500 8x10s whichever comes first.

59 sec. dry to dry, with an infrared dryer....of course, this is all

alot more $$$$$ than a Jobo...you talk about how fast it is to run E6

on a Jobo, but how much time do you spend mixing chemistry, waiting

for it to warm up, and cleaning out the tubes after each run?

[bruce_e._rathbun]

I have a question for Michael. Yoou stated that the lift was not an

item that was needed. I am looking to purchase a CPA-2 for both

4x5 and 5x7 B/W negs. I get the idea that Jobo seems to think

that the lift is a must. Is this a marketing thing?

[markus_glueck]

For the 3000 Series Drums you need (as statet by a Jobo tech) a lift,

because of the design of the drums. You also need a pump to open them

when once closed. With the 2500 series some people get uneven negs or

higher density at the edges.

[scott_jones4]

Hi Bruce,

 

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As far as I am concerned, I can't imagine using my CPP-2 without the

lift. It makes it easy to get the chemicals in and out of the tubes

without getting wet/messy. Very smooth operation without having to

concentrate on getting the tube off the machine, dump and fill, and

then getting it back on with the magnet just right. And as has already

been mentioned, you have to have it with the 3000 series tanks. Do

look at JOBO's web site. They are usually running specials which get

you something free if you buy a new processor. I got my lift for free.

This is definitely not a marketing ploy; the device is well engineered

and very handy and makes the processing smoother and quicker.

 

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Scott

[steve_wiley]

Has anyone ever had a problem with handle on the Lift? It

seems pretty flimsy.

[alpshiker]

Steve, mine broke. But I was using a big drum for 40x50 prints. The handle was easy to replace by a section of

PVC tube for electrical wiring and it was strong enough to keep for years then.

[scott_jones4]

Yes the handle is somewhat delicate. It fits on the lift a little

loosely, but if you don't "crank" on it, it shouldn't be any problem.

I give mine a slight twist after slipping it on and this seems to make

it feel a little tighter... The handle has not affected the

performance or ease of using the machine at all.

 

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Scott